Horse farm needs tractor

[WM75Guy]

I think you need to keep shopping or find another Kioti dealer. The Kioti website and other dealers say the CK2610 is still available for 2023. It sounds like he doesn't have one on the lot and is trying to sell what he has in inventory. Ask your dealer what the cash price would be for the tractor. You will find the zero % interest means the interest is tacked onto the price upfront. If you pay it off early, you still pay all the interest. It is a sales tool to allow folks that don't have the cash up front to still be able to buy their tractor. Most manufacturers do it from time to time.

In the ad below $1,950 in interest is tacked onto the purchase price upfront if you finance and then payments are calculated at 0% interest. That works out to 9.3% simple interest. You may be better off paying the cash price by using another method of finance, i.e., bank, credit union, or ag credit, with a lower interest rate. That way if you pay it off early you get a break on the interest. You could also ask the dealer about the price using conventional finance rates.

 

[WinterDeere]

Sure would be nice if there was a tractor shootout comparing similar tractors side by side. Let’s see what they can do. They got’em for cars, trucks, motorcycles, etc….why not tractors??

High cost to volume ratio. Even the most popular tractors don't sell 20k units per year.

 

[Horsetime]

I think you need to keep shopping or find another Kioti dealer. The Kioti website and other dealers say the CK2610 is still available for 2023. It sounds like he doesn't have one on the lot and is trying to sell what he has in inventory. Ask your dealer what the cash price would be for the tractor. You will find the zero % interest means the interest is tacked onto the price upfront. If you pay it off early, you still pay all the interest. It is a sales tool to allow folks that don't have the cash up front to still be able to buy their tractor. Most manufacturers do it from time to time.

In the ad below $1,950 in interest is tacked onto the purchase price upfront if you finance and then payments are calculated at 0% interest. That works out to 9.3% simple interest. You may be better off paying the cash price by using another method of finance, i.e., bank, credit union, or ag credit, with a lower interest rate. That way if you pay it off early you get a break on the interest. You could also ask the dealer about the price using conventional finance rates.

View attachment 809862

Thank you. I may go and see them in person and ask more directly about the cost and "last year's model"

 

[2manyrocks]

Before you commit to buy anything, at least get a sales quote from your local Kubota dealer so you have something specific to compare.

Some tractor dealers are using car dealer sales type methods which are designed to mine the most money out of the customer's pockets. Wouldn't hurt to take someone you trust with you as a second set of ears.

edit: when you have narrowed down your search to a couple of specific models you are considering buying, please consider using the TBN search tool to look for threads by actual owners giving their actual user experience with those models.

There was an instance a few months ago where some members were saying how great a particular machine was compared to some brands right until a member who'd had one for a year posted his actual user experience. The fan boy talk got reality checked because the real life use experience didn't match up to the talk.

 

[Horsetime]

Thank you everyone. I think I will get a quote for the Branson 2515 and 3015 as well.

 

[big bubba]

I did speak with a KIOTI dealer and he has a CK2620 (which replaced the CK2610) for $24,999. That's probably the top top of my budget depending on payments. I'd prefer to pay it off OP

can't believe the OP is still looking at a 25hp range regardless of make or new/used. respectfully, believe he will regret for future ambitions or even current tasks if he goes that route.

 

[2manyrocks]

I did speak with a KIOTI dealer and he has a CK2620 (which replaced the CK2610) for $24,999. That's probably the top top of my budget depending on payments. I'd prefer to pay it off OP

can't believe the OP is still looking at a 25hp range regardless of make or new/used. respectfully, believe he will regret for future ambitions or even current tasks if he goes that route.

I also can't believe the enthusiasm from other TBN members for paying $24,999 for any 25hp tractor without considering the options to buy a larger HP machine even if it meant taking a second job delivering pizzas for a while to make up the difference.

 

[big bubba]

thumbs up...having said that, i too have made rash compulsive purchases on tractors i thought would do the job, & glad i found finally the right machine, though a hit to the pocketbook.

to his credit, the OP has posted here & hopefully he will make an informed decision.
once a person gets buying fever, sound decisions go out the window, been there several times myself am sure it will work out fine, regards

 

[rScotty]

I've been reading loads of statements like this sent towards any brand that lifts or does more than the orange and green brands.

Has there been any actual proof of those false advertisements?

You can research inarguable proof for yourself. Simply compare today's lift specs with older loader specs. The debate about false advertising for both FEL and 3pt filled tractor industry in-house literature a few decades ago. That debate led directly to the modern practice of advertisers specifying where the lift is measured. Today you will see lift measured "at the pins", or at a specified distance from the pins.

Comparing today's advertising with older literature, you will see that it used to be common for the lift to stated but the position where the lift was measured was not. Sometimes it still is not. So to answer your question: The industry change to a more useful specification was entirely due to the industry debate over false advertising.

But it still left room for advertising hyperbole. ptsg, I've followed you enough to know you are technically knowledgeable. You don't need me telling you about lift geometry, non-linearity with height, lift cylinder size, relief settings, or the influence of an industry standard +-10% pressure spec.

I stand by what I said originally, "Front end loader (lift) capacity should be the last thing on your list".
Regardless of what the salesman says, all makes and all FEL lift a similar amount and FEL lift is no goodr reason to chose one tractor over another. Now if you want to talk about other aspects of loader ops - such as smoothness of the loader control valve being important - then I completely agree and hand the discussion back to you. A really sensitive & smooth loader control valve makes loading a joy - but it also adds significantly to the loader cost. Same for the 3pt.
rScotty

 

[woolyAcres]

OP

I did speak with a KIOTI dealer and he has a CK2620 (which replaced the CK2610) for $24,999. That's probably the top top of my budget depending on payments. I'd prefer to pay it off OP

can't believe the OP is still looking at a 25hp range regardless of make or new/used. respectfully, believe he will regret for future ambitions or even current tasks if he goes that route.

Unless I missed something, I have no doubt my CT2025 (and others in that class, including Branson and TYM) could do all the things listed and fit his budget. He won't be able to do things as fast as larger machines but if the budget is firm and the timeline is tight, it could work.

Another option is to save up to increase the budget and get something larger or be patient and find something larger used. Both good options as well but what is the OP to do in the meantime?

Perhaps start with what you can afford now, take good care of it, and sell it in a few years when you've had a chance to save a bit more and your needs evolve.

I'm not offering any money for those more expensive machines just my experience with at 25HP tractor doing all the tasks they listed.

 

[drumminj]

One thing I have to say - these threads are great even though folks don't agree (perhaps *because* they don't agree)

OP, if you can step back a bit you're getting input from folks with both larger and smaller tractors and a good range of things to consider/trade-off/ask the dealer about. No one can tell you what's right for you, but hopefully you'll be able to make a more informed decision having posted your question here.

 

[WinterDeere]

I stand by what I said originally, "Front end loader (lift) capacity should be the last thing on your list".

I think that depends on your intended usage. For me, my primary reason for buying a new tractor was to get a greater lift capacity. It was one of my top considerations in choosing a model, as I was so limited by lift capacity on my prior machine.

Regardless of what the salesman says, all makes and all FEL lift a similar amount

Here's a quick comparison of a 320R, 300R, and 300E on the same machine. You will see lift capacity varies 1180 up to 1630 lb. That's a "similar amount" in your book? I'd call it a 40% difference.

 

[rScotty]

I think that depends on your intended usage. For me, my primary reason for buying a new tractor was to get a greater lift capacity. It was one of my top considerations in choosing a model, as I was so limited by lift capacity on my prior machine.


Here's a quick comparison of a 320R, 300R, and 300E on the same machine. You will see lift capacity varies 1180 up to 1630 lb. That's a "similar amount" in your book? I'd call it a 40% difference.

View attachment 809923

Ok. You give some figures and say, "I'd call that a 40% difference". So now we can talk.
I think you are going to find that we agree on most everything

Lets assume that those numbers represent basically the same loader on different models of tractor.

First of all, here is the "at the pins" versus 500mm (20") forward. Forward of the pins is what we want, because that would be at a usable bucket distance. Probably nobody ever used their loader to lift anything "At the Pins". So if you have a bucket then your numbers are not 1180 to 1630, they are 845 to 1144. But hold on, no bucket is mentioned. So we need to deduct the weight of the bucket. Call it 200 lbs without SSQA. So now 645 to 944. Doing the same math the same way you did, the difference has changed from your 40% (actually 38%) to 46%...THAT's GOOD! But the actual amount we are able to lift has fallen by 984 lbs.... THAT's BAD.
As a salesman, which number do you want to pick to showcase to our potential customer? Do you choose to showcase the spec showing the 46% greater lift? Or the spec showing 985 lbs less usable lift to full height?

And that decision as to which spec to use is exactly my point.
Not that loaders can't be different - of course they can be.

But my point is that loader specs can be manipulated by advertising and simple high school math in a way that confuses the unwary. That is why I would put loader specs at the bottom of my list.

BTW, did you notice on your table that those specs are at full height? Well, here is something you should know if using full height specs. If you take the same loader and change a few mounting points you will find that a higher spec at full height also ALWAYS gives you a lower lift capacity at the first half of the lift - from the ground to half height. Don't blame me; blame a guy named Euclid.

Ask yourself: How often do you lift to full height? Wouldn't you rather have the larger lift capacity from the ground to half height? Or from half height to full height as your chart shows?
Ask yourself why that loader spec chart doesn't show the one thing that you actually use? How about a spec showing lift capacity with a bucket & from the ground to half of full height.

I'll tell you why. It's because most same size loaders are very close to each other for what they can usefully lift for most jobs - even plus/minus 10% is not significant because it is the number that hydraulic pressure is allowed to vary.

So to finish, I agree with you completely about the advantage of a stronger loader.
But please know what the loader specs are actually telling you - or else don't use advertisements to make your decisions.

rScotty

 

[WinterDeere]

I agree with your math, rScotty. I’m an engineer, we both know basic physics! But not with the conclusion that all of these loaders have the same effective lift capacity.

That table is not showing same loader on three different machines, as you stated, but rather three different loaders on the same machine (or as close as is possible with the -E). The 320R and 300R numbers were in fact taken on the same machine, and 320R has a greater lift capacity than the 300R.

Also, you choose your bucket separately from the loader, when buying. I can put the same bucket on both loaders, there’s no reason to assume the heavier loader must also carry a heavier bucket.

 

[Horsetime]

I also can't believe the enthusiasm from other TBN members for paying $24,999 for any 25hp tractor without considering the options to buy a larger HP machine even if it meant taking a second job delivering pizzas for a while to make up the difference.

I did speak with a KIOTI dealer and he has a CK2620 (which replaced the CK2610) for $24,999. That's probably the top top of my budget depending on payments. I'd prefer to pay it off OP

can't believe the OP is still looking at a 25hp range regardless of make or new/used. respectfully, believe he will regret for future ambitions or even current tasks if he goes that route.

If either one of you would be willing to make the payments for me I'd be more than happy to buy whatever size or brand of tractor you think I need.

 

[Peter 315]

If either one of you would be willing to make the payments for me I'd be more than happy to buy whatever size tractor you think I need. I'll even tip you if you deliver me those pizzas from your second job.

 

[WM75Guy]

There are other options, depending on dealer location. New Holland makes a 25 HP under $25,000. I see they sell Summit tractors in Indiana. They are a 25 HP tractor, priced at or below $20,000. Might be another option. They are made by Solis, who just recently entered the US market. That should help with parts availability.

 

[big bubba]

If either one of you would be willing to make the payments for me I'd be more than happy to buy whatever size or brand of tractor you think I need.

i understand, the market is tough these days. all the best in your purchase, maybe get back in 6 mo to let us know how things are going w/the new machine.
feel so fortunate back in '08 to have purchased my Tier 2 machine (12 sp open station) for 34k. best regards

 

[2manyrocks]

You need a toy tractor from the dollar store. I'll send you $1.25 plus tax.

 

[riptides]

Too much emphasis on lift capacity. Grab it...lift it...too heavy....make another trip. I would return focus to that field the farmer is maintaining for you. What is the overall lot size for everything you have?