Comparison 1025R vs. BX25D-1 vs. Max 24 vs. GC1705

[zinger084]

1025R vs. BX25D-1 vs. Max 24 vs. GC1705

First post. I've been trolling the forums a lot lately.

I also have been search around everywhere and I know this forum has a very similar thread.

With that said, I'm a half acre home owner non in a rural area @ 30Y.O. I do projects around the yard (just had a contractor move 130 yds dirt for a new 750 sqft patio and 150' retaining wall that I'm doing myself.

I have access to a small cabin and land down south ~ 50 minutes that could require use of a SCUT FILB w/ MMM.

With that said, I'm sure most of my use will be for mowing my suburbia half acre, but I'm a total workhorse outside in general. FEL and BH will be used for drain lines, electrical lines, plumbing lines, new tree planting, pole barn building, speading mulch, gravel, etc...

So, I've only seen the MAx 24 in person. I'm looking at the BX25D tonight. Tomorrow I hope to see the 1025R and thereafter possibly the GC1705. I've heard a lot about LS and I don't know much still.

I feel like I keep reading new things and changing my mind, so from that that tells me, these are all great machines.

Bad things I've heard are (which may just be anomalies):

1025R cuts grass horribly
GC1705 is a PITA to service
BX25D can't have 3pt with BH
Max 24 don't seem to hold up well and they have plenty just sitting on the lots

So, I know this will be all biased answers, but based on my use and the FOUR manufacturers listed above, can you provide feedback?

 

[TigerDMD]

I'm right there with you. First time buyer trying to decide between the 1025R and the BX25D-1 or possibly moving up and trying to decide between the 2025R vs. B2650. I'm curious as to what you've heard about the 1025R and being bad at mowing as that is my primary focus with anything I buy - it needs to function as a mower very well without tearing up the yard.

 

[zinger084]

I'm right there with you. First time buyer trying to decide between the 1025R and the BX25D-1 or possibly moving up and trying to decide between the 2025R vs. B2650. I'm curious as to what you've heard about the 1025R and being bad at mowing as that is my primary focus with anything I buy - it needs to function as a mower very well without tearing up the yard.

Ha! I was in-between the 2025R and B2650, but moved down after reading someone else's post on this forum (and being 8k cheaper).

One person said that he would cut the grass and it would leave lines between the blades and he had it serviced three times and it didnt fix it. I would assume this is an anomaly, but not sure...

 

[GManBart]

Ha! I was in-between the 2025R and B2650, but moved down after reading someone else's post on this forum (and being 8k cheaper).

One person said that he would cut the grass and it would leave lines between the blades and he had it serviced three times and it didnt fix it. I would assume this is an anomaly, but not sure...

The problem (in my mind) with the BX25D, 1025R, 2025R, Max 24 and GC 1705 is that they all have a 2-range transmission. A 3-range transmission really helps smaller machines make the most of their available power. The B2650 does have a 3-range transmission.

Barring a storage problem, i don't know why anybody would buy a SCUT with the primary mission of being a mower. A zero turn will be faster, give a better cut, and won't cost much more than buying the MMM. Even the lightest of the machines you're talking about is going to be over 2,000lbs even if you take off the FEL....that's a lot of weight on the lawn.

 

[G31]

The problem (in my mind) with the BX25D, 1025R, 2025R, Max 24 and GC 1705 is that they all have a 2-range transmission. A 3-range transmission really helps smaller machines make the most of their available power. The B2650 does have a 3-range transmission.

Barring a storage problem, i don't know why anybody would buy a SCUT with the primary mission of being a mower. A zero turn will be faster, give a better cut, and won't cost much more than buying the MMM. Even the lightest of the machines you're talking about is going to be over 2,000lbs even if you take off the FEL....that's a lot of weight on the lawn.

The BX with FEL and backhoe off is 1410 lb. not too bad for a yard.

I think for some of us, the primary reason is to mow, but we need a machine that can do it all. We don't need the full capability of a CUT though. It's more for maintenance tasks, like light grading and garden-type dirt work, trash/brush removal, or moving gravel and mulch. Occasionally, we do heavy work, but not often enough for the bigger unit. I mow 75% of the time, and would rather have a good 60" MMM than a cheapo ZTR from Lowe's.

 

[williaty]

We bought a JD 1023e this year and I really only compared it to the Kubota due to what dealers are close to me. I am SUPER happy with the 1023e for general yard work, landscaping, moving things around, logging, etc. It's an awesome tool that works really, really well.

With that said, I'm sure most of my use will be for mowing my suburbia half acre, but I'm a total workhorse outside in general. FEL and BH will be used for drain lines, electrical lines, plumbing lines, new tree planting, pole barn building, speading mulch, gravel, etc...

IMO, what you want to do is similar to what we were looking for (though our property is larger). The thing that pushed me to JD was how incredibly easy it is to attach and detach the loader, mowing deck, and BH. While none of those things in any of the brands are as hard to do as the tractors of yore, the JD really is meaningfully easier than the others. Being able to change attachments in 1-2 minutes doesn't sound like much difference than being able to change one in 10 minutes, but the reality is that a 10 minute cycle time will lead to you going "Oh, well I'm only going to do this for a couple of minutes so I'll just leave the other things on here" while a 1-2 minute changeover leads to you having only the right attachment for the job connected to the tractor. With the SCUTs, this is a big deal because having only the right thing hooked up allows you make the most of their limited power, keep them as stable as possible, and keep the weight down as low as possible (which your yard cares about). To me, tool-free attachment changes that are easy on my back was worth the very slight upcharge to go with Deere.

1025R cuts grass horribly

So this requires some clarification. If you mean poor cut quality, I've seen that complaint a LOT. In every case, it came down to one of two things. First, when this line of tractors and decks was first released, almost all dealers had no idea how to set them up to mow well. This resulted in very bad cut quality and the tractors going back to the dealers multiple times. Of course, since the dealer didn't know how to set them up in the first place, sending it back for them to try again didn't make things any better. Eventually, the guys on the forums got a hold of the service manual and learned how to set the mowers up right and suddenly everyone was getting very good results. Seems like most, but not all, dealers have finally figured out how to read a manual as well. Second, a lot of people came from narrower decks with more anti-scalping wheels and were shocked to find out their yard wasn't as flat as their ~40" mowing deck made it seem. Your lawn has to be a LOT flatter to keep a 60" or wider deck from scalping but that's going to be true of everybody's wide deck.

Now, if you're saying you've heard that the 1-series tractors are unpleasant to mow on, well, I kind of have to agree but I suspect that EVERY SCUT will have these problems. First, it just beats the **** out of me. It's rough like falling on your *** again and again and again. As far as I can tell, this is actually because the tractor is better built that the cheap Cub I had before. Stiffer/stronger tires and stiffer/stronger frame means the bumps pound through to your butt harder. Of course, what it really means is that I have a really rough lawn and don't care enough to fix it. Second, with the hood/engine being so much larger, it's harder to follow the uncut edge of the grass to know where to drive. If you lean just slightly to the right, you can see the line just fine as it comes past the front wheel, but I have some spinal problems and leaning to the side like that for a long period of time is impossible for me. Again, I suspect both of these problems are going to be true of all CUTs but it does add up to me really disliking mowing with this tractor.

 

[williaty]

We bought a JD 1023e this year and I really only compared it to the Kubota due to what dealers are close to me. I am SUPER happy with the 1023e for general yard work, landscaping, moving things around, logging, etc. It's an awesome tool that works really, really well.

With that said, I'm sure most of my use will be for mowing my suburbia half acre, but I'm a total workhorse outside in general. FEL and BH will be used for drain lines, electrical lines, plumbing lines, new tree planting, pole barn building, speading mulch, gravel, etc...

IMO, what you want to do is similar to what we were looking for (though our property is larger). The thing that pushed me to JD was how incredibly easy it is to attach and detach the loader, mowing deck, and BH. While none of those things in any of the brands are as hard to do as the tractors of yore, the JD really is meaningfully easier than the others. Being able to change attachments in 1-2 minutes doesn't sound like much difference than being able to change one in 10 minutes, but the reality is that a 10 minute cycle time will lead to you going "Oh, well I'm only going to do this for a couple of minutes so I'll just leave the other things on here" while a 1-2 minute changeover leads to you having only the right attachment for the job connected to the tractor. With the SCUTs, this is a big deal because having only the right thing hooked up allows you make the most of their limited power, keep them as stable as possible, and keep the weight down as low as possible (which your yard cares about). To me, tool-free attachment changes that are easy on my back was worth the very slight upcharge to go with Deere.

1025R cuts grass horribly

So this requires some clarification. If you mean poor cut quality, I've seen that complaint a LOT. In every case, it came down to one of two things. First, when this line of tractors and decks was first released, almost all dealers had no idea how to set them up to mow well. This resulted in very bad cut quality and the tractors going back to the dealers multiple times. Of course, since the dealer didn't know how to set them up in the first place, sending it back for them to try again didn't make things any better. Eventually, the guys on the forums got a hold of the service manual and learned how to set the mowers up right and suddenly everyone was getting very good results. Seems like most, but not all, dealers have finally figured out how to read a manual as well. Second, a lot of people came from narrower decks with more anti-scalping wheels and were shocked to find out their yard wasn't as flat as their ~40" mowing deck made it seem. Your lawn has to be a LOT flatter to keep a 60" or wider deck from scalping but that's going to be true of everybody's wide deck.

FWIW, mine leaves a very pretty lawn with the 54" deck on the 1023e. Not golf course quality but I'm just using it to keep the lawn from getting out of control. It's absolutely going to produce lawns that suburban neighbors are going to approve of.

Now, if you're saying you've heard that the 1-series tractors are unpleasant to mow on, well, I kind of have to agree but I suspect that EVERY SCUT will have these problems. First, it just beats the **** out of me. It's rough like falling on your *** again and again and again. As far as I can tell, this is actually because the tractor is better built that the cheap Cub I had before. Stiffer/stronger tires and stiffer/stronger frame means the bumps pound through to your butt harder. Of course, what it really means is that I have a really rough lawn and don't care enough to fix it. Second, with the hood/engine being so much larger, it's harder to follow the uncut edge of the grass to know where to drive. If you lean just slightly to the right, you can see the line just fine as it comes past the front wheel, but I have some spinal problems and leaning to the side like that for a long period of time is impossible for me. Again, I suspect both of these problems are going to be true of all CUTs but it does add up to me really disliking mowing with this tractor.

 

[Poopdeck Pappy]

The problem (in my mind) with the BX25D, 1025R, 2025R, Max 24 and GC 1705 is that they all have a 2-range transmission. A 3-range transmission really helps smaller machines make the most of their available power. The B2650 does have a 3-range transmission.

Barring a storage problem, i don't know why anybody would buy a SCUT with the primary mission of being a mower. A zero turn will be faster, give a better cut, and won't cost much more than buying the MMM. Even the lightest of the machines you're talking about is going to be over 2,000lbs even if you take off the FEL....that's a lot of weight on the lawn.

Bart, you know that I agree with a lot of your posts and viewpoints. But I've got to disagree with this one.

First, a MMM for a Kubota BX tractor is approx. $2,000 (and I assume the JD and MF versions would be in the same ballpark). Any new ZTR that you can buy for $2,000 would be the cheapest box store version, and would be ready for the scrap heap within 2 years.

Secondly, while I agree that a 3 range transmission is much better than a 2 range, I just don't think it's a big factor for 1.25 acres. If you need power, you put it in low. If you want speed, put it in high. If all else was equal and one tractor had a 2 range and the other had a 3 range, I'd take the 3 range. But it would be a very minor factor for me if I was buying for 1.25 acres. I've got 29 acres and the 2 range transmission on my BX23 doesn't slow me down or limit me in any way.

 

[Poopdeck Pappy]

We bought a JD 1023e this year and I really only compared it to the Kubota due to what dealers are close to me. I am SUPER happy with the 1023e for general yard work, landscaping, moving things around, logging, etc. It's an awesome tool that works really, really well.


IMO, what you want to do is similar to what we were looking for (though our property is larger). The thing that pushed me to JD was how incredibly easy it is to attach and detach the loader, mowing deck, and BH. While none of those things in any of the brands are as hard to do as the tractors of yore, the JD really is meaningfully easier than the others. Being able to change attachments in 1-2 minutes doesn't sound like much difference than being able to change one in 10 minutes, but the reality is that a 10 minute cycle time will lead to you going "Oh, well I'm only going to do this for a couple of minutes so I'll just leave the other things on here" while a 1-2 minute changeover leads to you having only the right attachment for the job connected to the tractor. With the SCUTs, this is a big deal because having only the right thing hooked up allows you make the most of their limited power, keep them as stable as possible, and keep the weight down as low as possible (which your yard cares about). To me, tool-free attachment changes that are easy on my back was worth the very slight upcharge to go with Deere.



So this requires some clarification. If you mean poor cut quality, I've seen that complaint a LOT. In every case, it came down to one of two things. First, when this line of tractors and decks was first released, almost all dealers had no idea how to set them up to mow well. This resulted in very bad cut quality and the tractors going back to the dealers multiple times. Of course, since the dealer didn't know how to set them up in the first place, sending it back for them to try again didn't make things any better. Eventually, the guys on the forums got a hold of the service manual and learned how to set the mowers up right and suddenly everyone was getting very good results. Seems like most, but not all, dealers have finally figured out how to read a manual as well. Second, a lot of people came from narrower decks with more anti-scalping wheels and were shocked to find out their yard wasn't as flat as their ~40" mowing deck made it seem. Your lawn has to be a LOT flatter to keep a 60" or wider deck from scalping but that's going to be true of everybody's wide deck.

Now, if you're saying you've heard that the 1-series tractors are unpleasant to mow on, well, I kind of have to agree but I suspect that EVERY SCUT will have these problems. First, it just beats the **** out of me. It's rough like falling on your *** again and again and again. As far as I can tell, this is actually because the tractor is better built that the cheap Cub I had before. Stiffer/stronger tires and stiffer/stronger frame means the bumps pound through to your butt harder. Of course, what it really means is that I have a really rough lawn and don't care enough to fix it. Second, with the hood/engine being so much larger, it's harder to follow the uncut edge of the grass to know where to drive. If you lean just slightly to the right, you can see the line just fine as it comes past the front wheel, but I have some spinal problems and leaning to the side like that for a long period of time is impossible for me. Again, I suspect both of these problems are going to be true of all CUTs but it does add up to me really disliking mowing with this tractor.

That's a great post with some really good points.

 

[GManBart]

Bart, you know that I agree with a lot of your posts and viewpoints. But I've got to disagree with this one.

First, a MMM for a Kubota BX tractor is approx. $2,000 (and I assume the JD and MF versions would be in the same ballpark). Any new ZTR that you can buy for $2,000 would be the cheapest box store version, and would be ready for the scrap heap within 2 years.

Secondly, while I agree that a 3 range transmission is much better than a 2 range, I just don't think it's a big factor for 1.25 acres. If you need power, you put it in low. If you want speed, put it in high. If all else was equal and one tractor had a 2 range and the other had a 3 range, I'd take the 3 range. But it would be a very minor factor for me if I was buying for 1.25 acres. I've got 29 acres and the 2 range transmission on my BX23 doesn't slow me down or limit me in any way.

Well agreeing all the time would get boring

I wasn't suggesting the ZTR would be the same as a MMM. I said it wouldn't be much more...but I could have been more specific. I was thinking something like a $4K ZTR that would give a very nice cut, be faster than a SCUT, and last for a long time...no need for a commercial unit for that size property.

I'm sure the transmission issue depends on what you're doing with it really. I don't have all that much time on a SCUT, but it always seemed like most of the time low was too low, or high was too high, and something right in the middle would be better. That's why I mentioned that the 2650 has a 3-range tranny. Even machines several times larger seem to spend most of their time in the middle range and they typically have quite a bit of power left over for normal tasks.