Electrical question

   / Electrical question
  • Thread Starter
#21  
But anyways, I picked up 10 gauge THHN this morning since that's what code requires.
 
   / Electrical question #22  
So on a Y, the centre is neutral? And at 600, any outer point to neutral is 347?

I built a 600 rotary converter wired in Delta and wondered how to get a ground reference?
 
   / Electrical question #23  
208V is most always a 3 phase system. 208V can be measured between phases A&B, B&C, and A&C. This is usually made when the transformer's (3) secondary coils (which each generate 120V across them) are connected in a "Y" (wye) fashion, the common center point of the Y (wye) is the "neutral" (which is usually grounded to earth; it doesn't have to be but that's another subject).
So now you have 3 phases, with each phase 120V to neutral (or ground), but with 208V between each phase.
Why do (3) 120V transformer coils connected this way result in 208V between each phase? That's a bit more complicated.

Note that the relationship of 208 to 120 is 1.73 (which is the square root of 3)

The voltage sine wave being induced on each coil is 120 degrees out of phase from the voltage sine wave on the other 2 coils. (+120, 0, -120)

(They're 120 degrees separated because back at the generator, 360 degrees of rotation was divided into developing "3 phases", 120 degrees apart from each other (I digress, don't be distracted)

There's a lot of mathematical ways to prove that vectors separated by 120 degrees of rotation have a "square root of 3" (1.73) relationship. (120/208, 277/480V, 347/600V)


I think it's easiest to see how like this:
Look at the letter "Y", where each "leg" of the "Y" is rotated 120 degrees from the other. Imagine the length of each of the 3 "legs" are 120 units (volts, or inches, miles, whatever). Now measure the straight line distance between the end of one "leg" to the end of another. This distance is 208. Thus you can "see" how (3) 120 units have a difference of 208 units between them when 120 degrees apart. Example: a 120/208V, 3 phase system. (120 units to the center (neutral), 208 units between each leg (phase)).



A 347/600V system is a similar 3 phase (grounded wye) system. (600 volts between phases, 347V from each phase to neutral). 277/480V systems is common in U.S. (when there's a neutral).
Note "square root 3" relationship.
 
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   / Electrical question #25  
But anyways, I picked up 10 gauge THHN this morning since that's what code requires.

No idea if thats right or wrong. You never gave any detail as to what you were working, load requirements, etc. So if you are looking for someone to verify you are doing things correctly......sorry, you are on your own.

If code requires 10 gauge and you are certain you are right (since without details we have no idea), what was the purpose of this thread?
 
   / Electrical question #26  
Sorry about derailing your thread.

In a sense, everything is thermally protected. If it gets too hot, it will melt, opening the circuit. Any resulting fire, is a mere side effect.
 
   / Electrical question #27  
So on a Y, the centre is neutral? And at 600, any outer point to neutral is 347?

I built a 600 rotary converter wired in Delta and wondered how to get a ground reference?



Could do a corner grounded Delta but they are a weird configuration and not the first choice .
Center of the Wye where the neutral is connected has a bond to earth. Contrary to common belief the bond is only to hold the Center Wye point and the neutral to a close to earth potential as possible . No other neutral to earth bonds anywhere else or neutral current will flow in the ground system . That is undesirable and possibly destructive .
 
   / Electrical question #28  
Thermally protected by what?

Fla on the motor is 40.0 amp. Motor thermals are set at 115%. The 50amp Wiring can稚 be over heated as it is thermally protected . The breaker is only there to provide short circuit protection and isolation.
I copied those numbers straight out of Table D16 from the 2012 code book.
 
   / Electrical question #29  
Sorry about derailing your thread.

In a sense, everything is thermally protected. If it gets too hot, it will melt, opening the circuit. Any resulting fire, is a mere side effect.

I am getting a notion that the difference between short circuit protection and thermal protection is not well understood by most members here.
I would assume that googling Canadian electrical code and table D16 may show the chart. A picture is worth a thousand words .
 
   / Electrical question #30  
It's a real problem on generators, mostly portable. Breakers are chosen for temporary motor start loads and generally made as 10, 15, 20 amp and so forth. The next highest rating being chosen. So people keep loading up the sets, thinking they are protected and fry the windings.

I have more question about three phase, but won't ask them here. Thanks.
 

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