580C 1979 brake issues

[Marchetti]

Hey guys and gals
When I bought this beast it really only had the right brake working. And it worked well. I have been using it a lot in the past two months.
I did check the fluids in the masters and noticed that the left brake pedal ( the middle one) Did not move ANY fluid when I looked down inside the master.
OH well I have one really good brake. I think to myself. Well now that pedal is to the floor as well. It will work poorly and with great pedal pressure.
I'm thinking it is not the pads cause it quit in a second.
So what to do first? I tried to bleed after a hr and a half of trying to get the floor out..%#@#$#!!
Bleeding was useless.
The other master does bubble when depressed.
I ordered a new master (1) and a slave for starters. Do you guys think I should change both? Might as well right?
Can't imagine why the left brake quit like that so quickly.
Looks like hydraulic fluid not brake fluid. Thought it called for brake fluid Dot 4???
Any help would be much appreciated. step by step. This is my first yellow steel machine
dan

 

[DJ54]

If the pedal went to the floor all of a sudden, I have to guess either you popped a brake line, or the brake cylinder is stroked out as far as it will go, and the brake needs adjusted. If the brake faded gradually, I'd have to guess it needs adjusted. They do have automatic brake adjusters, but like on some cars, don't work the best. If it went all of a sudden, It could be any component from the MC, to the BC. Hopefully not a brake line, as they are pretty pricey. Enough, the metal lines alone were so much, I bought a tool to make double flare's, and a roll of Ni-Copp line & nuts, for less money. If ever you need the rubber flex line between the metal line, and the brake cylinder, buying one through Case/IH Ag. is $10 less, and it's also still pretty pricey.

If those are the original master cylinders, they should have brake fluid in the system. They started using Hy-Tran in the D series, for fluid.

You may want to look at the brake assemblies, and look for signs of fluid loss. If there is none, then it could be the Master Cylinder, or brake cylinder have given up the ghost.

If you decide to order a new MC and BC for the other side, it may be worth your time to check prices here:Remanufactured Transmissions, Torque Converters, Engines - Joseph Industries Even shipping that far here from Ohio may save you a few bucks.

Here is a link to Case Construction, and I've already got it to the page for the 580C parts manual. Select a component, and it will show an exploded view of it, with parts numbered, and description at right. If you select a local dealer, it will also show the price at Case Construction. I pretty well just use it for the part numbers, to search for aftermarket parts. Official Case Construction Equipment Online Parts Store and Parts Look Up. Parts for Case Equipment and Construction Equipment. Parts Store for Case Wheel Loaders, Case Excavators, Case Skid Steers, Case Original Parts.

 

[Marchetti]

Its not a blown line. Has to be a master both or the slave ie BC. No leaks anywhere. Does the middle pedal work the left brake when disconnected from the far left pedal??. Differential braking right. Do I just have to take out the dash to get to them or the whole enchilada??
Thx Dan

 

[DJ54]

My 480C only has 2 brake pedals, but the service manual shows the far right pedal being the master pedal, for both brakes, then the middle pedal is the right brake, left pedal, left brake.

Yes, instrument panel needs to be removed, to get them out. The previous owner of my 480, cut a huge oblong hole in the left dash cowl, to get in from the side. It does make it easy, but looks like the devil.

I don't know if you have a ROPS, or full cab. My 480C has a ROPS. I ended up removing the right fender to get to the brake assembly. The left was easy to get to, with the floor panel removed. Not enough room for me to stand on my head to work on the right, and pretty high for me to reach from the ground underneath. With the fender removed, I could walk right up to it, and do what I needed to. It was well worth the extra 45 minutes, to an hour to take it off, as the slave cylinder, brake lines, and adjustment were all on top. But, I also have an overhead I-beam, with several chain hoists on trolleys, to make things like that a lot easier. All depends on what you have to work with.

 

[Marchetti]

Well no hoists but long arms. By inst panel you mean the cluster right. Done that..easy

 

[DJ54]

Yep, the cluster... Short arms here, and I don't bend/manuver like I did 35-40 years ago...

 

[Marchetti]

OK SO I GOT TWO NEW MASTERS AND SLAVES...LOL...
BENCH BLED THE MASTERS BEST I COULD
HOOKED IT ALL BACK UP AND STARTED TO BLEED
IT SEEM TO ME THAT I'M GETTING A STEADY STREAM OF FLUID,BUT THE PEDALS WON'T PUMP UP
THEY DID WHEN I HAD THE BIG SPRINGS OF THE BACK NEAR THE SLAVE BUT ONCE I PUT THAT BACK ON, DOWN TO THE FLOOR
IT DOES MOVE THE ENTIRS BRAKE ASSEMBLY QUIT A BIT COMPARED TO BEFORE. MEANING BACK AT THE SLAVE AREA, WHEN I DEPRESS THE PEDALS THERE IS QUITE A BIT OF MOVEMENT. I WOULD EXPECT THAT. BUT.. THE PEDALS ARE SOFT. IM MISSING SECTION 7025 IN MY REPAIR CD.
WHAT AM I MISSING GUYS. I NEED HELP!!!
DAN

MAYBE TRY PUMPING FLUID BACK UP TO THE MASTER AND JUST DEAL WITH THE MESS. THAT IS HOW IDO IT ON CARS. I BOUGHT A VACCUMM BLEEDER BUT ITS USELESS ON THE TRACTOR.

 

[DJ54]

I'm thinking you need to adjust the brakes up. Sounds like the slave cylinder is reaching full max. stroke, but not activating brake assembly. Manual calls for .375", or 3/8" of stroke movement free travel, from compressed, to full release. If it is moving a lot, then adjustment needs snugged. The manual says, that rocking that arm, it SHOULD self adjust.

More than likely, as mentioned, the self adjuster is not working, and you'll have to turn the adjusting nut down manually. Ratchet arm that is supposed to turn the nut, could be hung up, threads below nut dirty, or corroded.

You may even have to go as far as pulling the brake assembly, and cleaning it out, and make sure internals are free, and no broken springs. Mine had a lot of sediment in it, I assume from the rear wheel throwing muddy water on it, and running in, leaving dirt & dust when it dried.

If working properly, they are very good & smooth brakes. If need be, mine will lock & slide the wheel, if enough pressure is applied, smoothly, but not grabby.

 

[Marchetti]

I did have to turn the adj knob in. What I dont get is if I unhook the peddles to allow left or right braking. The left pedal works the right wheel..? So Im confused about that. Regardless It works much better now . Even the patking brake works again. I sprayed and brushed off as much as I could on yhe racket system. Springs are still there. I could not bring myself to disassemble the whole brake assembly. I have brakes!. Maybe not perfect, but ok for me. My body could not take t he contortions. Lol
Thx very much for your help.
DAN

 

[DJ54]

Maybe they will snug up, over time, if the ratchets start working.

Definitely sounds like someone crossed lines for some reason.

Understand about the contortions... I did mine in the winter in the shop, getting ready for Spring, so there was no hurry. That's why I removed the right fender to get in to it. Much, much easier..!!