2wd vs 4wd

[Skintback]

After reading sixdogs thread about considering a 2wd tractor, I've been thinking about a few of the points that came up. I also didn't want to hijack his thread so I started a new one.

I live in the Deep South so snow is totally foreign to me. I'm sure that is a major factor when most of you northern guys buy a tracto. I also know that for front end loader work, most people prefer it. Agriculture here means one of two things: beef cows or timber. My family is in the trucking/heavy equipment/logging/diesel mechanic business. It's all I have ever known. Absolutely no row crop agriculture experience other than a garden and food plots.

1. How many people really can't get by without 4wd? I'd bet that very few people truly "need" 4wd especially if you take out the snow factor. Until I bought a 4wd compact, all we have ever had was 2wd tractors that ranged from 18hp - 100hp. I know 4wd is useful with a frontend loader but I also know it does not render a 2wd tractor with loader useless either. Until the last 5 or so years, I have operated lots of 2wd loader tractors and only three 4wd with loaders: a JD 5410 and a CAT 416/420 rubber tired backhoe. Yes 4wd was better but not absolutely necessary. The real reason I bought a 4wd tractor was to make up for it being small and light. It does everything I want it to do and doesn't lack for anything except in the tallest, thickest grass where a few more pto hp would be nice.

2. How many people buy a smaller tractor and include 4wd to make up for size when a little bigger tractor would help? I originally started out wanting a 50hp 2wd tractor like a 5140. A smaller, lighter easier to move tractor is what started me on the compact path.

In hindsight, I still think I made the right decision. I can borrow dads 4020 JD if I need a big tractor but really don't need it. I love my tractor but sometimes wonder if I wouldn't have been just as we'll off with a larger 2wd tractor.

Just a thought....

 

[Sysop]

I remember granddad hooking the horses up to his 2wd tractor to get it up the hill (spinning all the way), and then skiing back down the hill with the back tires hardly turning. I can spin all four AGs taking off from a standstill with my 4wd on these same hills and have about 15-20% slippage throughout the climb, but I don't need horses to get me to the top and my descents are a lot less exciting... If you have mud or hills, 4wd has benefits beyond FEL work.

 

[JOHNTHOMAS]

I don't worry about snow. What little we get goes away in a few hours or at most in a few days but when we do have it I "prefer" 4wd or AWD.
My home property is on a hill side. Going up in some places and going down in most places makes 4wd essential. I have some flat residential rental property I mow and tractor and 2wd is all that is needed.

 

[coondle]

Like many changes in agricultural equipment you can most times get away with whatever the earlier technology was.Tractors changed the way we do a lot of things over the horse drawn days. I can still remember having working horses on the propery I live on, then along came a petrol/kero (Gas/Parrifin is it in the US?) Fordson E27N all of 28 engine horse power. No electrics so had to be hand cranked, could still do it if I had to but believe me I do not want to.
Electrics was the next improvement on our Allis Chalmers WD, we could crank if we wanted to and could now plough at night without being dependent on the full moon.
Boy was there a quantum leap with 3 point linkage, a whole new world of equipment was available and so easy to connect. Trator was a bit small, a Ferguson TE 20 but was an addition and with electrics was the pride of the fleet! and with a trip action front end loader we were just the bee's knees. No faster than a wheelbarrow and a shovel but I did not get as tired so quickly!
Next came a Massey-Ferguson 175 with sunshade and 3 point linkage plus a hydraulic crowd front end loader.
Then a Shiboura SE 4040 4wd, 3PL was added and for a lot of things it did as well as the much bigger 2WD fergie 175.
Now I have a 4WD level lift FEL tractor with ROPS and 3PL quick release gear plus enough lights to dazzle a small village. Had a couple of tractors with A/C cab but do not go much on being hemmed in and cannot listen to the gear. But when very hot or cold I do appreciate the creature comforts then! Still have a Case 2290 2Wd tractor with A/C cab but only use it to seed crop with knife point minimum till setup and to mow with a power-hungry Discbine. Slashing grass (NH 96 mower). baling small square hay, bundling hay and all FEL work is done by the $WD tractors.
Am I overcapitalised for the operation I have?
You bet I am!
But everyone has to cut their cloth according to the $ available, and if that is what you can afford, more power to you for staying in budget and not over committing financially. And if your choice of tractor does what you want and need, you have made the right choice, but I love 4WD for fel work, for mud, and for added safety on hills.
Would I go back to a 2WD fleet?
Not by choice I can tell you.

 

[k0ua]

If I only had 2WD, my tractor would be at the bottom of one these hills. And there it would stay. You have to have it in some locations for safety.

James K0UA

 

[Gary Fowler]

4 WD is not only for safety but for economics. A 4WD tractor doesn't loose as much traction as a 2 WD and therefore burns less fuel per acre when tilling. For mowing, 4 WD isn't a necessity if you aren't on very steep hills. I have all 4 WD equipment including automobiles just because if I need it, it is there. As they say up North, 4 WD doesn't keep you out of the ditches, it just helps you to get back on the road when you end up in one. Same thing for the tractors as most times the front wheel assist will help you to get out of a place that you shouldn't have been in to start with (most times!!!) HOWEVER, if you use the 4 WD to try to go thru deep muck, it usually allows you to get stuck much deeper than a 2 WD.

 

[LD1]

4wd is a must for me. Mainly cause of the loader. We also have snow.

But It also increases pulling force in a smaller and lighter machine for skidding logs or whatever. If no loader, and flat ground, and no snow, sure 2wd would be just as efficient. But not many people have all three of those conditions 100% of the time

 

[buickanddeere]

Can't imagine purchasing another 2WD loader tractor. A challenge in mud, snow or hills . Beats me how some folk brag about how they can "get by" with 2wd, no air conditioning, no standby generator, no regular dental check ups etc.
I don't have a whole lot of time for people who are proud of and tell everybody how little they need.

 

[Bluegill2]

I'm logging in the Ozark Mountains. 4wd lets me use a smaller tractor that works better in the woods here.

I'd rather have a larger 2wd tractor for mowing and don't really need 4wd for box blade use. But when the woods are wet and muddy, 4wd is a must have with smaller rigs...

 

[knotweed]

Use constantly on 20 HP Yanmar. Pulls loads better on hills, front end loader easier to maneuver not to mention constant mud in the woods. Leave it in 4WD all the time except on asphalt roads.

 

[cartod]

They say if you'd flatten out WV it would be bigger than Texas. 4wd is a must around these parts.

 

[nybirdman]

Personally in my neck of the woods(Northern NY) I wouldn't own anything with 4 wheels that wasn't four wheel/all wheel drive.I would rather have it and not need and than not have it.I have owned four wheel drive trucks for forty years.All the large dairy operations around here are 90% or better four wheel drive/cabbed tractors.On the sub-compact and compact tractors its like adding 10 HP.

 

[SPYDERLK]

4 WD is not only for safety but for economics. A 4WD tractor doesn't loose as much traction as a 2 WD and therefore burns less fuel per acre when tilling.

It is a fact that there is less wheel spin with 4wd. The key contributor to efficiency is a secondary effect tho - not as readily perceived. It relates to climbing over vs pushing. In tillage, loose dirt that wheels sink into somewhat is an obstacle. A non driven wheel must constantly push thru it as it rolls. In contrast, a driven wheel climbs over it. You can observe the effect with clarity by seeing what happens as you try to cross a sizable log in both modes.

,,, Another great 4wd FEL plus I havnt seen mentioned is the added traction you have when carrying or when pushing and lifting. Both situations diminish traction of a 2wd tractor.
larry

 

[cartod]

I can't imagine having a loader full of dirt and going down a hill in 2wd. Once the back tires come off the ground it can become deadly quick.

 

[SPYDERLK]

I can't imagine having a loader full of dirt and going down a hill in 2wd. Once the back tires come off the ground it can become deadly quick.

Even trying to back up away from the pile can be an issue on a very slight incline.
larry

 

[AStanton]

Try backing up a dry dirt slope with a loaded bucket. Then tell me how you don't need 4-wheel drive.

 

[TripleR]

After reading sixdogs thread about considering a 2wd tractor, I've been thinking about a few of the points that came up. I also didn't want to hijack his thread so I started a new one.

1. How many people really can't get by without 4wd? I'd bet that very few people truly "need" 4wd especially if you take out the snow factor.

As mentioned in another thread, we use both, not counting our three 4WD SCUTS, we have four 2WD and four 4WD. We have the 4WD as the 2WD just won't do all that needs done on our farms none of which is row cropping or cattle though we have done both. My father in law tried to save a few bucks when he retired and bought a 2WD MF375 with FEL against my advice. Less than two months later, he traded it in on a MF375 4WD, we still have it. It simply did not work in our hill or pulling a heavy no-till planter and it had cast centers and loaded tires. I couldn't afford another tractor, so I used a 2WD on our property and while I got by, for any serious work I had to bring one up from another farm. As soon as I could swing it, I bought a 4WD and took the 2WD out to the flat lands where my brother uses it to mow/bush hog.

2. How many people buy a smaller tractor and include 4wd to make up for size when a little bigger tractor would help? I originally started out wanting a 50hp 2wd tractor like a 5140. A smaller, lighter easier to move tractor is what started me on the compact path.

We have to have power, maneuverability and small foot print in a lot of places, so we actually bought smaller when the bigger tractors just won't fit. We have a use for our 2WD and 4WD, big and small.

Here is a good thread on a happy 2WD owner: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/182437-front-end-loader-2wd-tractor.html

 

[Tx Jim]

Can't imagine purchasing another 2WD loader tractor.

Have you bought a MFWD drive tractor and not fessed up? I can't imagine that you've bragged on NEW MFWD tractor for years and your wife won't let you buy one. I even have a MFWD tractor and I don't have any regular snow fall like you. Only reason I got a MFWD was to get a hyd reverser trans.

 

[Bluegill2]

I can't imagine having a loader full of dirt and going down a hill in 2wd. Once the back tires come off the ground it can become deadly quick.

4WD or 2WD, the back tires should never come off the ground. Ballast always on the 3 pt if the loader is on the tractor...

Try backing up a dry dirt slope with a loaded bucket. Then tell me how you don't need 4-wheel drive.

Backing uphill with a full bucket is really bad on the front axle, especially a 4WD front axle...

 

[sd455dan]

Try backing up a dry dirt slope with a loaded bucket. Then tell me how you don't need 4-wheel drive.

So true- when we bought our first tractor (the 3000 Ford) it was helpless in reverse even with fully loaded 14.9 x 28 AG tires.

But by adding a Gannon box blade (1000#+) and chains for the winter was able to do everything we needed including burying a full size horse when the local backhoe was unavailable... -although it had quite a long ramp...
It sometimes comes down to use what you have or don't get the job done...

Now that we have a larger 4x4 tractor, some jobs are easier, but even plowing snow with the FEL I still use the 2 wheel drive Ford most of the time unless it is raining or dumping snow (the Rhino has a canopy)

For a person on a tight budget - buy the 2 wheel drive in a larger size with a larger loader, weight the tires mount the heaviest 3 point implement you have, and add chains in the winter.

Most of the time you can do as much work as a smaller 4x4 tractor- and in the summer field work comes naturally to larger 2 wheel drive tractors , what did our fathers and grandfathers use before four wheel drive became so popular ?

That's right 2 wheel drive... it makes a great second tractor after being the first tractor:thumbsup: