How can this be? Common sense hauling... Fed approved??? DOT Exemption!

[Jcoon]

You've gotten into the discussion of "pintle hooks used as fifth wheels". The last inspector I brought this up with told me that state law, Oregon, mirrors federal law. He said, you're going to love this, that the feds don't have a definition of what a fifth wheel is yet. They were expecting it to take the feds about five years to define what a fifth wheel is. I don't know if this has been resolved.
The pintle hooks that I have bought were to PULL either a 40,000# or a 60,000# pull trailer. Pintle hooks are designed for pulling not carrying. People do it, trailer makers design equipment trailers for crazy tongue weights, but some day it will probably be disallowed and we will be back to tractors with fifth wheels or quick change dump trucks. I've seen broken pintle hooks and surpriseingly they are hollow.

NY also has adopted all federal regs in 49 CFR through the 820 regs.

I’ll have to look in my book and see if they “define” a fifth wheel, they have plenty of pics in the OOS book on fifth wheels, I would say the feds know what a fifth wheel is. It’s pretty hard to confuse it with any other hitching mechanism.

 

[Btown]

Tounge weight is measured with the trailer detached.

DOT will not detach it. They care more about overloaded axle ratings than tongue weight. But yes tongue weight is measured detached.

 

[aczlan]

There doesn't have to be. Better read it more closely. The law states class A is a combo over 26k where the trailer is over 10k. It states a class B is where the power unit is over 26k with no trailer or a trailer less than 10k. It then calls class C by definition vehicles that don't fit Class A or class C definitions. If your truck is exactly 26k and your trailer is exactly 10k you are not class A because your trailer is not OVER 10k, and you are not class B because your power unit is not OVER 26k.

Read guidance question number 6 Regulations Section | Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration

You would be over in NY, here the limits are GCWR over 26k with a trailer GVWR over 10k.

Aaron Z

 

[Jcoon]

26,000lb unit 1 and 10,00lb unit 2 is class D.

26,001lb unit 1 and 10,001lb unit 2 is class A.

12,000lb unit 1 and 14,001lb unit 2 is class A.

 

[bdog]

DOT will not detach it. They care more about overloaded axle ratings than tongue weight. But yes tongue weight is measured detached.

Jcoon is DOT and he said he detaches it to measure tongue weight

 

[bdog]

You would be over in NY, here the limits are GCWR over 26k with a trailer GVWR over 10k.

Aaron Z

You didn't read what I wrote. GCWR is over 26k but trailer is not over 10K.

 

[QRTRHRS]

DOT will not detach it. They care more about overloaded axle ratings than tongue weight. But yes tongue weight is measured detached.

True, DOT will not detach it, the operator will be asked to do so. This is how it may go down, you are asked to pull onto portables or drive over a fixed scale. Your trailer registration states 10k yet the axle weight is perhaps close to or maybe even over it. The laws of physics being what they are, clearly indicate that said trailer alone is overweight.

If you don't agree or think that DOT cannot make you seperate a rig then I suggest we agree to disagree.

 

[George2615]

You didn't read what I wrote. GCWR is over 26k but trailer is not over 10K.

That would require a class B if commercial or if private use would not be a CDL but only a class D regular license.

 

[Jcoon]

Non commercial still has to have a CDL license if weights meet the requirements, unless there is a exemption like for RV.

As far as what bdog wrote, IT DEPENDS...

If unit 1 is 26,000, and unit 2 is 10,000, class D.

If unit 1 is 27,000, and unit 2 is 9,000, class B.

If unit 1 is 26,000, and unit 2 is 10,001, class A.

 

[ddbackhoe]

Non commercial still has to have a CDL license if weights meet the requirements, unless there is a exemption like for RV.

As far as what bdog wrote, IT DEPENDS...

If unit 1 is 26,000, and unit 2 is 10,000, class D.

If unit 1 is 27,000, and unit 2 is 9,000, class B.

If unit 1 is 26,000, and unit 2 is 10,001, class A.

No, everyone does not have to have a CDL. I've run into this on more than one occasion, with and without my horse trailer. This is part of the problem why I have been stopped for blowing off a scale, lectured for not having DOT numbers, ticketed for no medical card and HOS violations. DOT rules do not apply in every situation, even if the CVEU of NYS says so. You might very well be the guy who wrote me in Sept. 2017 for no medical card and HOS violation because of no log. That joker did not look at the back of my license (front says A, back says A - noncommercial) or listen when I kept repeating, I am NOT commercial. Did waste a bunch of my time roadside though.