Installing 240V Service To Your Shop - Price Breakdowns...

[DarkBlack]

Please show me a quote where I said you should bond neutral to ground at a sub panel. Please.

:confused2: Where do I say you did?

 

[MossRoad]

:confused2: Where do I say you did?

In post #64.

 

[DarkBlack]

I just re-read it. I think you are mis-understanding the point I made.

 

[GPintheMitten]

Still several things wrong here.

There is more than one wire being run through a box connector. There is an open knock out on the top of the panel. The box is hanging on one screw. 30 amp is too light for the average welder. Any serious home welder requires a 50 amp plug, cable and breaker. The supply cable to that pony panel is several steps undersized being #12 or #10 by the looks of it. Should be #6 or #4 depending on the wire insulation temperature rating. To your credit it appears that the neutral to ground bond screw has at least been backed out. Cables are supposed to be supported within in 6" of the box instead of hanging free air.

Sorry Bud but your wiring job is sub standard, illegal and dangerous to life, limb and property.

Yes, he should fix that but at least it is fixable. The 10 awg wire feeding the panel is lighter than I would use but ok if fed from a 30 amp breaker. I would also recommend protecting the feeder wire and 30 amp wire for the welder with conduit or other phydical protection.

Adequacy of the welder circuit depends on the specific welder.

 

[MossRoad]

I just re-read it. I think you are mis-understanding the point I made.

And what point would that be?

 

[MossRoad]

My ac/dc arc welder calls for a 30 amp breaker, so that's what I installed.

 

[aczlan]

Still several things wrong here.
There is more than one wire being run through a box connector.

And? That is allowable. See: http://www.aimedia.co/media/spec-sheets/NM94.pdf and http://www.aifittings.com/reference/files/pdf/charts/nm-cable-ranges.pdf for a fitting that specifically allows it and the manufacturers list of all the possible wire combinations for their box connectors.
Another: http://www.tnb.com/ps/fulltilt/index.cgi?a=tiff2pdf&f=shared/inst/210859.tif
Yet another company who specifically lists thier connectors as being fine with more than one wire: http://www.sigmaelectric.com/web/assets/pdf/cf_nm_se_cable.pdf

There is an open knock out on the top of the panel.

Agreed.

The box is hanging on one screw.

Are you sure? Looks to me like the 2nd screw is mostly hidden by the 12/2 in the top left and there appears to be a 3rd screw in the bottom right quadrant (below the 30 amp breaker but above and between the supply cable and the 10/3 for the welder).

30 amp is too light for the average welder. Any serious home welder requires a 50 amp plug, cable and breaker. The supply cable to that pony panel is several steps undersized being #12 or #10 by the looks of it. Should be #6 or #4 depending on the wire insulation temperature rating.

If he has #10 wire (which it appears that he has) and a 30 amp breaker, what is the problem? Yes, it would be undersized for a larger welder, but if he only wants 30 amps out there, that is his business.

Cables are supposed to be supported within in 6" of the box instead of hanging free air.

Agreed, but that can be fixed with a half dozen staples.

So, he needs a knockout cover for the top and a half dozen staples for the wires... Not exactly "sub standard, illegal and dangerous to life, limb and property"

Aaron Z

 

[DarkBlack]

Its tied at the service and isolated everywhere else so that there's only one return path back to the service. Its the multiple paths that cause people to get electrocuted. They think something is off, and it is not, because the ground is still carrying current.

Sorry, again, not trying to be mean, but most of that is really not accurate....technically.... That was my point...

 

[buickanddeere]

W

Amuse me. Here's a test. Give me scenario of a fatal situation caused directly by the sub's N being tied to gnd.
I know It's not code, so you can skip that part.

It is code. Tingle voltage that shocks livestock to make them jumpy is the least. There have been occasions when a full 120,277 or 347 has been applied to chassis.
I don't see any more than one screw.
Our provincial code book does not allow multiple cables through one connector.

I'm sorry that you and a couple of others do not grasp the theory and practical.
How is it you are so much smarter than electrical engineers, utility linesmen, qualified electricians and code inspectors???
How are they all wrong and you are right ? A list of your electrical credentials please.

 

[Sodo]

Still several things wrong here.

There is more than one wire being run through a box connector. There is an open knock out on the top of the panel. The box is hanging on one screw. 30 amp is too light for the average welder. Any serious home welder requires a 50 amp plug, cable and breaker. The supply cable to that pony panel is several steps undersized being #12 or #10 by the looks of it. Should be #6 or #4 depending on the wire insulation temperature rating. To your credit it appears that the neutral to ground bond screw has at least been backed out. Cables are supposed to be supported within in 6" of the box instead of hanging free air.

Sorry Bud but your wiring job is sub standard, illegal and dangerous to life, limb and property.

Any serious home welder requires a 50 amp plug, cable and breaker.

Box is hanging on one screw

:thumbsup: Good ones! Theory and practical ya sure ya betcha!

The neutral bar is floating & there is no ground bond screw. Was great to get TBN help great when members have success as a goal. Since the pic, added another clamp connector, added a conduit over the feed line - all buttoned up in a half a day.