422 vrs 425

[BobRip]

That thought crossed my mind also. I believe they are the same wheel motors. The 180 is lighter and has narrower tires. So given the wider stance and somewhat heavier 422, it may take away from some of the torque I'm used to.

The 180 has been a great little machine and for half the cost of the 425. I know I come off as bragging some times at what the 180 is Capable of. I don't mean to sound that way. What it really boils down to is... I'm always surprised how well it does everything. I'm sure other 180 owners would agree. Thats what makes me think I would be more than happy with the larger 422.

The jury is still out on a 422 / 425. I also really like the 1430 but, would have to go used on that and hearing some of the horror stories lately. Buying something this size used, I would have to think twice.

My property does not have a lot of hills the only place I would like a little more torque from the wheel motors would be when I use the bucket for digging out our hard clay and shale. Anyway thanks for summing up your experiences.

Barry, I talked to Keith about this (I think it was Keith at PT, anyway the PT sales guy at the time), he stated that professionals would buy the 422/425 (at the time they both had the same wheel motors) and be dissastified after about 2 years of use. This is why PT put the larger wheel motors in. As stated the extra torgue is a big help with bucket work. The wheel motors on the 425 are rated at 3000 PSI versus 1500 on the 422 (correct me if I am wrong). I have considered upgrading the engine on the 422 to around 30 HP, but I feel this would put a lot of strain on the wheel motors. So my most likely purchase is the 425 or a 425 with big wheels and 1430 wheel motors like Mr. Beach has. Again the decision is 3 years away and we will see what happens. Since this is your last tractor, I would check with PT on the 180 versus 422 wheel motors. If they are the same I would definately go with the 425. If I could send $2500 to PT tomorrow and upgrade my wheel motors, engine, and tram pump, I would do it in a heart beat. In your case, you only go around twice in life (two different tractors), pick the one you really love. I don't know what PT sales are like, but I would check and see if they sell the most of the 425. If so that would push me towards it. This means they have more experience with it.
Maybe this will help. When you go up a steep hill with your 180, does the engine bog down first, or the wheels just stop turrning, or do the wheels slip. On my PT 422 the wheels stop and then the engine will stall if I keep pushing the pedal down. I then have to wiggle (left and right steer) to reach the top (if I don't stall the engine of course). If your 180 has the wheels spin, then you have more torque per pound of vehicle than the 422, and you will be more limited by the 422.
Good luck on your decision, I hope this is helping and not confusing. You need to do extensive driving of the 422 to really determine what you should do.

 

[Barryh]

Barry, I talked to Keith about this (I think it was Keith at PT, anyway the PT sales guy at the time), he stated that professionals would buy the 422/425 (at the time they both had the same wheel motors) and be dissastified after about 2 years of use. This is why PT put the larger wheel motors in. As stated the extra torgue is a big help with bucket work. The wheel motors on the 425 are rated at 3000 PSI versus 1500 on the 422 (correct me if I am wrong). I have considered upgrading the engine on the 422 to around 30 HP, but I feel this would put a lot of strain on the wheel motors. So my most likely purchase is the 425 or a 425 with big wheels and 1430 wheel motors like Mr. Beach has. Again the decision is 3 years away and we will see what happens. Since this is your last tractor, I would check with PT on the 180 versus 422 wheel motors. If they are the same I would definately go with the 425. If I could send $2500 to PT tomorrow and upgrade my wheel motors, engine, and tram pump, I would do it in a heart beat. In your case, you only go around twice in life (two different tractors), pick the one you really love. I don't know what PT sales are like, but I would check and see if they sell the most of the 425. If so that would push me towards it. This means they have more experience with it.
Maybe this will help. When you go up a steep hill with your 180, does the engine bog down first, or the wheels just stop turrning, or do the wheels slip. On my PT 422 the wheels stop and then the engine will stall if I keep pushing the pedal down. I then have to wiggle (left and right steer) to reach the top (if I don't stall the engine of course). If your 180 has the wheels spin, then you have more torque per pound of vehicle than the 422, and you will be more limited by the 422.
Good luck on your decision, I hope this is helping and not confusing. You need to do extensive driving of the 422 to really determine what you should do.

No, not confusing at all.

Sounds like some real good advice, since you do own a 422 you would know. My place has no steel hill issues. I do have a slight continuous grade out front enough that when I go off camber it almost feels like the PT might tip but it never does. I do some crawling around back in the woods where there are some pretty deep but, small ravines. This is why I love the small power to size ratio on these tractors.

The 180 crawls right down in up, and out even with a load aboard but, it's not a continuous up hill battle. While digging my pond and it's about two foot deep. The PT would go in and I would have to do the wiggle, to back it out with a full bucket.

My guess would be with your larger pump and added hp, the 422 might equal the wheel torque of the 180, and compensate a little for its weight and size? I don't use my PT to mow the lawn. I like the idea of a dedicated throw away lawn / garden tractor, that way I can keep my hours low and save the PT for other tasks. Heavier loader and related work around the house.

Also this way my wife doesn't get a chance to abuse the PT the way she does our lawn tractor. How strong do you feel that one cylinder is on your 422? I know it takes a lot of abuse on my 180. The PT wiggle with heavy loads backing out of deep holes must put excessive stress on that weld. That is my real concern with the heavier 422.

Along with the wider tires I'm sure there would even more stress evolved. Like you, I'm getting older now and the next PT will be my last, so I'll have to exercise some patience and buy the right one.

You mentioned larger tires. We must be on the same page I have been thinking a taller / larger tire for a little added clearance. I know that may change the top end but, I never use more than half of its speed capabilities anyway. So that's not a none starter for me.

 

[Marks481]

I love my 422, and have seldom encountered situations where I wanted more wheel torque. The sngle steering cylinder actually has an avantage: you don't need to put a "knuckle buster" on the steering wheel, because it is less then a turn from lock-to-lock, so you don't have to rapidly spin the steering wheel while driving.

The disadvantage of the single cylinder is that it obviously concentrates stress, and one individual here has had the steering cylinder mount rip loose in the footwell. PT foolishlessly put a drain hole near the mounting, leaving only a small ligament to support the stress. I frequently take off the deckplate to check for any indication of stress fractures in this area, and will someday probably weld some reinforcements to the cylinder mounts to eliminate that worry. I would like to think that PT has changed their design to eliminate this flaw, but really doubt it, since they don't really seem to listen to this forum or implement feedback into their design.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/power-trac/62158-broken-frame-pt-422-a.html

 

[Barryh]

I love my 422, and have seldom encountered situations where I wanted more wheel torque. The sngle steering cylinder actually has an avantage: you don't need to put a "knuckle buster" on the steering wheel, because it is less then a turn from lock-to-lock, so you don't have to rapidly spin the steering wheel while driving.

The disadvantage of the single cylinder is that it obviously concentrates stress, and one individual here has had the steering cylinder mount rip loose in the footwell. PT foolishlessly put a drain hole near the mounting, leaving only a small ligament to support the stress. I frequently take off the deckplate to check for any indication of stress fractures in this area, and will someday probably weld some reinforcements to the cylinder mounts to eliminate that worry. I would like to think that PT has changed their design to eliminate this flaw, but really doubt it, since they don't really seem to listen to this forum or implement feedback into their design.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/power-trac/62158-broken-frame-pt-422-a.html

Hmmm very interesting thanks for the link also J.J.'s comment about the added push force when turing right, something to think about if digging or carrying a heavy load.

So we have 1 found crack around the weld joint, and two noted failures to date. I wonder if Power Trac has made any notable corrections in this area. Something to ask about if I do decide on a 422.

 

[BobRip]

Barry, my 422 is older and has two steering cylinders. When I bought it I considered the 425, but at that time the wheel motors were the same and three extra horsepower did not seem like much. That was the only difference at the time. No extra lift height.

The big wheel justification is not ground clearance (for me anyway), but more flotation and more wheel torque (am I greedy for wheel torque or what). The negative is that PT has only built one machine like it. I have found in life that if you buy something that a company builds a lot of then it is usually more reliable and has fewer flaws.

 

[KMA]

Wouldn't bigger wheels = less torque? It's like being "geared" higher isn't it?

 

[SnowRidge]

Wouldn't bigger wheels = less torque? It's like being "geared" higher isn't it?

Yes, you gain top speed and lose grunt.

 

[BobRip]

Yes, you gain top speed and lose grunt.

The PT425 big wheel has motors from the 1430. I don't know what this does to the top speed. Certainly your comment above is correct.

 

[SnowRidge]

The PT425 big wheel has motors from the 1430. I don't know what this does to the top speed. Certainly your comment above is correct.

When PT switched to the high torque wheel motors on the PT-425 in early to mid 2003, I think it was, top speed declined slightly. PT eventually dropped the previously stated 8 MPH top speed from their spec sheet. The last time I looked, it was unstated.

 

[KMA]

The PT425 big wheel has motors from the 1430.

Ah... big wheel motors. I was a bit confused, sorry about that.