Towing capacity

   / Towing capacity
  • Thread Starter
#101  
Guys, thanks for all of the good advice. At this point, I am going to skip the big trailer and use the dealer to bring it in for service, if needed. I'll get a small trailer to move things around my property and pick up supplies from town. I do appreciate the info on swaying and balance. It applies to small tractors, too.
 
   / Towing capacity #102  
My two cents respect the trailer with a load on the Hy Way get the feel of the combination keep your speed down read the road you need time to slow down, make a lane change, watch the other guy or gale a surprise can be an event to remember! small roads are another deal all together move over to meet on coming traffic can be an experience in trailer control slower can be safer on small roads
 
   / Towing capacity #103  
New guy here, but light and medium duty trailers are kind of my "thing". My "day job" client has a huge fleet of pickups and trailers, and I can tell you that a 1/2 ton may be "rated" for 9k, and the trailer behind it may also be "rated" for that load, but it is mostly a complete load of marketing BS. If you are going to regularly tow 6k or more with a half ton, it will take its toll on the truck. Also, the brakes that normally come with consumer-grade axles are totally insufficient, as are the axles, wheels and tires. Now, I said REGULARLY tow. If you are just doing things a few times a year, you won't hurt the 1/2 ton but if you are planning on doing what we do (dispatch pickups daily pulling trailers) do yourself a BIG favour and buy a 3/4 ton or 1 ton pickup. Again, if you are doing it a lot, the fuel consumption of a tiny turbo gasser goes away pretty quick with a trailer behind. Diesels don't pay the same premium for loaded travel.

Don't even think of starting me on the issue of trailer braking. To be allowed to use non-ABS drum brakes on a modern vehicle at the rated weights should be a criminal offense.
 
   / Towing capacity #104  
There have been a lot of good points raised in this thread. The OP could have also have titled it “everything you need to know about trailering, but were afraid to ask.”
 
   / Towing capacity #105  
I got a neat gadget for Xmas a few years ago that plugs into the truck harness under the steering wheel (F-150 and most others) and do the setup with your smart phone. It will (amazingly) provide you with many things including tongue weight, total vehicle and trailer weight, trailer weight by itself, weight of load on the trailer, etc. Just follow their instructions. The phone app is now called "Better Weigh" and the device was called something else. Newer one is Curt Better Weigh which is sold on Amazon for $99.
Whoa. Did not know such a device existed. First impression, this is a pretty irresponsible product, so use it with great care and a giant grain of salt.

It relies upon basic vehicle data, a handful of "calibration runs", and then a single internal tri-axial accelerometer to estimate your tongue weight and current payload? That is not a robust strategy, IMO. Just way too many variables that it cannot account for (level ground or not, altered suspension, incorrect input data, sticky suspension bushings, etc. I mean think about it. It's going to tell you, with accuracy, that a change in the vehicle level of under 1% pitch, equals so much tongue weight or payload? Furthermore it would have zero way to separate the payload from hitch tongue weight - same effect on the vehicle. hmmmm.
 
   / Towing capacity #106  
There's nothing "irresponsible" about an additional source of information unless the nut holding the smart phone is "irresponsible." There is no such thing as "accuracy" in adjusting trailer tongue weight. The only that matters is being good enough for the reality of the job at hand.
 
   / Towing capacity #107  
Whoa. Did not know such a device existed. First impression, this is a pretty irresponsible product, so use it with great care and a giant grain of salt.

It relies upon basic vehicle data, a handful of "calibration runs", and then a single internal tri-axial accelerometer to estimate your tongue weight and current payload? That is not a robust strategy, IMO. Just way too many variables that it cannot account for (level ground or not, altered suspension, incorrect input data, sticky suspension bushings, etc. I mean think about it. It's going to tell you, with accuracy, that a change in the vehicle level of under 1% pitch, equals so much tongue weight or payload? Furthermore it would have zero way to separate the payload from hitch tongue weight - same effect on the vehicle. hmmmm.

It is actually pretty good in determing both trailer weight and tounge weight. It was within 2% on my RVs weight and 1.5% on the tounge weight when checked against Cat Scales measurements. It also does a good job on setting trailer brake controller gain.

Without a doubt it’s not perfect, but much better than the guestimates that a lot of people use.
 
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   / Towing capacity #108  
Not to get off what he is asking about, it is good to get set up right for sure ! I have a question i to tow a 3940 with loader an usually a box scraper or mower. How do you know where to locate your load on the trailer? Say like more tongue weight, less? And if it sways what is that telling you?
I always make sure I sink the rear of truck a couple inches from the rest position. I have hauled a lot in my life. Measure hitch height when trailer is empty. I just look, but you probably should measure until you get a feel for it. Nothing like hauling a wrong load. I have had plenty of those too.
 
   / Towing capacity #109  
I always make sure I sink the rear of truck a couple inches from the rest position. I have hauled a lot in my life. Measure hitch height when trailer is empty. I just look, but you probably should measure until you get a feel for it. Nothing like hauling a wrong load. I have had plenty of those too.
Yes, I agree except it is more than 2" on most pickup trucks and most loads. Depends on load of course ! In my experience with a typical 4WD pickup (springs-wise) and a GVWR load [trailer and what's on it combined] of around 8 to 10K lbs you want about 5 or 6" of drop in the back of the truck. The more total towed weight the more tongue weight you need. There are guidelines for % of the load that tongue weight should be (undoubtedly mentioned somewhere in the 109 posts above) but I never look at it that way. Like you I eyeball it and adjust to suit.
 
   / Towing capacity #110  
Yes, I agree except it is more than 2" on most pickup trucks and most loads. Depends on load of course ! In my experience with a typical 4WD pickup (springs-wise) and a GVWR load [trailer and what's on it combined] of around 8 to 10K lbs you want about 5 or 6" of drop in the back of the truck.

I disagree. 5" or 6" is way too much. 2"-3" is enough. If my new Ram 2500 dropped 5" it would be on the axle/frame stops.

Note the gap in the front/rear fender wells, I am down in the rear about 2.5", truck is maxed out. If the rear went down another 3" it would be ugly.

0605210553.jpg
 
   / Towing capacity #111  
Around 2" is just right for my 2500HD also. 5-6" would be ridiculous and have my headlights aiming into people's faces. Note, if you have a 1500 pickup, you might need a 5" drop to have safe tongue weight.
 
   / Towing capacity #112  
I disagree. 5" or 6" is way too much. 2"-3" is enough. If my new Ram 2500 dropped 5" it would be on the axle/frame stops.

Note the gap in the front/rear fender wells, I am down in the rear about 2.5", truck is maxed out. If the rear went down another 3" it would be ugly.

View attachment 713323
Agreed, the manufacturer actually puts most trucks a about 2-3in high in the rear and they should be about level when loaded.

If you look at the front "leveling" kits for p-ups they typically add about 2-2.5in of lift.

If you're truck is dropping 5-6in either you are overloaded for your specs or your springs are worn out. I added air bags to raise my 3/4t capacity to a 1t.
 
   / Towing capacity #113  
When towing a bumper hitch trailer the rear of the truck should remain at the same level as when unloaded. This is what the wheel alignment is set up for. Adjustments come with the load leveller ( an item required for the heavier loads over 5000 pounds ?? ) or air bags.
 
   / Towing capacity #114  
When towing a bumper hitch trailer the rear of the truck should remain at the same level as when unloaded. This is what the wheel alignment is set up for. Adjustments come with the load leveller ( an item required for the heavier loads over 5000 pounds ?? ) or air bags.
Nope. Not physically possible. You need tongue weight (obviously) and springs do go down as weight is added by definition of what a spring is. Wheel alignment is unrelated . If you have some auxiliary load leveling system that overcomes the normal drop, that is tangential to this discussion but understood.
 
   / Towing capacity #115  
Agreed, the manufacturer actually puts most trucks a about 2-3in high in the rear and they should be about level when loaded.

If you look at the front "leveling" kits for p-ups they typically add about 2-2.5in of lift.

If you're truck is dropping 5-6in either you are overloaded for your specs or your springs are worn out. I added air bags to raise my 3/4t capacity to a 1t.
Not true. I am not at all overloaded and my springs are in great shape. A five to 6" drop of course is exactly proportional to the weight placed on the rear of the truck. 2-3" is NOT enough for medium range , say 8000 lb GVWR , load hauling (not enough tongue weight.) I'm talking using a half ton 4WD pickup. F-150. A 5" drop in the rear of a pickup is not all that much. NO, that does not point the headlights up in the air as one suggested. Does not really change the overall angle of the frame of the truck very much. Most of the talkers are not measuring, they are using their impression eyeballs (just as I often do myself.)
 
   / Towing capacity #116  
Around 2" is just right for my 2500HD also. 5-6" would be ridiculous and have my headlights aiming into people's faces. Note, if you have a 1500 pickup, you might need a 5" drop to have safe tongue weight.
With a 5th wheel towing arrangement you are in a totally different circumstance. The exact same load on an identical trailer (but one with a hitch ball tow arrangement for a receiver hitch instead of a 5th wheel pad) WOULD lower your rear bumper by a lot more than 2-3 inches.
 
   / Towing capacity #117  
With a 5th wheel towing arrangement you are in a totally different circumstance. The exact same load on an identical trailer (but one with a hitch ball tow arrangement for a receiver hitch instead of a 5th wheel pad) WOULD lower your rear bumper by a lot more than 2-3 inches.
I don't have a 5th wheel... I only bumper tow. My '03 2500HD has ~3200 lbs payload capacity, so 1000 lbs of tongue weight doesn't slam it down very far. With all due respect please don't assume you know more than someone else's experience without understanding their towing setup whatsoever.
 
   / Towing capacity #118  
I don't have a 5th wheel... I only bumper tow. My '03 2500HD has ~3200 lbs payload capacity, so 1000 lbs of tongue weight doesn't slam it down very far. With all due respect please don't assume you know more than someone else's experience without understanding their towing setup whatsoever.
My apologies -- I mistook you for the #111 post guy who shows a photo of the 5th wheel he is using. Don't assume what I assume, with all due respect...
 
   / Towing capacity #119  
Agreed, the manufacturer actually puts most trucks a about 2-3in high in the rear and they should be about level when loaded.

If you look at the front "leveling" kits for p-ups they typically add about 2-2.5in of lift.

If you're truck is dropping 5-6in either you are overloaded for your specs or your springs are worn out. I added air bags to raise my 3/4t capacity to a 1t.
I agree. My 19 2500 GMC Tows my 10k TT perfectly with apx 2" rake taken out with tongue weight making the truck level. My buddy leveled his F250 and when he tows, the front is higher than the rear due to toungue weight. This is why I won't level my truck and I'm not adding airbags just for appearances. I'm no engineer but it seems that the 2" drop comes on pretty fast then rapidly stiffens up...My 1500's acted the same way although under lighter toungue loads obviously.
 
   / Towing capacity #120  
Not true. I am not at all overloaded and my springs are in great shape. A five to 6" drop of course is exactly proportional to the weight placed on the rear of the truck. 2-3" is NOT enough for medium range , say 8000 lb GVWR , load hauling (not enough tongue weight.) I'm talking using a half ton 4WD pickup. F-150. A 5" drop in the rear of a pickup is not all that much. NO, that does not point the headlights up in the air as one suggested. Does not really change the overall angle of the frame of the truck very much. Most of the talkers are not measuring, they are using their impression eyeballs (just as I often do myself.)
If you're getting 5-6in of drop and are within your load limit then you might want to look into getting better springs or helpers. As for headlights, I can tell you from experience (former VA state safety inspector) if your headlights are aimed correctly when unloaded then they are too high when the rear drops 6in.

As for weight, I tow a couple bumper pulls, one grosses about 16k and has close to 2k tongue weight so I'm familiar with heavier loads on a pickup. My truck will sit level with its rated cargo capacity (2-2.5" drop).

Just blanket telling people they need 5-6in of drop to be loaded correctly is spreading poor information.
 

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