Generator wiring

[grsthegreat]

i should have taken pictures of a generator i was called to look at a few years ago. guy backfed panel with a suicide plug for many years, no issues. no interlock for many years, no issue. than comes one time when he was tired from moving snow and shoveling walkways. power came back on, he went and threw main breaker back on...but didnt unhook generator,. blew up generator. and melted a bunch of his panel. he wanted me to bid to replace main panel. i decided against doing any work on this job because i have retired as an electrician and didnt want the headaches. but the generator was destroyed. a bunch of circuits in his house wernt working. quite the mess. all this because he didnt want to use a $49 interlock.

just saying

 

[Fuddyduddy1952]

Just saying...sure hope no one here drives!
(Priorities?) Oh well...here goes:
More than TWICE as many bicycle deaths than electrocution deaths!:

People are injured or killed by electricity every year. Statistics tell us that there are over 400 electrocutions and over 4000 non-fatal injuries every year in the United States.

Traffic fatalities in US, 2020...38,824
Traffic injuries in US, 2020...2,280,000
2.28 MILLION injuries!
Unintentional deaths in US, 200,955
Fall deaths...42,114
Poisoning deaths...87,404
Opioid deaths in US, 2020...60,000/yr.
Pedestrian deaths in US, 2017...5,233
Bicycle fatalities...1,000 with 130,000 injuries
Drowning deaths...4,000/yr.
Gun-related deaths from preventable, intentional, and undetermined causes totaled 45,222 in 2020, an increase of 13.9% from 39,707 deaths in 2019. Suicides account for 54% of deaths related to firearms, while 43% were homicides, and about 1% were preventable/accidental.
In 2020, 368 farmers and farm workers died from a work-related injury, resulting in a fatality rate of 18.0 deaths per 100,000 workers.
Bottom line: tractor fatalities (rollovers) about equal electrocutions...however...factor in time spent/year on a tractor vs time spent/year fooling with electricity.

 

[grsthegreat]

I hate flawed logic. I once did a service call on an old house that had no lights in bathroom. When i started to look at job, i found that entire house was wired with 2 wire lamp cord. Honestly. The 20 ga lamp cord like you see on old lamps. Turns out the guys grandfather wired it many years ago with scrap wire. Has worked great for all these years.

i left job without fixing anything. Im not going to be part of a lawsuit if the place goes up in flames and i was last guy working on it.

just because its worked all these years doesnt make it right.

if someone insists on not making something safe, knowing its installed wrong, all injuries are on them. Hope you can live with results.

 

[Fuddyduddy1952]

"Hope you can live with results."
Who the heck is 'you'?
I hate flawed logic as well!

 

[grsthegreat]

Someone whos spent his working years safely wiring houses to prevent needless injuries. Thats who.

seen the results of sloppy homeowner work too many times.

im not here to get into fight over this. The OP was asking how to fix the mess in his panel. Were trying to tell him the proper way to do it, not a way to jerry rig it. 30+ year electrical contractor here. 10 years specialization in backup generators.

im thru here. Have a good night

 

[Fuddyduddy1952]

Which is why read my post #6..."this is a case where paying an electrician I would do."

 

[MAX-24-Dean]

The few times I run our 9kW portable generator I simply go in this order:
1) Turn main and all breakers off in main panel box, (except to garage 250 ft.away.)
2) Connect generator to welder outlet, leaving just garage main and welder breaker on.
3) Run generator.
4) At house turn well pump and water heater breaker on, as well as refrigerator.
5) Meter display let's me know when power is restored. A pilot light on main breaker meter side does same thing.
6) Shut generator off.
7) Disconnect generator.
8) Garage breakers on.
9) Main breaker on and others in main box.

Some Utility Companies will give you a notice to repair this installation and get it inspected if they know about it. If you don't complete the repair in a timely manner they can pull your meter until it is repaired and inspected.
The only safe installation with generators is one with a transfer switch or panel interlock between Main breaker and generator breaker.

 

[Fuddyduddy1952]

Some Utility Companies will give you a notice to repair this installation and get it inspected if they know about it. If you don't complete the repair in a timely manner they can pull your meter until it is repaired and inspected.
The only safe installation with generators is one with a transfer switch or panel interlock between Main breaker and generator breaker.

It works, we don't fear death using it once every five years if that. No one will pull meter...no worries.

 

[etpm]

Just saying...sure hope no one here drives!
(Priorities?) Oh well...here goes:
More than TWICE as many bicycle deaths than electrocution deaths!:

People are injured or killed by electricity every year. Statistics tell us that there are over 400 electrocutions and over 4000 non-fatal injuries every year in the United States.

Traffic fatalities in US, 2020...38,824
Traffic injuries in US, 2020...2,280,000
2.28 MILLION injuries!
Unintentional deaths in US, 200,955
Fall deaths...42,114
Poisoning deaths...87,404
Opioid deaths in US, 2020...60,000/yr.
Pedestrian deaths in US, 2017...5,233
Bicycle fatalities...1,000 with 130,000 injuries
Drowning deaths...4,000/yr.
Gun-related deaths from preventable, intentional, and undetermined causes totaled 45,222 in 2020, an increase of 13.9% from 39,707 deaths in 2019. Suicides account for 54% of deaths related to firearms, while 43% were homicides, and about 1% were preventable/accidental.
In 2020, 368 farmers and farm workers died from a work-related injury, resulting in a fatality rate of 18.0 deaths per 100,000 workers.
Bottom line: tractor fatalities (rollovers) about equal electrocutions...however...factor in time spent/year on a tractor vs time spent/year fooling with electricity.

Your post kinda says it at the end with the last sentence. But really, if the numbers of deaths and injuries are to have the proper significance then the numbers must also be shown as a ratio. Your last sentence tried to say this but was not as clear as it should have been. In fact, I think posting all the numbers above without also posting ratios makes the data presented inadequate and misleading.
Eric

 

[Fuddyduddy1952]

Your post kinda says it at the end with the last sentence. But really, if the numbers of deaths and injuries are to have the proper significance then the numbers must also be shown as a ratio. Your last sentence tried to do this but was not as clear as it should have been. In fact, I think posting all the numbers above without also posting ratios makes the data presented inadequate and misleading.
Eric

What I'm saying is if someone is so concerned with death or injury from electrocution they should be MUCH MORE concerned with death or injury from driving.
Correct?
Note that my post #6 my advice to the OP is decide what he wants, cleaning up the main panel...bringing it up to modern code...that's best left to an electrician.
Here, the very rare cases I've used my generator things are done in sequence. A few neighbors had Generac systems installed which to me is ludicrous.