120v MIG 3/8" coupon test results

[Arc weld]

I just realized that this is more about gambling than welding. Best 2 out of 3 didn't work so I guess we have to go best 4 out of 6. Here it is in a nutshell er bender:

A bend test was tried by someone praising the virtues of 120 volt MIG's on heaver than recommended plate and it failed, someone with a fair amount more experience than a beginner tried a bend test and it also failed, then we had someone with even more experience and very familiar with bend tests try it and it wasn't only a fail, it was en epic fail. I don't think some people will be convinced when we get to best 500,001 out of million bend tests. Plate bend tests don't allow you to cut the start and stop ends off to make it easier to pass.

What is the point of all this stultilequence (foolish talk,Babble) Don't gamble on pushing the limits of a 120 volt MIG:welcome:

Blade Breaker, welcome to the jungle... we got fun and games.

 

[firemanmike69]

 

[Blade Breaker]

I just realized that this is more about gambling than welding. Best 2 out of 3 didn't work so I guess we have to go best 4 out of 6. Here it is in a nutshell er bender:

A bend test was tried by someone praising the virtues of 120 volt MIG's on heaver than recommended plate and it failed, someone with a fair amount more experience than a beginner tried a bend test and it also failed, then we had someone with even more experience and very familiar with bend tests try it and it wasn't only a fail, it was en epic fail. I don't think some people will be convinced when we get to best 500,001 out of million bend tests. Plate bend tests don't allow you to cut the start and stop ends off to make it easier to pass.

What is the point of all this stultilequence (foolish talk,Babble) Don't gamble on pushing the limits of a 120 volt MIG:welcome:

Blade Breaker, welcome to the jungle... we got fun and games.

Thanks.. I wanted to stop replying but I just couldnt.. Actually it is a good topic and hopefully will help some know more about welding with these types of machines and the limitations. I would recommend for everyone to learn to stick weld. 6010 or 6011 is great for farm repair. May not look the best but much more likely it will dig in and hold.

 

[MinnesotaDaveChalmers]

I just realized that this is more about gambling than welding. Best 2 out of 3 didn't work so I guess we have to go best 4 out of 6. Here it is in a nutshell er bender:

A bend test was tried by someone praising the virtues of 120 volt MIG's on heaver than recommended plate and it failed, someone with a fair amount more experience than a beginner tried a bend test and it also failed, then we had someone with even more experience and very familiar with bend tests try it and it wasn't only a fail, it was en epic fail. I don't think some people will be convinced when we get to best 500,001 out of million bend tests. Plate bend tests don't allow you to cut the start and stop ends off to make it easier to pass.

What is the point of all this stultilequence (foolish talk,Babble) Don't gamble on pushing the limits of a 120 volt MIG:welcome:

+1

Seems a good recap.

Mark's test looks to have been fairly attempted, and although the results were generally predictable, a good use of testing time in my opinion.

 

[Arc weld]

View attachment 391463

That's not even the same test. This is open root full penetration and that's a structural test with a backing bar. Short circuit transfer MIG isn't even approved for structural welding.

 

[Sodo]

A bend test was tried by someone praising the virtues of 120 volt MIG's on heaver than recommended plate and it failed, someone with a fair amount more experience than a beginner tried a bend test and it also failed, then we had someone with even more experience and very familiar with bend tests try it and it wasn't only a fail, it was en epic fail.

Here's my version of recap (to current):

=============

Someone praising the virtues of 120v MIGs (for the members who DON'T HAVE 240v supply) proposed a challenge (to experienced welders) to join heavier than the recommended plate, using all the tricks they could muster. Not just a little heavier than the recommended 3/16" but fully DOUBLE -----> 3/8" thick.

One guy took the challenge, borrowed an old Century 120v MIG and things looked promising, but quit. Another started in on it, but his machine (Lincoln SP-135) couldn't weld more than an inch at full power before shutting down, so quit too, or maybe just went to sleep somewhere peaceful .

So the original someone did it himself (Millermatic 200 inverter). Never having welded a single "test plate" in his life, got somewhat satisfactory results within the first four test plates done EVER, with no assistance. (these were test plates 2 inches wide, not per AWS standards which is 6 or 7 inches) Results inspired a few experienced welders to give it a try (against much opposition).

Someone with a fair amount more experience than a beginner (to put it lightly) tried a single quickie test plate in his spare time after work, got some sections to hold, identified some problems he hoped to address in another attempt. Didn't come up against the Miller 140's (feared) duty cycle on 6 inches long welds.

Then we had someone with even more experience (oops - a professional) and very familiar with bend tests try it, (on a 'bigger' inverter machine, Everlast 140E) varying some conditions and making good notes but is still working on it at this time.

==============

I consider this inspiring, and hope others do too. Not inspiring to set up to "weld heavy plate all day long", but to attach an occasional heavy bracket when necessary. I'd like to see how a pro would overcome the obstacles to weld 3/8" successfully. Even if it requires excessive effort, one can assume that it is seldom occurrence. Also the welds are probably short, such as a bracket. And brackets can often be gusseted for add'l safety.

I do not respect the notion that this info should be withheld for safety reasons, I find that kind of preposterous actually. Tell me how to do it, and why, and by all means include the safety details, but I've got things to do, I wanna know.



TBN served up this ad to me this morning.

 

[roadhunter]

Mark,

Thanks for taking the time to test the welder on 3/8 plate.

To those who continue to derail these threads please stop. Literally every thread about this subject has the same comments about safety and how dangerous this is. There is no danger in welding test plates with a 110v machine. None. Unless you are going to contribute please don't comment.

 

[Mark @ Everlast]

Sodo.
1) I am a professional. I have welded professionally. I've been to school to weld even long after I began welding. I know how to gas weld, TIG weld, MIG weld and Stick weld. I am not the best welder there ever was, but I can usually hold my own from machine to machine, brand to brand.
2) That WAS excessive effort. Very very few people take the pains I did on an everyday joint. Gussets would not help if they are built with the same 140 MIG...and gussets aren't practical, nor are "scabs" in many situations and applications.
3) Debating after several forms of evidence of failure has been presented by people with considerable experience and skill have tried it is not debating...it's malicious arguing and old fashioned contrariness.
4) No one more than me wants to see a 140 plate pass inspection. I'll continue to try several different approaches on this as time allows...but I've already tried the most practical and common approach...that one would normally take to make a passable weld.
5) IF pros are unable to make a passable weld with better training, knowledge and experience, how do you expect an armchair welder to make a passable weld? Better odds at winning the lottery.

 

[ThomasH]

Mark -

Thank you for taking a fair amount of time to both do a weld such as this, and also to document it. The results are instructive for those who want facts...

 

[Sodo]

Sorry, but that was Arcs description of you. Went back and edited to read "professional".

I see a lot of gussets, sometimes just cuz the guy enjoys welding (more). Disagree that "gussets won't help" though some gussets don't need to be there. "Malicious arguing and old fashioned contrariness" is often what propels debate, but here it's more like a peanut gallery, but maybe a little maliciousness. My understanding of the definition of debate may differ from yours. Debate is for issues that can't be proven, whereas in this case there exist many welders who can DO this. The debate part of this is kind of a silly and unnecessary sub-feature.

I do appreciate you pursuing this and I bet many others do too. Understood many have been beatdown by the arguing, and I am surprised that it's me who appears negative. I am the positive one. No need to argue about anything, lets just DO it.

I suspect you are torn between showing what your 140E can do, but don't want to satisfy the now-forum-villain Sodo. Please step back from that, I am not a villain, I'm just a regular guy who knows 120v MIGs are a useful tool for many many projects (who doesn't back down from "silly" opposition).

This is a good debate. The simple fact that there's opposition creates the need for debate part. What possible reason could there be for me "backing down"? Lets see it play out. If you (or Mike) can do it, many will be thankful regardless to SEE what you did, it's interesting. Mark you will get a lot of attention for your 140E, may attract a few entry-level weldORs.

I promise ---> I won't try to weld up an excavator bucket from 3/8" with 120v.