Newb looking for advice and info on a new compact tractor and attachments

[rScotty]

rScotty;

sounds like your land is very similar to mine. Pretty close even on the elevation. I've got a a ridge running down through the middle of my land with some subalpine spruce, and have quite a few acres in Aspen (my area is a unique area in the world where aspen forests are largely permanent and don't get replaced by Doug fir over time), but otherwise I'm sure it's similar to yours with the Doug Fir and Lodgepoles. Its an old forest area, the needle carpet under some of our lodgepole areas are multiple feet thick, and i do have a lot of larger trees. Luckily they just aren't in areas where I need to remove any. Grateful for that because of both the effort to deal with them, and I hate to take down trees.

I do have a little spring and will probably use that hoe to dig out a pond. It's maybe 300 feet from that pic with all the downed trees in it. I already get a lot of deer and Elk all over the land, but especially at that spring. Lots of Mountain lion signs, but no bear sign that I've found yet. We are in a north-facing bowl at the foot of a large east face of the national forest mountains. One large draw coming down that face is all huckleberries, so I'm sure there are plenty of bears around. Would be neat to see some.


All,

Honestly, these last few responses are making me feel a little more confident. Makes me think more that my plans for the tractor may not have to change alot, other than maybe that I need to be even more patient in preparing for the dozer to get all the work done that it is best suited for.
In fact this is making more hopeful to get more done with the dozer than I had thought could be done. I was hoping to understand more from this conversation about what I can rely on the dozer to take care of and it sounds like it may be able to do some of the things I was concerned about. I had originally thought I might need to tear out all of those aspens before a dozer could push the road in that area. But if a dozer can go right through those trees, it sounds like this smaller tractor may be ok to do the cleanup afterward. And honestly, that is about as hairy as it gets for the road work. The rest of it might be low ground cover (like the other pic I posted) and areas with fewer trees that aren't any bigger than those aspens. So i expect the dozer would be able to take care of all of it.

And it sounds like no one has concerns on this type of tractor for dealing with deadfall and cleanup. I just need to decide what tools I will start with for both the road maintenance/dirt work, and for land maintenance

That leaves me with the concern around the ongoing dirt work after the road and campsites are cleared and graded by the dozer. That dirt work isn't expected to include a lot of large rocks, other than pulling some down from open dig faces. (but who knows what I'll run into...)
I expect that the the level of dirt work would be very equivalent to digging trenches or digging out a pond. The things I'm hearing are that, this level of equipment would work for that (as long as I remember that I am running light duty tools and am patient)

If I run into some bigger/harder digging then I may need to rent something rather than try to do it with the tractor.

as far as additional attachments go.

• I will buy used where I can.
• I am still thinking box blade though am not very well settled on it. The land plane won't help me move dirt in the way I will need to in the non-road earthwork. and it sounds like a 3pt blade seems to require some skills that I may not have the time to develop well. I may get a 3pt later if I can find a deal on one.
• It sounds like a rock bucket is probably a good idea. if it can help with clearing brush and gound cover that would be ideal. Id like to avoid the cost of doing a grapple if I can.
  • I agree with what tradosaurus said in that a grapple or something on the front is a lot easier than using the backhoe for some of the cleanup work. But the cost of the grapple would be tough right now.
  • I still would like to think I could do forks as a poor mans grapple as Blue Mule stated up above.
  • Blue Mule, what kind of work do you do with those forks?

Glad to help. I've got photos of as many as six adult bears at the pond - some with cubs. Moms put cubs up a tree when big males are around - that seems prudent. Small critters just seem to find it automatically. I mean, where in the world do turtles come from? Frogs? Tiny fish? But there they are.

Sure, go ahead and try a box blade. I find them handy for protecting the back end of a tractor, a nice counterweight, and they do stop the 3pt arms from banging around. Plus...if you make a wooden worktable and tool caddy to fit on the top it will be indispensible as a your portable workbench.

As for moving a quantity of dirt any distance with a box blade.....well, I haven't had much luck with that. You may well do better with the FEL bucket. But it won't hurt to try. I don't think that you can hurt a tractor with anything you do with a box blade. Get one with adjustable scarifiers and also a flip down back cutting edge for pushing dirt in reverse. You will probably want a 5 footer - but I'm guessing.

BTW, a back blade with end caps will do a lot of what a box blade will, but it doesn't make nearly so nice a workbench...

I think we have 3 box blades in different sizes because they are inexpensive and immortal, and because even just sitting out there rusting in the implement row they still make a dandy portable work bench. Be sure to remember to set it on blocks or a couple of logs when taking it off the tractor. Not only does that protect the blade, but it puts the workbench at a better height.

A rock bucket IS a good idea. One really nice thing when learning how to use a rock bucket on the FEL is that you can look though the back of the rock bucket and actually see what the front of the bucket is doing. Judging from photos of your place, I think if you added a grapple to a good rock bucket & it might become a favorite tool. Get the ADCO or Houle type with the round tines. Yes, those do cost twice what the square tine type does. Worth it though. And with the rund tine type rock bucket you can use them for some of what you would do with forks.

Implements are the payoff for all the money you spent on the tractor. Notice that nobody really has written much about what tractor you should get - but a lot about implements.

rScotty

 

[mred2]

I have an LS XR4150, open station, 2 remotes with 3rd function. LOVE IT! I have the 2100 backhoe. You must have one detent remote for the backhoe. You only want one. The 3rd function can be added later, but it is a must have for a grapple. I have a hyd top link. Easy to take on and off for the backhoe. I use mine for the box blade. All of my tires are filled. I have a 14 foot dump trailer and have hauled my tractor on it. I DO NOT RECOMMED IT. I also have a 16' car hauler. It is fine. I am thinking about a 20' equipment trailer, bigger load, better brakes. About $5,000 here. I would go with forks first. You can get a lot done with them.
You can have the dozer pull the ditches while there. If you need to pull the ditches, a rear angle blade is much better than a box blade. A box blade is better to move dirt from high to low spots. But you can move a lot of dirt with the bucket on the front. My son just buried a horse, digging a hole with only the front bucket.
Every attachment has a learning curve. It takes time and everyone is different. A friend helped me not long ago and mowed over very rough ground, too fast. Repair parts were about $400 for bent parts and lost pins.
It is not a dozer. Go slow and know the limits.

 

[shooterdon]

I would buy a used dozer. Do all the dangerous and heavy work, Then sell it and get a tractor.

You will not lose much on a used dozer. Much cheaper than renting and/or contracting.

 

[cathy liebchen]

Get a CTL

 

[MAX-24-Dean]

If the dozer pushes up piles of aspens with the stumps on them...you arent touching those with a small tractor. If the piles are large enough, they are usually burned with the help of a nice large excavator. If we are talking 1-2 miles of aspens along that road in the picture...thats a hell of a project. No way you are doing it with a tractor. You will have a pile taller than the machine every 50 ft. Land clearing work gets out of hand really fast. It will take you years to do it.

To prevent erosion the base material isnt what matters the most. It is controlling the flow of the water. When it rains, stand out on that incline in the road. See where the water is going. Usually you need a swale/light trench on one side of the road to guide the water, and some sort of culvert under the road to help it cross. However your terrain may vary. Its all about the contours of the terrain. That said, a nice compacted road surface will resist erosion more than loose soil. However it will eventually succumb to mother nature.

I will second the controlling the flow of water as being the most important aspect of keeping material where you want it to stay.

 

[dustycoyote]

Glad to help. I've got photos of as many as six adult bears at the pond - some with cubs. Moms put cubs up a tree when big males are around - that seems prudent. Small critters just seem to find it automatically. I mean, where in the world do turtles come from? Frogs? Tiny fish? But there they are.

Sure, go ahead and try a box blade. I find them handy for protecting the back end of a tractor, a nice counterweight, and they do stop the 3pt arms from banging around. Plus...if you make a wooden worktable and tool caddy to fit on the top it will be indispensible as a your portable workbench.

As for moving a quantity of dirt any distance with a box blade.....well, I haven't had much luck with that. You may well do better with the FEL bucket. But it won't hurt to try. I don't think that you can hurt a tractor with anything you do with a box blade. Get one with adjustable scarifiers and also a flip down back cutting edge for pushing dirt in reverse. You will probably want a 5 footer - but I'm guessing.

BTW, a back blade with end caps will do a lot of what a box blade will, but it doesn't make nearly so nice a workbench...

I think we have 3 box blades in different sizes because they are inexpensive and immortal, and because even just sitting out there rusting in the implement row they still make a dandy portable work bench. Be sure to remember to set it on blocks or a couple of logs when taking it off the tractor. Not only does that protect the blade, but it puts the workbench at a better height.

A rock bucket IS a good idea. One really nice thing when learning how to use a rock bucket on the FEL is that you can look though the back of the rock bucket and actually see what the front of the bucket is doing. Judging from photos of your place, I think if you added a grapple to a good rock bucket & it might become a favorite tool. Get the ADCO or Houle type with the round tines. Yes, those do cost twice what the square tine type does. Worth it though. And with the rund tine type rock bucket you can use them for some of what you would do with forks.

Implements are the payoff for all the money you spent on the tractor. Notice that nobody really has written much about what tractor you should get - but a lot about implements.

rScotty

why are the round tines better? and how do the round tines allow one to use it more like forks?

 

[rScotty]

why are the round tines better? and how do the round tines allow one to use it more like forks?

I wish I knew the whole answer to your question. So far all I have are observations but no theory. Maybe someone has ideas. All the buckets are the same width - about six feet inside.

Below are some 2 pictures of an inexpensive no-name rock bucket that has the flame-cut rectangular section flat tines. I bought it originally about 15 years ago for just under $1000 & used it a few years. The flat tine bucket has fabricated points on the tines.

Below that are several pictures of better working Round Tine rock buckets. One yellow Houle & one black "BRADCO" - I've been mistakenly writing "ADCO", but it's a BRADCO. The Bradco cost $1800 ten years ago. Compared to the flat tine bucket, the round tine type is a foot longer front to back, slightly lower overall, and the tine spacing is half an inch closer together. Plus it has that weird rounded bump in the front. A small feature that is probably responsible for a lot of the extra cost.

The difference in the way they work is subtle but real. I'm one of those guys who loans tools to friends... and everyone wants to borrow the round tine bucket. For skidloader use I only loan the flat tine bucket because I don't care what happens to it. The round tine one is special.

In use, the round tine pushes into a pile with less resistance, and will even slide under some rocks and the ends of logs. Dirt passes between the round tines easier when shaking the load to sort rocks from dirt. And rocks don't tend to get stuck between the tines. When doing successive fills, that odd rounded bump near the front of the round tine bucket holds rocks & trash at the back of the bucket while using the front to scoop up more load.

For use like forks - well, I should say "sort of ....but not completely. Nothing replaces good SSQA forks". But this will do some of the same work. Look at the pictures. The round tine bucket has an open space forward of the side supports where you can pick up logs longer than the bucket. That is an advantage that forks have and that this round tine rock bucket also has. Regular dirt buckets won't do that very well at all. And although the round tine won't spear a pallet securely like forks will, it is long enough to slide under a pallet with the tines then being long enough to enable some palletized loads to be lifted and moved. Again, not as good as forks, but much better than a standard dirt bucket which won't do that because the back of the bucket is too close to the lip to get fully under a standard pallet.

rScotty

 

[rScotty]

Just a little more on rock buckets and also grapples.

In the pictures below, the tractor is actually a 60 hp Kubota M59 TLB with 6 speed HST & wide industrial tires. It weighs 8000 lbs with the backhoe - and the FEL is not removeable - although the bucket is.
That 72" rock bucket pictured weighs about 700 lbs, plus there is that much more weight in rocks and about to be twice that. All that weight is fine in a machine that size. But it is more machine than you are looking for at present.

For a smaller tractor or one with less gears available, it can be a mistake to use wide heavy implements for dirt and rock work. Many times you will get more work done by reining in the desire to buy big and just buying a size to fit - approx.same as tire width, or even a half size smaller.

A smaller tractor with correctly sized implements does a lot of work.

 

[dustycoyote]

I have an LS XR4150, open station, 2 remotes with 3rd function. LOVE IT! I have the 2100 backhoe. You must have one detent remote for the backhoe. You only want one. The 3rd function can be added later, but it is a must have for a grapple. I have a hyd top link. Easy to take on and off for the backhoe. I use mine for the box blade. All of my tires are filled. I have a 14 foot dump trailer and have hauled my tractor on it. I DO NOT RECOMMED IT. I also have a 16' car hauler. It is fine. I am thinking about a 20' equipment trailer, bigger load, better brakes. About $5,000 here. I would go with forks first. You can get a lot done with them.
You can have the dozer pull the ditches while there. If you need to pull the ditches, a rear angle blade is much better than a box blade. A box blade is better to move dirt from high to low spots. But you can move a lot of dirt with the bucket on the front. My son just buried a horse, digging a hole with only the front bucket.
Every attachment has a learning curve. It takes time and everyone is different. A friend helped me not long ago and mowed over very rough ground, too fast. Repair parts were about $400 for bent parts and lost pins.
It is not a dozer. Go slow and know the limits.

Really nice to get experiences from someone with pretty much the same tractor. Thank you. Glad to hear that you like it. Even if I wait a little bit now, I still think this tractor is the one I'd like to get (as long as I don't discover that I have some needs that it doesn't fit).

One question on the trailer. When you say you don't recommend transporting in the dump trailer, why do you not recommend it? My understanding is that the concerns in trailering come from, Load capacity, fit of the equipment to the trailer (don't want stuff hanging out), and load distribution. What about the dump trailer didn't work well? I'm assuming it was load distribution and/or possibly fit (since you wer in a 14 footer), but if there were other things that made it not optimal, I'd like to know.

 

[dustycoyote]

Just a little more on rock buckets and also grapples.

In the pictures below, the tractor is actually a 60 hp Kubota M59 TLB with 6 speed HST & wide industrial tires. It weighs 8000 lbs with the backhoe - and the FEL is not removeable - although the bucket is.
That 72" rock bucket pictured weighs about 700 lbs, plus there is that much more weight in rocks and about to be twice that. All that weight is fine in a machine that size. But it is more machine than you are looking for at present.

For a smaller tractor or one with less gears available, it can be a mistake to use wide heavy implements for dirt and rock work. Many times you will get more work done by reining in the desire to buy big and just buying a size to fit - approx.same as tire width, or even a half size smaller.

A smaller tractor with correctly sized implements does a lot of work.

View attachment 763548View attachment 763549

Ok. Understanding a little of what you're saying on the round tines version vs the "normal" ones.

And thanks for the note on the sizing. that makes a lot of sense. The max width of the tractor I'm looking at is about 64 inches, so I am thinking a 60 inch rock bucket then??

And I did a little research and watched some videos on rock buckets last night. Seems like I would want to get a Rockbucket/Grapple combo attachment. Rather than a separate grapple.

Since I'm not clearing fields for planting, I'm not expecting rock clearing to be a large part of what I'm doing. But a rock bucket with small or no sides, and with the grapple included, seems like it would solve quite a few problems for me and let me use one attachment rather than switching between several. I'd think I would want SOME side walls, even if just in the back of the bucket if I can find one like that.

What do you think about doing a version with no or little sides? I looked at the Stinger ROG bucket with grapple last night (simply because a guy that lives in my area did a really useful review of this companies model)
https://stingerattachments.com/buy/skid-steer-rock-grapple-open-sides/#
Doesn't have the round tines and is pricey, but is an example of what kind of a design I'm talking about.