Are these prices reasonable?

SpinyMouse · Mar 11, 2004

My local Kioti dealer here in central NH is quoting $13,700 for a CK20HST with FEL and $14,750 for an LK3054 also with FEL. How do these prices stack up?

He wasn't very keen on the CK20. He says he feels they are underpowered because they bog down when you accelerate sharply in hi range, even with the throttle on full. What do you think?

I drove both and moved some gravel around with the FELs. The CK20HST was definitely easier to control, but the LK3054 clearly had more power. The 30 horse machine is probably more than I need, but with only $1k difference, it sure is tempting to go with the larger machine. Who knows, my "needs" may increase as time goes on. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

SpinyMouse · Mar 11, 2004

Oh, he also suggested I not wait because once these sell, it will cost me an extra $1500 shipping to order one.

Does this make sense? I mean, they don't add a separate shipping charge for those already on the lot, yet they want to charge shipping to a customer who wants one that isn't on the lot. Isn't the cost to the dealer the same?

To20Chris · Mar 11, 2004

I just went through the same decision & ended up with the LK3054. The price difference was about $2k in my case, so it looks like you may have a good deal. What FEL is on the LK? I have a Rhino 2408 on mine, perhaps that accounts for some of the difference. I was dead set on getting a hydro, but when it came down to it, I liked the feel of the shuttle unit better, and the fairly modest price increase seemed well worth it. It's still a tough choice, as I liked the CK20.

cag · Mar 11, 2004

[He wasn't very keen on the CK20. He says he feels they are underpowered because they bog down when you accelerate sharply in hi range, even with the throttle on full. What do you think?

color:red] 

Maybe Kiotijohn or Dewave among others CK20 owners, will be able to answer you on that. I'll be looking forward to the feedback. Good Question. I haven't bought one yet, but I'm very insterested in the CK20. Thanks cag.

pilonidal · Mar 11, 2004

I'd have to say that $1500 extra to order one is a bunch of Horse@#$%. I got a rock bottom price on a CK20HST with FEL and MMM for $12,650. Another dealer quoted me $15,000 and another was higher than that. I am going 90 miles for mine.

Dewave · Mar 11, 2004

He says he feels they are underpowered because they bog down when you accelerate sharply in hi range, even with the throttle on full. 

Take any gear tranny tractor put it in high range, full throttle and pop the clutch and see what happens. Usally puffs of black smoke, a groan and moan and then up to speed. Thats what the CK20 would do as well, I guess. I rarely use it because it is pretty fast and bumps my FEL/BH and me around pretty good. I would agree the high range does put extra strain on the 21 HP when taking off. I operate my CK20 at around 2000-2200 rpm's with no problems. If it needs anything it would be a middle gear between the low and high. The CK25-30 will have that gear setup.

GerardC · Mar 12, 2004

I would rather have power I don't use rather than not enough.

KiotiJohn · Mar 12, 2004

Hi SpinyMouse and welcome to TBN. First, make sure you would be getting the newest LK3054XS at that price, not the older model. I have the CK20HST and when using the high range, you generally don't really have a problem with the lower power unless you keep the wheel turned all the way to left or right which you don't do often, and it is only just when you get started. Most of the time when working, you will be in low range and there is no problem. Also, if the RPM is up, the problem is really not bad at all. I don't find it to BE a problem AT ALL. The little CK is very powerful, and does many many jobs around my properties. I bush hog, Load, dig, use a landscape rake, boxblade, boompole, toothbar, pallet forks and get all my jobs done with few exceptions. As for the prices, they don't seem out of order for New England which tends to be higher. I just got a quote for a friend on an LK 3054XS with the Kioti loader: Here is a paste from the e-mail from the dealer:
OK-- LK3054 List Price $14235.00 Sell at $12,099.00

KL1230 Loader with a 60" Bucket List $3245.00 Sell at $2758.00
This is more than your price for the 3054, if it is an XS, the newer model.
I paid $9985 for the CK20 and $1985 for the KL120 Loader. So, at $11970, cheaper than your quote. You would be quite happy with either tractor, if the 3054 is the XS model (gear shift next to the steering wheel, not on the platform) If it's not, the price is a little high, and I would prefer to have the newer model with it's improvements, larger clutch assembly, better placement of gear shift, higher hydraulic capacity etc. You would adapt to either type transmission and in a little while be very proficient with either of them. I don't think I like your dealer and his pressure tactics. The statement about paying $1500 shipping is total crap as you NEVER should have to pay shipping unless you're buying from an out of area dealer. Also, you should check to see if this dealer is going to deliver to your home for free or not. Be wary of anyone who trys to pull that crap. Hope this helps, John

SpinyMouse · Mar 12, 2004

Thank you gentlemen for all your candid and thoughtful comments.

I also thought that $1500 shipping charge was out of line, but being new to tractors I didn't know if it was just an industry standard that I would have to put up with. Thanks for setting me straight.

The 3054 is an older model with the shift on the floor. But I still enjoyed the test drive. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

As for the bogging issue on the CK20HST, you guys are right. Pop the clutch in high gear on any machine and it will bog and lug. And that pedal on the tractor shifts the transmission rather than throttling the engine, something the dealer seemed a little confused on.

I know of one other KIOTI dealer at a reasonable distance from me. I think I'll go visit him too.

wallace · Mar 12, 2004

KIOTIJOHN, You are beinging a little harsh on us dealers, every consumer pays shipping on their tractor, It is just a matter of how the dealers choises to tell the customer wether it is in the purchase or seperate line on the bill of sale, and the harder you beat a dealer up the first time around he will be you back some where down the road. Just remember we are doing this to make a living and wether we make are living on selling tractors parts or service, We have to eat too! Now some dealers are out of price range, but that is why we have sites like this to see where we stand! I prefer to give the best all around price on everything instead of giving away a tractor and charging you $50.00 on a oil filter! Also like everybody says shipping prices to the northeast are much higher it costs me around $500/$800 to get a tractor to my lot and I am in Pa. unless of corse I buy a full load of about $150,000.00 and then I can devide my shipping cost over a bunch of different products.

SpinyMouse · Mar 12, 2004

Oh, I don't mind paying for the shipping. Like you said, the dealer is trying to earn a living and I don't expect a free lunch.

What bothered me was paying that extra money above what he charges for machines already on the lot.

In any case, I'm not in a hurry and can easily wait until what I want shows up on the lot again in the future. That way, this would become a moot point with that dealer and there is no need to even discuss it with him. It's nice having time on my side.

TomK · Mar 12, 2004

This discussion is very timely. I'm going to look at the CK20 and 3054xs today. Over the phone he quoted me $12,900 for the CK20hst and $15,500 for the 3054xs. He also has Century's and I think its TWN's?

TomK · Mar 12, 2004

Ok, I just got back from the dealer. 80 miles each way. He wanted $15,950 for a 3954sx with 1230 FEL, 60" bucket, Industrial tires filled with calcium and a 72" 1572 Land Pride box blade, free delivery. He added $450 for the R4 tires. That sounded like a lot to me. /forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif This a little higher than the out of state dealers, but at least he's a little closer. Does this sound like a good price? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

KiotiJohn · Mar 12, 2004

Wallace, I don't remember mentioning any dealers other than the one Spinymouse went to. I have searched tractors for years, and I have NEVER had a dealer tell me I was going to have to pay shipping on my tractor. That dealer was obviously using it as a pressure sales tactic, at least I would take it that way, and LEAVE. You know by what I paid that I did not try to BEAT my dealer down to the last penny. I never even argued price with him. I asked how much, he said ... and I said I'll take it. I could have done better by shopping and bargaining, but I didn't feel it was necessary and I liked the dealer. I know several others who've done better on price than I, but it's not important. But I wouldn't stand for a dealer telling me, "You better buy it now, or it will cost you $1500 extra next time." That dealer had paid for shipping on the tractor he had on the lot didn't he? Why would it then cost $1500 a little later? Pressure Sales. I hope you don't deal that way. John

powerstroke2000 · Mar 12, 2004

( That dealer was obviously using it as a pressure sales tactic, at least I would take it that way, )

Did you ever think it would cost that much to get tit to New hampshire. If the one he has came on a full load then it is like wallace said you get a price break,we do you can get about 12 smaller tractors on one load.If he has to order just one tractor then he has to pay the higher price to get it shipped. It cost us $500 to get one DK65C shipped when we added a DK55 to it it went to $400ea we waited a week until they had a load coming to Ohio it cost us $250ea in this cae a full load was 4 tractors so if you get 12 tractors in a crate you can see how the price would be a lot cheaper.The ck20's come stacked 2 high and 2 wide on the truck

krazykioti · Mar 13, 2004

Before I bought my DK I would compare prices on Ebay & Trader Online to find out the going rate for the tractor I wanted to purchase. I paid $17,800 for a DK45 with a Woods FEL . The dealer shipped it to my home 70 miles away for no extra charge.I did not dicker over the price,what I paid was what they quoted me.Sometimes you luck out!

Charlie

KiotiJohn · Mar 13, 2004

And tell us, don't you just love that tractor? I sat one recently, and it sure is fine. Are you going to post some pics of it from around your place? I love the photos of other people's tractors. Thanks, John CK20Shots

wallace · Mar 14, 2004

I don't think I deal that way, at least I have not had any complants yet. I think I give a fair price on everything. I have been in business since April of last year and I have sold 38 units. I have all the big guys close to me like JD, NH,Cub,Kubota. I was told by my sales rep that in 2002 the combined dealers in my area sold a total of 47 units so with that said I must be doing something right.

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

KiotiJohn · Mar 14, 2004

See there Wallace, you're smarter than the other dealer and see that you don't have to push/pressure someone into buying by threatening to charge $1500 for shipping. Obviously the tractors that guy has had to be shipped in, and he had included that in the price, but just to try to push Spinymouse into buying right then, he throws out the huge shipping charge. I'm glad you're not like that, and I kinda figured you weren't. John

cptdave · Mar 16, 2004

Call Upper Valley Tractor in Enfield NH and ask for Dave. My buddy and I bought CK-20's this month. I spoke with all the Kioti dealers in NH and he was almost $2500 less and he delivered the tractor on a Sunday. Enjoyed the experiencce.

The "Big" Kubota dealer wanted $19,950 for the 7510 equally equipped. When I asked if he would negotiate price he said "I can't slow down long enough to deal. If I give you a deal your friends will want a deal."
My friend and I bought from Kioti.
Cpt Dave