Alternator appears to have quit after bath

[zogman]

My alternator seems to no longer charge on my Kama TS354C after I washed her. I have survived by charging the battery periodically for the last couple of months but I need to find the problem. Any ideas other than the alternator is toast? If it is the alternator how do I verify that? I'm hoping for some tremendously simple cure like a corroded ground. Any takers?

 

[joerocker]

Test it...see if it's putting out voltage. Test it right at the alternator at about 2000 RPM. If no voltage...you'll know...

 

[greg_g]

I have survived by charging the battery periodically for the last couple of months ...

I believe you've answered your own question. Not likely washing the tractor had much to do with charging.

With the tractor not running - ignition switch off - measure DC voltage between the + and - posts of the battery. Start the tractor. Measure again. Charging voltage sent to an otherwise OK battery should be about 1.2 volts higher than the first measurement.

Unfortunately, that check doesn't determine whether the problem is with the alternator or the battery (bad battery not accepting charge or bad alternator not sending enough charging voltage). To narrow it down further, you should have the battery load tested. If the battery is healthy enough to accept a charge, THEN it's time to suspect the alternator.

//greg//

 

[RonMar]

Does your tractor have an amp gauge? I am not specifically familliar with your tractors electrical system, but If it has an amp gauge, the charge path to the battery is back thru the instrunment panel. You could have a bad connection somewhere along the way.

Like Joerocker says, I would first check for output voltage at the alternator connection with the engine running. I would think that anything above about 1000 RPM should get you a little over 14V at the alternator output. The typical automotive battery charge/maintance voltage is around 14.5VDC so the alternator should be capable of outputting near this. If you are getting this, then you are most likley have wiring issues between alternator and battery.

You may also have a fuse that feeds the voltage regulator. If there is an issue with this circuit, the voltage reg may not be functioning properly. If someone can point me to a schematic of your tractors wiring, I can probably give you some specific things to look for.

 

[mit]

i had a charging problem and it was the alternator not putting out the correct volts.i found it was difficult to determine whether it was a wiring problem or the regulator or the alternator.i was just able to know it was not charging by doing the voltage test of the battery with the tractor off and then on.the difference in the volts will tell u if it is charging.then u will have to swap parts to get it to work.make sure that the alt pulley is not slipping.

 

[bluechip]

Many auto parts have a tester for alternators. it is cheaper to replace the regulator first if you go the parts swap route We have sold a few regulators and very very few alternators.

 

[greg_g]

Many auto parts have a tester for alternators. it is cheaper to replace the regulator first if you go the parts swap route We have sold a few regulators and very very few alternators.

But the problem described involves battery charge Chip. A voltage regulator isn't typically in the battery charging circuit. The charge state of the battery is what controls demand from the alternator.

//greg//

 

[bluechip]

I may be all wrong, but here is my story and I'm sticking to it. Most chinese tractors use external voltage regulators. The charge condition of the battery will determine the draw (amps) on the alternator but the voltage regulator controls the voltage (push). You need a properly working voltage regulator to keep from applying too much (or not enough) voltage to the battery. My shop battery charger has a "boost activate" position which jumps the voltage up and can sometimes force a totaly dead battery to draw amps. By totally dead, I mean a battery that won't draw any amperage when charged normally. In any case, at around $15.00, the voltage regulator is often the first part to be swapped to attempt to cure a charging problem, rather than the alternator that costs more than 5 times that much. Many auto parts stores can test alternators. If the battery takes and holds a charge using a charger, and a voltage regulator swap doesned cure the problem it is a fairly safe bet it is the alternator. that is unless a wire came loose. Since we sell many times more regulators than alternaotors, I'm thinking they fixed the problem. Battery charging problems are about the only motivation for someone to replace either part.

Say that tractor wasn't washed with a pressure washer was it? if so check for loose wires. those things can put out a lot of force and move things around pretty agressively.

 

[zogman]

Chip, I did use a pressure washer but I was really careful with where I sprayed. I wanted to degrease and paint the engine after the head gasket replacement. In any case I checked all the connections, cleaned and re-connected with dielectric grease. I checked voltage, just the battery with engine off and got around 8 volts ( I havent charged it in a while either so I'm not sold on the battery being bad yet), I started the engine and the volt meter showed 8 volts at the alternator I'm guessing I just completed the circuit with the ignition switch in the on position. With the engine off I got 0 volts at the alternator. I'm going to take the battery out and get it checked this week and rule that out. The amp meter shows there is a draw on the system when I run the lights glow plugs etc... but never bumps over to the plus side when the engine is running.

 

[3RRL]

Rob,
I'll bet your battery is probably OK.
If it turns out to be the alternator and not just the voltage regulator, consider an upgrade in the alternator if you have to replace it. Do you have any plans to run additional work lights or headlights ever? What about an electric winch? Anything like that in the future?

 

[zogman]

Rob,
I'll bet your battery is probably OK.
If it turns out to be the alternator and not just the voltage regulator, consider an upgrade in the alternator if you have to replace it. Do you have any plans to run additional work lights or headlights ever? What about an electric winch? Anything like that in the future?

Hi WC Rob,

I do want to add a couple of flood lights to the ROPS eventually and I saw a post here recently about a GM replacement that incorporates the voltage regulator. If the alternator turns out to be bad I do want to see what all is involved in the upgrade. Have you replaced yours yet?

 

[RonMar]

Hi WC Rob,

I do want to add a couple of flood lights to the ROPS eventually and I saw a post here recently about a GM replacement that incorporates the voltage regulator. If the alternator turns out to be bad I do want to see what all is involved in the upgrade. Have you replaced yours yet?

If you read thru the jinma powered mazda pickup thread, I asked Dan what he used for an alternator and I think he said that a particular mazda alternator(forget which one) was nearly a direct bolt on...

 

[bluechip]

Sometimes there is a problem with installing the alternators with internal voltage regulators because the regulator only engages at a certain rpm. We put one on an 8N ford and had to put a pushbutton to make the alternator charge. a smaller pully might have worked, but the standard pully and low rpm of a tractor engine just didn't work together. This was a GM/Delco unit, the mazda unit may be different.

 

[mit]

20-102-1 new one wire alternator. this one may bolt on. dont know how it will work.

 

[Bob Rooks]

I installed a 72 amp Delco 12SI alternator on my dozer with theTY395 engine.
If you go this route, I recommend getting the unit with the closed-face pulley fan to help keep dust from going through it. The 12SI has a larger frame and more capacity than the 10SI, but the 2" mounting spools are the same, and they require no modification for installation. In fact, I even used the Chinese pulley - exact fit.
I chose the 12SI because I'm running a 3,000 lb. electric winch, five 55w halogen floodlights + two on the backhoe, and a 2kW-120vac inverter. I will also be adding a heater after I enclose the ROPS.
There are pictures and details over on CTOA.

 

[3RRL]

Hi EC Rob,
No, I have not changed mine yet.
I have the KM554 so I don't know if the OEM alternator is any better than yours? That's why I'm as interested in these replies as you are. So I'm listening too.

BTW, I squirt my engine down too but I don't use a power washer. I use a regular hose nozzle set to a high stream and that seems to work pretty good. It also doesn't hurt the electrical stuff either.

 

[GuglioLS]

Zogman

Not sure if your OEM alternator mount is the same or similar to a Jinma 354 with TY395 engine? Does it look something like this;?



If so, then you can install a GM type with a smaller pulley, so RPM's are not an issue. I installed one on my Jinma 354LE tractor (TY395 engine), just like Bob Rooks did. Mine is an open frame, It's been in operation for a year now (dusted it out once with compressed air). My 3 YO battery is always fully charged and it has not fried so it's a proven fact that it works. WC Rob saw it in person. If your interested I can post all the details with pictures here for you to check it out, just say the word.


Larry

 

[zogman]

Zogman

Not sure if your OEM alternator mount is the same or similar to a Jinma 354 with TY395 engine? Does it look something like this;?


Here is what my alternator setup looks like, it appears to be the opposite of yours. I found an alternator that is essentially a reman GM 12Si - 94Amp unit (model # 7294 @ partsamerica)for around $78 with no core charge. I need to do a little more research to make sure it will work.

 

[Bob Rooks]

It appears that your alternator is just under-slung and has a cast iron mount. If the mounting foot (spool) is 2" wide it should work fine, although the 12SI is going to be a larger overall diameter by about 1-1/2". The Chinese pulley is a perfect fit on the 12SI alternator shaft.

The OEM alternator is TEFC (Totally Enclosed Fan Cooled) and should be pretty much dust proof and water resistant. Prestolite makes a 45A TEFC one-wire self-exciting alternator designed specifically to retrofit construction equipment and for off-road use.

Larry, did you make that sheet metal belt shroud? Looks great!

 

[mit]

http://www.alhttp://www.nationsautoelectric.com/
20-102-1 new one wire alternator
alternator and adaptors if needed.check out the amperage on your alternator the gm one rating may be higher so u can run more stuff off it .like flood lights.