Heating Ohio pole barn

Solar07 · Nov 19, 2016

Hello all,

Last year I decided to heat my pole barn here in the winter months of Ohio. It's a 40x60 barn however I'm heating a 40x40 section as the 20 section is walled and doomed off for tractor and truck.

Anyway, thru a friends recommendation I purchased a hot blast 1500 on sale for 900 bucks at rural king. It has two blowers so We ran some duct work off it up ward and then pointed em down in a couple sections of the barn. Long story short it is not working well. I have only insulated the roof panels at this stage and I know I need to finish the walls which will help a lot but I still don't know that this system was the right route. It just eats wood and doesn't heatake much.

Anyone else heating with a hotblast as a primary source in barns? Any mods I should look into or do I need to look into a completely different stove? I can take pics if needed to tell the story.

Thanks all

LD1 · Nov 19, 2016

The furnace is not your issue. The lack of insulation is.

You say you insulated the roof panels.....with what? R-value?

I heated a 30 x 30 x 9' ceiling polebarn....R13 walls and R19 blown in ceiling......kept it nice and toasty with a single barrel stove.

Current shop is a 40x40 with 14' ceilings. R19 walls and R30+ (blow in) in the ceiling. I have a brunco 120 which is similar in size to the hot-blast 1500 I believe. Has a single blower. Where the air comes out the top, its not tied to any duct work, just blows across the shop with a single pieces of duct work that changes the direction of air from blowing up, to blowing horizontal. This shop also has a 18w x 12h hole on the front that is plugged with an insulated garage door. As well as 4 36" x 48" windows.

In the middle of the coldest spell of winter, I can have you working in your underwear if I wanted.

Insulate the walls, get at least R30 in the ceiling, then enjoy the heat.

Rustyiron · Nov 19, 2016

What LD1 said!
Insulate (a lot) first !

Deere Dude · Nov 19, 2016

I used a 110,000 btu torpedo heater in my 36x54 uninsulated pole shed in Wisconsin when I HAD to do something in the winter in the pole shed. I had to stand 10 feet away from it to feel anything to speak of. It would maybe raise the temp in the building from 20 degrees to 22 degrees after an hour or two. Of course maybe it was just getting warmer outside.

I know it is a lot of work but insulation is the only thing that will help.

LD1 · Nov 19, 2016

Solar07 said:
Hello all,

Just to give you a crude idea.....

See what the weather has done in the last 24 hours. It made it to ~65 degrees where I live yesterday. Woke up this morning to ~32-35 degrees and hasnt come up at all today.

So needless to say when I was working at the shop yesterday had all the doors open and a nice 65 degrees in there.

With no heat going....what is the temp of your shop today? being 32 and windy (might be a little warmer where you are as I am about 30 miles north), I am betting your shop, with no wall insulation, would be in the 35 degree ballpark.

I havent been at my shop all day. Just went down there to fetch something......nice 58*.

Get some insulation and you will not need to burn near as much wood, as you will retain heat. IT also makes it alot cooler in the summer.

Solar07 · Nov 19, 2016

LD1 said:
Just to give you a crude idea.....

See what the weather has done in the last 24 hours. It made it to ~65 degrees where I live yesterday. Woke up this morning to ~32-35 degrees and hasnt come up at all today.

So needless to say when I was working at the shop yesterday had all the doors open and a nice 65 degrees in there.

With no heat going....what is the temp of your shop today? being 32 and windy (might be a little warmer where you are as I am about 30 miles north), I am betting your shop, with no wall insulation, would be in the 35 degree ballpark.

I havent been at my shop all day. Just went down there to fetch something......nice 58*.

Get some insulation and you will not need to burn near as much wood, as you will retain heat. IT also makes it alot cooler in the summer.

You nailed it. Thats about what it was today. I don't currently have a ceiling. The roof panels are laying on 4x6 sheets of foam board. My garage doors are insulated. I just added those. Any chance you could tell.me how and what you insulated your walls and ceiling and how you did your ceiling? Pics would be great but I dont want to ask too much. I had a company come quote me to add a ceiling and insulate the walls and they wanted 13k. I said I can build another **** barn for that. Albeit another cold one ha.

Thanks for you replies

Deere Dude · Nov 19, 2016

Solar07 said:
come quote me to add a ceiling and insulate the walls and they wanted 13k. I said I can build another **** barn for that. Albeit another cold one ha.

Thanks for you replies

That's funny.:laughing::laughing:

LD1 · Nov 19, 2016

Are your trusses 4' centers?

I used metal "liner" panel for the ceiling. It's the same as the painted siding and roofing on most pole barns. Just don't have quite as good paint,and no warranty. But it's cheaper. Bout 50 cents a sq ft. So a 40x40 should run you about $800 in material for ceiling.

On top of that is 100 bags of blow in insulation. The cellulose stuff that Menards sells and used their blower. 100 bags puts it 12" thick give or take. And is about $6 a bag.

So, about $1400 covers the ceiling.

The walls, I used r-19 Kraft faced batts/rolls. And covered with OSB for the walls and painted. And IIRC, wall insulation. For r19 was somewhere around 30 cents a sq ft. And I needed about 1800 sq ft. So about $600 there. And osb being about $8 a sheet, thats 25 cents a sq ft. So another $500-$600 to cover the walls.

So....$1200 for walls, and $1400 ceiling.

You may have to add some lumber to the walls for "studs" to attach insulation and sheathing to. I didn't build "pole barn" style. Rather block foundation and studs.

I have a thread detailing the build, I'll see if I can find it for you

LD1 · Nov 19, 2016

Here
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/rural-living/345632-pictures-my-garage-build.html#post4251511

Solar07 · Nov 19, 2016

LD1 said:
Are your trusses 4' centers?

I used metal "liner" panel for the ceiling. It's the same as the painted siding and roofing on most pole barns. Just don't have quite as good paint,and no warranty. But it's cheaper. Bout 50 cents a sq ft. So a 40x40 should run you about $800 in material for ceiling.

On top of that is 100 bags of blow in insulation. The cellulose stuff that Menards sells and used their blower. 100 bags puts it 12" thick give or take. And is about $6 a bag.

So, about $1400 covers the ceiling.

The walls, I used r-19 Kraft faced batts/rolls. And covered with OSB for the walls and painted. And IIRC, wall insulation. For r19 was somewhere around 30 cents a sq ft. And I needed about 1800 sq ft. So about $600 there. And osb being about $8 a sheet, thats 25 cents a sq ft. So another $500-$600 to cover the walls.

So....$1200 for walls, and $1400 ceiling.

You may have to add some lumber to the walls for "studs" to attach insulation and sheathing to. I didn't build "pole barn" style. Rather block foundation and studs.

I have a thread detailing the build, I'll see if I can find it for you

Yea they are 4' on centers...

Great info, thank you. On the Bats, did you tape it, or just staple it overlapping? And what did you mean by IIRC the walls, did you do that on top of the Bats?

I see you are in central ohio, I'm just below Columbus in London Ohio where it nears Grove city. Where abouts are you? Im Actually originally from South of Athens in albany.

LD1 · Nov 19, 2016

IIRC is internet short hand for if I recall correctly.

It was...."if I recall correctly, for wall insulation........30 cents a sq ft.

Walls are just stapled. No tape.

I live bout 30-40 miles north of Columbus. Southern part of Morrow county.

Solar07 · Nov 19, 2016

Oh got ya. Not too far at all. Nice country up that way. I need to just enlist your services for a fee.

LD1 · Nov 20, 2016

Not that I wouldn't be willing, but it's not something that I do for hire. Just build my own buildings is all. I'd shop a few contractors and see if you cannot come up with something a little more reasonable. Any amish around you?

KennyG · Nov 20, 2016

LD1 has a good approach and similar to what I did. I would add that it's a good idea to put plastic under the metal on the ceiling as a vapor barrier.

Solar07 · Nov 20, 2016

KennyG said:
LD1 has a good approach and similar to what I did. I would add that it's a good idea to put plastic under the metal on the ceiling as a vapor barrier.

When we put the new roof panels in, the roof panels now lay on top of the foam boards. So it's the purlins, foam board, heritage metal.

Something like this...

Shop Expanded Polystyrene Foam Board Insulation (Common: 1-in x 4-ft x 8-ft; Actual: .937-in x 3.875-ft x 7.875-ft) at Lowes.com

You think I need a vapor barrier under the Purlins then too?

KennyG · Nov 20, 2016

Solar07 said:
You think I need a vapor barrier under the Purlins then too?

I was always told a vapor barrier needed to go behind the inside finished surface, isolating the insulation from the interior space. So, looking up at the ceiling you would have the metal liner panels, vapor barrier, then the truss bottom chords filled with insulation. If I understand, you have an old roof, purlins, and then foam board and new roof. I wouldn't have done it this way, but until you have a ceiling, most of your heat will end up in the rafters. And the R value of that expanded polystyrene is only 3 or 4, a fraction of what you would like to see in a ceiling.

coffeeman · Nov 20, 2016

Hi all, i have always thought about building garage. I have 5 shallow gas wells. Heat & insulation no problem as gas
is free. Of course i'd want to be environmentally conscious and use insulation. Problem, I don't need more garage space.
Cheers....Coffeeman

Rustyiron · Nov 20, 2016

Solar07 said:
When we put the new roof panels in, the roof panels now lay on top of the foam boards. So it's the purlins, foam board, heritage metal.

You think I need a vapor barrier under the Purlins then too?

Insulation/vapor has really become a science. It's my understanding that in my climate, 2' of foam is enough for the dew point to be inside the foam and the foam is the vapor barrier. I believe that the vapor barrier is mostly an issue for f/g insulated buildings, but I do wonder if your 1" of foam is enough. If you added a couple of inches under the purlins and sealed the edges that would do the trick.
There are places that sell used foam from flat roof commercial building re-roofing that are very cheap. IF you can find some locally, do your whole building with it.

Solar07 · Nov 20, 2016

Here are some pics of what I'm working withard. Looking up, it's perlins, foam board taped tohether, then metal roofing. Foam on both sides of board. Attached are some pics of the walls as well. Not sure why the corners have those long 2x4s.