50 hour Hydro Oil for the non believers

[Tractor Seabee]

I guess there's no point in trying to have an intelligent discussions on the net.
You obviously know it all already... from your kubota. Feel free to not read/ respond to my posts.

It isn't the spirit of this forum to be p-0-ed by disagreements on the posts. When we separate the wheat from the chaff there is a vast knowledge base among our members, yes we sometimes mis-state stuff when we think we know the answers. Maybe you think I was a little curt with that statement but I was attempting to clear up the knowledge base on just that one piece of what has rambled on and gotten out of context with the OP. Changing fluids is just that; fluid subject. If more knowledge of how things work saves some member cash, injury, or establishes a new thought process, it is worth it . I try to keep things as accurate as my 60+ years in the mechanical trades has ingrained in me. A lot of this stuff is based on simple/basic mechanics, physics, chemistry, and a lot of sweat and tears. I learned a lot of this basic stuff in high school science and a couple trade schools I attended so there is some theory mixed in here also along with doing it. If my last post is erroneous I hope someone sets me straight. The consensus appears to be that HSTs are a different breed of cat from the old line machinery we all grew up with (if you my age) I still remember how to hand fit Babbit bearings.

I am still not too old to be humble and even learn a thing or two. I have cut open a filter or two and seen the channelization I mentioned. HYD pumps are positive displacement so every ounce of fluid not dumped by the relief valve has to find a path or break the weakest link in that path.

My apologies if you were offended, meanwhile I will follow the protocol I have established until convinced to do it different. Nothing in this thread has done that yet.

Ron

 

[CJONE]

I admit I mis-posted wording as if hydraulic systems are always return/sump filtered.
My other points/questions still remain. It seems you advocate added/modified filtration systems

Yes I do, especially when you are dealing with the clearances and pressures in a Hydrostat. We have been getting excellent run time on Lenco harvesters with the added offline filtration and added pressure filtration. As far as the manufacturer being notified? Yea after they fail the customer goes somewhere else and when they run they stick with them. After fighting with a mfg for warranty most just move on, it is not like our small tractors. The have to have something that works. I really don't know what you are getting at with the added filtration. If something does not work to a customers/builders satisfaction then it is modified to work. Did I call the last sprayer manufacturer when I added a suction filter to the ground drive hydrostat and added a system relief to one of the control banks, no. Would they really care, no. Not with the piss poor customer service we got when we called Agco that told me they did not care. So no I usually don't call a manufacturer when we mod one of their units. CJ

 

[DeereMann]

CJ,
In addition to dirt, wear particles, & additive depletion, doesn't hydraulic oil also degrade and/or oxidize (heat) over time? Maybe not as often as every 200 hours, but still requires changing?

DM

 

[DeereMann]

On an interesting side note, I bought an old used 82 Oldsmobile once for $500 that had about 160,000 mile on it.

K0ua,
My old man was one of those old timers that didn't 'believe' in preventive maintenance of fluid changes. That was becuase he didn't keep his equipment that long! Anyway, toward retirement, he bought a car he actually kept, but still applied his maintenance 'nonbelief' to it - a '71 Pontic LeMans with Pontiac 400cid V8 & THM400 tranny.

Well, about 90k miles the tranny started slipping & wouldn't shift right. So he takes it to the shop & they tell him "the fluid is varnished, your tranny is toast cause you didn't change fluid or filter". So what does he do? Nothing till it wouldn't shift anymore, then sold it for a junker.

Folks, lubricated machined & wear surfaces require maintenance. We can debate the intervals, but by the time it stops working well it's way too late!

 

[CJONE]

CJ,
In addition to dirt, wear particles, & additive depletion, doesn't hydraulic oil also degrade and/or oxidize (heat) over time? Maybe not as often as every 200 hours, but still requires changing?

DM

The way a Mobile tech explained it to me was the BASE oil does not wear out. In time the additive package is what fails and the oil gets dirty. Shearing, heat, dirt, moisture and whatever is what causes the additive package to fail. Now I would bet you could burn the base oil but I would think something else would be in bad shape before it was on fire! I have Hydraulic oil here that is a 2000 hour oil all the way to a 10,000 hour oil [and the price reflects that!] I can't get to much more into it because I don't know. But when a customer asks I have to know enough to be able to tell them what the best oil for their application is and the most cost effective oil for THEM is. Anyway I am always learning but it is hard to keep the hearsay out of the facts sometimes. CJ

 

[k0ua]

K0ua,
My old man was one of those old timers that didn't 'believe' in preventive maintenance of fluid changes. That was becuase he didn't keep his equipment that long! Anyway, toward retirement, he bought a car he actually kept, but still applied his maintenance 'nonbelief' to it - a '71 Pontic LeMans with Pontiac 400cid V8 & THM400 tranny.

Well, about 90k miles the tranny started slipping & wouldn't shift right. So he takes it to the shop & they tell him "the fluid is varnished, your tranny is toast cause you didn't change fluid or filter". So what does he do? Nothing till it wouldn't shift anymore, then sold it for a junker.

Folks, lubricated machined & wear surfaces require maintenance. We can debate the intervals, but by the time it stops working well it's way too late!

What is interesting is that the TH400 tranny was a pretty tough machine. This was a 72 not an 82, I fat fingered the keyboard, but in any case, I was surprised that the car went as far as it did without transmission service. The engine did not use any oil between changes, or very little, and did not smoke, and ran very well. What I found interesting was how he did so well in changing engine oil, and totally ignored the transmission. Of course he ignored the exterior and interior as well! The paint was oxidized, and had a hole in the skin of passenger door. Hey it was a $500 car that I probably gave too much for anyway!

 

[grm61]

What is interesting is that the TH400 tranny was a pretty tough machine. This was a 72 not an 82, I fat fingered the keyboard, but in any case, I was surprised that the car went as far as it did without transmission service. The engine did not use any oil between changes, or very little, and did not smoke, and ran very well. What I found interesting was how he did so well in changing engine oil, and totally ignored the transmission. Of course he ignored the exterior and interior as well! The paint was oxidized, and had a hole in the skin of passenger door. Hey it was a $500 car that I probably gave too much for anyway!

Probably alot of folks may have changed their trans oil more often if there was a drain plug and didn't have to pull the pan full of oil and try not to pour it all over the place:banghead:

 

[ray66v]

Probably alot of folks may have changed their trans oil more often if there was a drain plug and didn't have to pull the pan full of oil and try not to pour it all over the place:banghead:

There is a drain plug on my Villager trans. :thumbsup:

I don't pull the pan anymore. The screen, (there is no filter), hasn't ever been dirty.

I just drain out 5 qts, and add 5 qts.

 

[k0ua]

Probably alot of folks may have changed their trans oil more often if there was a drain plug and didn't have to pull the pan full of oil and try not to pour it all over the place:banghead:

My brother in law always felt the best way to do it was to take an ice pick to the pan and knock a hole in it up on a lift, and get the engine oil drain pan stand under it. then when it quits dripping take off the pan, and change the filter and clean the clutch crud out of the pan, braze up the hole, replace gasket and put it back on. Fill withe fluid etc.. He said that was the cleanest way..

 

[CJONE]

My brother in law always felt the best way to do it was to take an ice pick to the pan and knock a hole in it up on a lift, and get the engine oil drain pan stand under it. then when it quits dripping take off the pan, and change the filter and clean the clutch crud out of the pan, braze up the hole, replace gasket and put it back on. Fill withe fluid etc.. He said that was the cleanest way..

I would kinda do the same thing but drill a hole, let it drain, then weld in a drain plug kit with the pan off. CJ