Aren't you the lucky one(s)

[Wayne County Hose]

She's an attorney with a very successful practice. He's a cardiologist. I wonder how many half priced triple bypass surgeries he's done this week?

Funny, usually the people that have the problem with price have the most money. That's my experience anyway.

 

[WilliamBos]

She's an attorney with a very successful practice. He's a cardiologist. I wonder how many half priced triple bypass surgeries he's done this week?

Holy Smokes!! Maybe they should price out the same equipment as you use. Once they find out just how much it costs, maybe they will wake up and realize your price was fair.

 

[N80]

She's an attorney with a very successful practice. He's a cardiologist. I wonder how many half priced triple bypass surgeries he's done this week?

You might be surprised. Some physicians do a tremendous amount of work for no charge at all. I know that for a fact. And she is required by the Bar to do a certain amount of pro bono work (though that might be an urban legend).

But that's not my point. I don't think how much money someone has is relevant to what they are willing to or should be willing to pay for goods and services. If they are jerks then they're jerks and it certainly sounds like this guy is one in a big way. And while I think generosity is one of the finest character traits, I probably think less of rich people who throw their money around than rich people who are careful with what they have.

And rich is relevant. There's always someone poorer are richer than you or me. And its always easy for someone who has less than you to judge you on what they think you have.

 

[cityfarma]

I have not read the whole thread so I hope this has not been said already. I am reminded of a notice in a shop that went along the lines of

"I won't try to compete with other businesses on price. After all who better to know the value of their service."

Cityfarma

 

[Farmwithjunk]

You might be surprised. Some physicians do a tremendous amount of work for no charge at all. I know that for a fact. And she is required by the Bar to do a certain amount of pro bono work (though that might be an urban legend).

But that's not my point. I don't think how much money someone has is relevant to what they are willing to or should be willing to pay for goods and services. If they are jerks then they're jerks and it certainly sounds like this guy is one in a big way. And while I think generosity is one of the finest character traits, I probably think less of rich people who throw their money around than rich people who are careful with what they have.

And rich is relevant. There's always someone poorer are richer than you or me. And its always easy for someone who has less than you to judge you on what they think you have.

I'm not suprized at all. I know quite a few doctors and lawyers. I know what they're capable of. I also know what SOME of the greedy ones are capable of, and that's what these folks strike me as being. NOTHING is good enough for them. NOTHING is cheap enough for them. NO ONE is worthy of their attention. Well, one old guy I know of sure didn't cave in to their demands

I don't pay too much heed to a persons wealth or their lack of such. That has NOTHING to do with their character or lack of such.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Holy Smokes!! Maybe they should price out the same equipment as you use. Once they find out just how much it costs, maybe they will wake up and realize your price was fair.

Way back when, I used to believe people like this just didn't understand. Or else they just weren't all that smart. But the farther I made my way through life I began to realize most of them were very much aware of what it cost to operate a business. They knew full well what to expect as far as a "fair price". They just took on the approach that they'd ACT ignorant, pretend to expect the moon and the stars for peanuts, and some people would crack under pressure and GIVE 'em what they want. A "Whatta I have to lose" attitude. If I thought they were "ignorant", I'd probably have a little sympathy. Knowing that they were TRYING to play me, I have an obligation to myself to hold my ground.

 

[N80]

I also know what SOME of the greedy ones are capable of, and that's what these folks strike me as being. NOTHING is good enough for them. NOTHING is cheap enough for them. NO ONE is worthy of their attention.

I can remember as a young man thinking that if someone was a doctor that they must be good people. Then I went to med school. One of the things I learned there is that they are like every one else. Some of the worst people I know are doctors.

Well, one old guy I know of sure didn't cave in to their demands

You did the right thing. And I'll bet they'll never get a better deal. You'd hope that they'd learn their lesson, but you know what, people like that never do. They'll always blame their self inflicted troubles on someone else.

 

[browns40]

It's always tougher getting haggled than doing the haggling for sure, because the haggled know what they need for their time and effort, and the haggler--if they have any idea at all--wants to be the one who got the absolute best deal possible.

Transparency on costs and expected profit margin is the truest way to eliminate feet-planting and emotional influence in negotiation... at that point the only variable becomes what margin seems equitable to everyone.

I would expect, given rising costs of everything, many "sporadic hagglers" will get more aggressive than in the past, whereas regular purchasers of goods & services will have an understanding for how costs should be rising, and have a clearer expectation of what increases to expect.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

It's always tougher getting haggled than doing the haggling for sure, because the haggled know what they need for their time and effort, and the haggler--if they have any idea at all--wants to be the one who got the absolute best deal possible.

Transparency on costs and expected profit margin is the truest way to eliminate feet-planting and emotional influence in negotiation... at that point the only variable becomes what margin seems equitable to everyone.

I would expect, given rising costs of everything, many "sporadic hagglers" will get more aggressive than in the past, whereas regular purchasers of goods & services will have an understanding for how costs should be rising, and have a clearer expectation of what increases to expect.

I've bought and sold quite a few used tractors and a BUNCH of used implements over the years. I build in a little "wiggle room" on selling prices there. I expect a bit of bargaining. However, when I price SERVICES, I give my best price up front. That's it. I'm not auctioning off my labor. Take it or leave it. Since my prices seem to be as low or LOWER than my competitors, most everyone takes my price and is happy with it. I've found most of the complainers wouldn't be happy if I offered to do the job for free.

 

[Wayne County Hose]

I've bought and sold quite a few used tractors and a BUNCH of used implements over the years. I build in a little "wiggle room" on selling prices there. I expect a bit of bargaining. However, when I price SERVICES, I give my best price up front. That's it. I'm not auctioning off my labor. Take it or leave it. Since my prices seem to be as low or LOWER than my competitors, most everyone takes my price and is happy with it. I've found most of the complainers wouldn't be happy if I offered to do the job for free.

Boy, you talk about hitting the nail on the head. In my 1 year and 3 months of running my shop full time, I've had 1 customer leave unhappy and not come back. Come to find out that this guy gives everyone a hard time regardless of price. He's just looking for you to come down so he feels like he got a special deal. Well I wouldn't come down so he thought I was ripping him off. Funny thing is now he goes down the street and gets an inferior product for more money.

 

[N80]

I think having a clear and preferably printed 'fee schedule' helps too. That kind of lets the customer know that 'x' work is going to cost 'n' dollars and that's that. That may not work where work situations vary a great deal, but for basic services it can keep the haggling process in check.

I'll also mention another little trick that I'm sure everyone is aware of. If you are selling something add just a little to the price that you are willing to drop as soon as the haggling starts. It is human nature to want to think you are getting a good deal. And sometimes a small concession makes the buyer feel like he's 'won'.

For instance, I bought a used car recently. It was a 2000 Nissan Maxima in pristine condition at a dealership that mostly dealt in high end imports like BMW, Lexus, Audi, etc. They operated kind of like a luxury Car Max and the posted price was THE price, no haggling. But, this car had been on the lot a long time (it was a manual transmission and most girly-boys can't drive them these days) so I wanted to haggle. I asked the salesman if there was 'anything he could do'. He smiled and said he'd knock the $200 processing fee off the price. I asked him what the 'processing fee' was and he smiled again and said "pure profit". He was straight up and honest, he was just throwing me a little bone and he understood that that was enough to make the sale and send me home with a car.

I'll throw out another experience. I discussed it here a while back. I'd called to get an estimate on gutters for my cabin. The guy called and told my wife it would be $400. My wife tells him she will run it by me. It sounded high to me but I had no idea what to expect (ignorance is another thing that can shape a buyers expectations). Shortly he calls back and says it will be $600 dollars. I politely declined his services. I did not argue or get mad. That's what made the folks in the OP's example the jerks that they were. I generally don't think I need to get mad about an estimate, I just take my business somewhere else. Turns out after doing some research that $400 was about right and $600 was too much. So he priced himself out of a job, at least for now. I haven't gotten another estimate yet and if they are all that high, I may call this guy back because I liked him (he has done other work for me).

Now maybe he'll think I'm a jerk because I didn't accept his estimate the first time. I don't know. Its only been a few weeks but gas and aluminum prices go up daily and maybe his estimate will be higher. I'll have to see how I'd respond to that.

 

[Rowdius]

Been there. With the price of fuel and the way some customers are, I haven't tried getting back into the shredding business this year.

Sometimes kindness can sink you if you are not careful.
Last year, I was unloading my tractor at my dad's house in town to do some work for him, and this little old man saw the tractor and stopped by to talk. One thing about that little Yanmar 1500D, people like to look at that little machine! After walking around the tractor shooting the breeze for awhile, he asked me if I'd consider doing some work for him; I told him I'd have to look at it.

So, we ran over to his house, and he told me about his only son getting into an accident and losing a leg, so he had no one to take care of the place anymore. It is a small town, and I remembered hearing about the wreck, so I knew he was telling the truth. Over at the house he had about two 1/2 acres, nearly all of it grown up very tall. I explained to him that I did shredding, not mowing, and that about half his job was more in the line of mowing. But, I liked the old man, so I went over and shredded what needed shredding, mowed everything else, and pulled out the weedeater to finish up. Charged him enough to cover my costs, but I didn't make much money on the deal.

The old man loved the job, and refused to pay what I asked for. In fact, we argued over the price for quite awhile, as that he wanted to pay me double what I asked. Finally, I let him pay me what he wanted, and I left. Well, he told all his friends about me, and suddenly I was covered up in work from older people. But, of course it was mostly mowing, not shredding. Before I knew it, my tractor was sitting at home and my riding mower was being hauled all over the place. Finally, I just had to turn down most of the work he referred me, since I really did not have the equipment, and wanted to focus on the shredding.
-----------

Had someone call about goats they other day. I have mine priced on the higher end of the scale (but not really beyond what they are worth) because I've got a pretty good feed bill on them from the winter, and now I've got plenty of browse for them, so it is not costing anything to keep them until they sell. A guy calls me, and askes me how much, and he about explodes when I name the price, "Well, you can't get that much money for them at X (a pretty big livestock auction south of me.)" I tell him that is fine, cause I'm selling them at the auction. He tells me again that he was at the auction last weeks, and _knows_ I can't get the price I want for my goats. I explain to him that I've been selling goats pretty steady at my prices, but if he wants to come out and make me a deal, I'd probably take it, as that I've only three goats left to sell, and my ad in the paper is about to expire. He still goes on about the prices, so I just thank him for calling, and ask him to give me another call if he changes his mind.

 

[EddieWalker]

I am my business, so I don't have equipment of the overhead that you guys do in order to earn a living. Just my tools and ability to put things together.

One of the things that I like the most about being self employed is that I don't have to work for people I don't like. If a person comes across in a manner that I don't care for, I just don't work for them. This doesn't happen very often, but there are a few people out there that I've met who I just said "no thanks" to. My waiting list for clients is into October right now, it's not something I'm proud of, but it also allows me to be selective in who I work for.

When I first started out on my own, I was all over the place on pricing and trying to accomodate everyone. The more willing I was to work with a client, the more they took advantage. I just think it's human nature to try to get as good a deal as you can. I've modified my approach to a set price for my labor and the client pays for all materials. If I pick up the materials, they pay for that time too. This has proven to be a very good system that the client likes and is easy for me to work with.

Since I tell them my rates and that the time it will take to do the job is just an estimate, I haven't had anybody try to get me to lower my price. It's all word of mouth too, so I'm sure that my new clients already know what to expect and have already accepted my rates.

I've never been cussed out by a client, so I'm not sure how I'd handle that. I usualy make them cry, which is sort of a benchmark that I shoot for. If the wife cries, I've accomplished my goal and outdone their expectations.

Sorry to hear that you had to deal with such a person. The money is always out there and there is no reason to have to deal with people like that.

Eddie

 

[JSharp]

Someone has to listen to my rant, so why not you guys?

So, why is it the more obvious it is that a price change is in order, the more people squawk? Why is it people feel they can do whatever THEY want, but you're obligated to do whatever THEY want?

Rant over! I feel so much better now!

"The customer that pays the least complains the most."

I think that pretty much covers it...

 

[Noland]

I am a truck owner/operator and I get the same nonsense on occasion.
Former customers will call me up and say they want me to do some work for them again - at the same price I was charging a year or two ago!

 

[PILOON]

Farmwithjunk

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess, that the people who got mad at you are more than able to pay for your services. These are probably the same type of people that charge an arm and a leg for services and expect everyone to pay their prices without question.

Solo

And probably a professional, like doctor or lawer or dentist that charges 'the association' book rates that end up being $400 an hour. (and to avoid taxes takes cash) then only works 4 days a week otherwise he pays too much taxes!

Remember once a doctor, was chief of staff, drove a jaguar but also flew an old beechcraft Bonanza V-tail.
At his annual I said Doc, can't sign off your airplane as the cords are showing on the tires, need to replace them.
Well airplane tires (1/2 the size of his Jag) actually cost twice the price, his response was the plane is just a hobby and I cant afford to replace them at that price, just give me another year on them.
Lost him as a customer!
But then he pleeded for a deal saying that he would refer lots of clients to me.
I responded that If all his friends were as cheap as him I did not wish to serve them!
Now actually he was the chronic worst case in our region and well known as the local mizer.
Biggest problem was his thrill was to beat you down and brag to his chums thereby introducing hoards of deadbeat el-cheepo's to your 'client list'.

I also did snow remouval as a hobby (kinda to underwrite my equipment).
That's another cut-throght area.
Some folks will change contractors for mere 1-2% (and then you generally chase them 6 months to get paid)

Some where I learned that you get 80% of your profits from 20% of your clients.
Same goes for troublesome clients.

Secret is to analize your client base and concentrate on the 20% and then you can give top service and make a decent living with decent hours as well!

 

[billbill1]

In my 56 years, I have spent the entire 56 years being hardheaded and it does not appear that it's going to change in the near future. With me it is take it or leave it, I'll leave that part up to who I'm dealing with. You pass up the opportunity that I have offered to you and that is that. When you find out that I was giving you a good deal and you return (wanting my service) you will find out that I won't work for or with you for "any price" This probably isn't the greatest stance to take but like I said, I've been like that for 56 years and it's not going to change anytime soon. I think that FWJ (Bill) and I have had some of the same schooling, even though it appears
that he was much better in school than me.

 

[rox]

She's an attorney with a very successful practice. He's a cardiologist. I wonder how many half priced triple bypass surgeries he's done this week?

That there was a good observation

 

[Skyco]

For instance, I bought a used car recently. It was a 2000 Nissan Maxima in pristine condition at a dealership that mostly dealt in high end imports like BMW, Lexus, Audi, etc. They operated kind of like a luxury Car Max and the posted price was THE price, no haggling. But, this car had been on the lot a long time (it was a manual transmission and most girly-boys can't drive them these days) so I wanted to haggle. I asked the salesman if there was 'anything he could do'. He smiled and said he'd knock the $200 processing fee off the price. I asked him what the 'processing fee' was and he smiled again and said "pure profit". He was straight up and honest, he was just throwing me a little bone and he understood that that was enough to make the sale and send me home with a car.

Doesn't that "processing fee" just get ya I know it does me.

A few months back I walked into an RV dealer to buy a travel trailer at the advertised price. Wanted it to leave on my remote mountain property, I already have an RV but figured this one would suit me as a "cabin" and I don't have to haul it back and forth as I do my toy hauler.

So sat down to do the paperwork, advertised price + tax. Then the salesman casually mentioned a $495 "processing fee". or "document fee" or some such nonsense.

No mention in the ad, no mention when I was inspecting the unit. Anyway I walked as it just hits me as dishonest to do business this way. I dodn't cuss him out though , just looked at him, told him no I'm not paying that ridiculous fee and left.

If they had included the "processing fee" in their advertised price I'd have probably still bought it as it was a pretty good deal. It just irks me when they try to pull something like that instead of being upfront.

Now I'm laughing because they have a lot full of RVs they can't sell due to the gas prices. Could have been one less

I made other plans and am building an actual cabin instead.......

 

[Farmwithjunk]

In my 56 years, I have spent the entire 56 years being hardheaded and it does not appear that it's going to change in the near future. With me it is take it or leave it, I'll leave that part up to who I'm dealing with. You pass up the opportunity that I have offered to you and that is that. When you find out that I was giving you a good deal and you return (wanting my service) you will find out that I won't work for or with you for "any price" This probably isn't the greatest stance to take but like I said, I've been like that for 56 years and it's not going to change anytime soon. I think that FWJ (Bill) and I have had some of the same schooling, even though it appears
that he was much better in school than me.

I like that reply!

I credit my father for a great deal of what I know in regards to what has led to any real success I've had in my life. He taught me that no matter what the "accepted way" is, no matter who says "this is the only way", in the end, it's all about what works best for YOU. In my case, it's been sticking to my guns. Some people call me hardheaded. (My wife at the top of that list) I say I'm persistant or dedicated to a cause. And like yourself, I have no immediate plans on changing.