Changing Hydraulic Filters w/o Changing Fluid

[Gordon Gould]

On my M5640 I have to change the hydraulic filters once between Hydraulic Oil changes. The filters are at the bottom of the sump so I have to drain the oil and then put it back in after the filters are changed. I back to the top of a bank and place my oil pan connected to a 10' pvc pipe down to my clean buckets. The system holds 10 1/2 gallons so I partially fill 3 buckets. I cut a hole in an old pan and used a standard shower drain for the pipe connection. When I'm done I use a rattle siphon hose to replace the oil I drained out. It leaves less than 1/2" in the bottom of the bucket. Every thing is easy to handle and no mess.







It is normal for newer Kubotas I guess but still disconcerting seeing this much crud on the filter magnets but it is way less this second change than it was the first filter change.





On a side note I have a gear drive transmission so I see no problem and have not had any issues using Rotella HD rather than Kubota Super UTD ?? even though I run my tractor all winter in below zero F weather.

gg

 

[wagne223]

Have you tried changing the filters without draining the sump?

I dont have an M series but the L series filters are also down low. When changing, I just have the new filter ready, loosen and drop the old filter and quickly install the new one. Less then a quart lost including what is in the old filters.

Some guys plug the vent and rig a shop vac to the fill hole and only loose a few drops.

Just curious if the M design is different then the L.

 

[Gordon Gould]

Have you tried changing the filters without draining the sump?

I dont have an M series but the L series filters are also down low. When changing, I just have the new filter ready, loosen and drop the old filter and quickly install the new one. Less then a quart lost including what is in the old filters.

Some guys plug the vent and rig a shop vac to the fill hole and only loose a few drops.

Just curious if the M design is different then the L.

Well I just followed the manual. And I do have a L3010 that I change the filter on the fly w/o draining but taking some measurements I see there are some big differences. The center of the filter on the L3010 is about 1 1/2" below the top of the oil in the sump (site window level) but the center of the M5640 filters are about 6" below the top of the oil in the sump so there is 4 times the head in the M5640 plus the M5640 has a much larger filter nipple than the L3010. It was worth looking at but not something I want to try especially with my system being so easy.

gg

 

[ruffdog]

Using the pcv pipes and gravity, it was looking like a maple syrup operation. At least you didn't have to cook down the oil before you put it back in the tractor!

 

[orezok]

You could try jacking up one side of the tractor until the fluid level is below or at a minimum above the filter and do the "quick change". In a static condition you can get the tractor to about 30 degrees without issue.

 

[Gordon Gould]

Using the pcv pipes and gravity, it was looking like a maple syrup operation. At least you didn't have to cook down the oil before you put it back in the tractor!

I never thought of it like that but you are probably right - buckets and pipes are in my genes.

gg

 

[Redlands Okie]

 

[bigtiller]

I like that odd shaped tin bucket, it looks homemade. Did you lay it out and break it?

 

[snymat68]

I like that odd shaped tin bucket, it looks homemade. Did you lay it out and break it?

It doesn't look broken. May have been bent with a BRAKE though. ;-)

 

[attract her]

GG #1

I'm not sure I'm getting a clear picture of your situation.

" I have to change the hydraulic filters once between Hydraulic Oil changes. " GG

So you're at it often enough for it to be routine?

" crud on the filter magnets but it is way less this second change than it was the first " GG

Not sure what's going on there.
Might some shavings from the factory have gotten into the fluid circuit, and not actually indicate accelerated machinery suicide in your rig?

No doubt large-size particles can do great harm to engine tight tolerances.
But finer particles are not risk free.
Our submarines use centrifuges to remove such particles, which otherwise can remain suspended in the fluid.

It's YOUR coin-toss. Save some cash by not changing both filter & fluid. Or lose a bundle on expensive repairs due to having changed one, but not both.

Something else to consider:
You are right of course that physical solid foreign material is a danger to your equipment. But fluids reaching their life expectancy (no matter what the book says) is also risky. The obvious example, such fluids can develop corrosives which can accelerate wear.

You know the risks. 'tup to you.

 

[Gordon Gould]

I like that odd shaped tin bucket, it looks homemade. Did you lay it out and break it?

Actually I found it in the woods Doesn't leak either. I guess someone either threw it away or used it doing some field maintenance and forgot it because he had more important things to worry about (been there).

gg

 

[Gordon Gould]

GG #1

I'm not sure I'm getting a clear picture of your situation.

So you're at it often enough for it to be routine?

Not sure what's going on there.
Might some shavings from the factory have gotten into the fluid circuit, and not actually indicate accelerated machinery suicide in your rig?

No doubt large-size particles can do great harm to engine tight tolerances.
But finer particles are not risk free.
Our submarines use centrifuges to remove such particles, which otherwise can remain suspended in the fluid.

It's YOUR coin-toss. Save some cash by not changing both filter & fluid. Or lose a bundle on expensive repairs due to having changed one, but not both.

Something else to consider:
You are right of course that physical solid foreign material is a danger to your equipment. But fluids reaching their life expectancy (no matter what the book says) is also risky. The obvious example, such fluids can develop corrosives which can accelerate wear.

You know the risks. 'tup to you.

I am not worried about the crud on the filter being a sign of imminent failure. However, if I saw that 20 years ago I would be shocked at the shabby quality. Old standards die hard I guess. Over the resent past there has been some discussion about Kubota not cleaning the drillings etc from there transmissions and I just offered those pictures as two more examples of what filters look like now-a-days while doing routine scheduled maintenance. Might keep some one unaware from becoming very upset about their new tractor.

gg

 

[finn1]

I would trust a n oil analysis by a reputable testing lab like Blackstone Labs more than what’s on the drain plug magnet.

Ferrous metal bits clinging to the magnet are likely machining dwarf not flushed in the cleaning process at the manufacturing plant.

Wear metals are microscopic, until catastrophic failure is imminent, or has already occurred.

I think most Diesel engine manufacturers eliminated the magnet on the plug. The magnet was scaring consumers.

 

[bmaverick]

On my M5640 I have to change the hydraulic filters ...

It is normal for newer Kubotas I guess but still disconcerting seeing this much crud on the filter magnets but it is way less this second change than it was the first filter change.

View attachment 610628

View attachment 610629

On a side note I have a gear drive transmission so I see no problem and have not had any issues using Rotella HD rather than Kubota Super UTD ?? even though I run my tractor all winter in below zero F weather.

gg

My Yanmar is a 1981. It too has very similar filters for the hydraulic system. I've pulled the filters and cleaned them. However, never have seen as much crud on them as yours shows. Almost 1/5th of that amount. Also, I re-used the fluid after filtering the fluid. The second time, I replaced the fluid. Still the filters were in good shape with little crud. Even the magnets only had a smooth gray slime of metallic deposits.

Your machine is a 2011 or newer. I'm a bit surprised at the amount of crud on the magnets! And the crud has a few metal fragments!

When changing the fluid, I learned to drain the fluid, have the filter out of the machine, fill the hydraulic system with diesel, work the tractor at low rpms, return and drain again. This will scrub out the metal fragments. Now, this can only be done when the loader and non-tractor hydraulic hose are connected. I've worked my machine at times on the hard side thinking, dang bet that wasn't good for the tractor! I'm amazed at how these good machines can take a few beatings. However, not so for a co-worker of mine with a BX series. He had to rebuild the engine.

 

[bmaverick]

I would trust a n oil analysis by a reputable testing lab like Blackstone Labs more than what痴 on the drain plug magnet.

Ferrous metal bits clinging to the magnet are likely machining dwarf not flushed in the cleaning process at the manufacturing plant.

Wear metals are microscopic, until catastrophic failure is imminent, or has already occurred.

I think most Diesel engine manufacturers eliminated the magnet on the plug. The magnet was scaring consumers.

So true. Usually in the owners manual, there is a first engine break-in period; X amount of run hours and change the fluids. This is to clean out the manufactures debris and the engine wear-in. Same thing goes for a rebuilt engine wear-in / break-in period.

After the mentioned above, the future filter changes should not be so drastic.

 

[Brinbane]

Just changed my HST filter this weekend in between full hydraulic oil changes. Parked sideways on a hill at about 30 degrees. Swapped filters and lost about 2 cups of oil plus what was left in the old filter. My oil level still shows in range after.

Kubota MX5200

Magnet ring was spotless.

 

[Rebeldad1]

How many hours and years on your oil changes?. It seems like it would be a cheap investment to just replace the fluid with new.
Especially with the cost of some of the newer filters.
The oil will break down its chemical additives and protectants over time from heat and wear.
Reusing it is like breathing someone elses air.
JMO

 

[California]

I like that odd shaped tin bucket, it looks homemade. Did you lay it out and break it?

Looks to me like the reservoir to submerge an innertube into, to watch for bubbles. Service stations always had one.

 

[Gordon Gould]

Looks to me like the reservoir to submerge an innertube into, to watch for bubbles. Service stations always had one.

Your probably right. When I found it I was suprized it wasn't full of bullet holes like most things like that you find in the woods around here. There are old milk cans and maple syrup buckets and even an arch and an old car all blasted to smitherines.

gg

 

[oosik]

I was going to try the "shop vac" trick on my hydraulic filter change. With my luck - I'd suck half of the 16 gallons back into the shop vac. So....I went for safety & old school. Drain it all down - change both filters - pour it all back in. Worked just great - lost less than a tablespoon.