dcyrilc
Super Member
We're praying that thing go well. You've had enough hard luck for a lifetime.
At Home In The Woods
- Thread starter Obed
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We're praying that thing go well. You've had enough hard luck for a lifetime.
dcyrilc
Super Member
I like the door sensors which mount in the door frame. They're invisible when the door is closed and nearly so when the door is open. Can work for some windows also.
Most sensors for doors and windows are no more than a magnetic switch. They open and close as the door or window does which make them very generic. For glass breakage and motion sensors I'll defer to eepete and others for specifics.
dstig1
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This is not a small topic...You like to ask huge questions late in the game, don't you?
But there are a few things you can do to make life easier by prewiring. These sensors are really all standard and common. Don't let anyone jive you on proprietary crap.
Cat 5 works great for most stuff. If they need larger gage wires, they can twin-up pairs in the cat5. Most simple sensors are 2-wire. So since you have boxes of cat 5 and it is cheap, I'd use that. Any door sensor or window sensor is a simple magnetic make/break - run a cat 5 to it. If you are thinking video cameras, run a cat 5 and a coax to likely locations. There are more IP-based cameras now, so the coax may not be needed, but it is one of those things: easy to do now... Anyplace you may place an IR sensors needs a cat 5. Most sensors just require the one wire pair. Cameras are the big exception with coax.
What you can do with some of these runs is bury a loop of wire in the wall or ceiling. Takes lots of pictures and measurements before insulation and drywall. When/if you need it, go to the pics, drill a hole and fish the wire out of the cavity.
Door and window sensors are often mounted within the frames with a simple bullet sensor that presses into a drilled hole in the frame. Then you need to attach the magnet to the moving part (window/door) which may require some more drilling to recess them. That may not be possible to do with some type of windows, but there are surface mount styles too.
Everything uses wires home run to the central LV panel location. if you are thinking of sensors on every window, you can start piling up wire like crazy.
-Dave
brin
Super Member
Obed - You might want to rethink your game plan on a home security system. Having your alarm system call your cell phone does little good at 2AM when a fire breaks out or a Buglar breaks in. When we built our house a few years ago we paid to have a system installed and it is monitored by a UL approved facility, we have no contract and it is only $16 a month and at any time we can switch to another company without any change to our equipment which we own or we could add a dialer and have it call somewhere else. Most police departments no longer allow automatic telephone dialers to call in from security systems. Home automation , in my opinion, should be completely seperate from a home security system.
woodlandfarms
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So, in my opinion...
We had Brinks do our alarm system in our LA house. We had all windows pinned (meaning they have sensors on them that go off when a window is moved). Each window has two sensors, one for closed position, and one for an open position which would allow you to leave the house, have a window open (say 4") and still alarm the house. This installed in Old Construction so you can see a lot of it. You are correct to do it now as the sensors can be hidden well.
I do NOT believe in wireless sensors. Not that they do not work but that the batteries tend to fail and cause false alarms. Now, we are up north and our motion sensor in LA has chose to die. We had the cops out already to check the house to make sure the false alarm was not related to something more.
False alarms are killer. Honestly, your chance of a break in is very, very very low. It is piece of mind you are buying (and that is cool).
I would go with pinning the doors and windows, and maybe putting in motion sensors in key areas. I do not like the broken glass sensors, they are really prone to false alarms.
I would suggest running 2 pair cat-5 to your fridge, washer and drier, sinks and your hot water heater and furnace / ac. All of these items can leak, and you can get water sensors to go in these areas to keep you from having a melt down.
I will tell you that we have had a hardwood floor replaced twice in LA, once for a broken fridge line, and once for a broken water filter line.
You will find security companies picky about what sensors are used, and will try and rip out what you put in if you go and buy your own. Doesn't mean they are right to do this. I can't advise you on sensors for your area.
We pin (alarm) all our doors and windows. Even though you are on a second floor, you have a daughter. Good way to keep tabs on her movement. As I said, I don't like the glass breaking, but we do have motion sensors as we have very large (6 ft X 8 ft) sheets of glass for walls. Cats will set off motion sensors, so it is a bit of a challenge. I would say have the motion sensors, and use them when you go away on vacation for an extended period of time and the cats are being homed elsewhere.
Two things I would add as a suggestion.
I really like security cameras. If someone wants in they will get in, and if your alarm goes off it will be at least a half hour before the cops show up. In my world the alarm keeps the wife sane, but serves no other purpose. The security cameras catch them coming and going.
I would wire for security cameras. Think of strategic places for them (corners of houses and blind spots) and run either RG-6 or Cat 5. You can get wireless cameras but they cost more. Oh if your run %G-6 (tv cable) or something similar, please remember to include a power line. They make adapters for video cameras to turn a signal into a Cat 5 signal (no change, just reballancing) and power goes on the cat-5 as well. Those adapters are called Balens I think. But there is a steep price for those balens. I do not put cameras in a house, I don't think that is a fair thing to do to guests and you can't hide good ones well enough anyway. I do warn all our guests about the cameras. I think it only fair if they choose to pee off the patio.
The other thing to think about is how you treat video and audio. Are you going hog wild with a home theater, or is it one TV in the corner with Rabbit Ears. However you roll the walls are open for your enjoyment.
One big mistake I made was not having enough "box space" in the stereo area. After I jammed in 5.1 speaker connectors, HDMI, Ethernet, Phone and all the other connectors I ran out of space. Sucked to be me and ended up with random holes in the wall again which led my wife to a melt down.
Remember wiring for control panes for your security system. Also, if you do not have a tv in the master bedroom you may want to drop a wire in there next to a night stand so you could put in a remote control to control the house and security system and provide a signal for a security monitor.
Not sure if I helped, hope I did.
Carl
CurlyDave
Elite Member
For a house in the country, my security system has several layers. The warning portion consists of two Labrador Retrievers, who also do some IFF (Identification, Friend or Foe) and Threat Location. I am second stage IFF and Fire Control. No wires, no batteries, no subscription. This is the traditional rural security system.
Property protection when we are not at home is an insurance policy and a video recording of the contents.
Automate your house to your heart's content, but don't trust your security to an electronic gizmo.
The other thing you should understand about rural security, is that encounters with undesirable animals is much more likely than with undesirable humans. In my entire life, I have never confronted a criminal, although I have had property stolen.
Since acquiring country property three or four years ago, I have shot a cougar which was stalking me and the dogs, and I would have shot a bear if someone else hadn't shot him first. I have also seen wolves, but didn't take any action. What is an electronic security system going to do about those threats?
Property protection when we are not at home is an insurance policy and a video recording of the contents.
Automate your house to your heart's content, but don't trust your security to an electronic gizmo.
The other thing you should understand about rural security, is that encounters with undesirable animals is much more likely than with undesirable humans. In my entire life, I have never confronted a criminal, although I have had property stolen.
Since acquiring country property three or four years ago, I have shot a cougar which was stalking me and the dogs, and I would have shot a bear if someone else hadn't shot him first. I have also seen wolves, but didn't take any action. What is an electronic security system going to do about those threats?
eepete
Platinum Member
Let me take a two or three post stab at this...
General:
Am agreeing with what dstig1 said.
brin's comments about monitored or not depends on if local 911 center takes autodial alarm systems calls or not. If they do, it's a rotary bank you call _not_ 911. This is a decision for later as is the all in one vs. security and automation system.
Woodlandfarms comments are good.
Sounds like CurlyDave is protected by Smith and Wesson :laughing:. But he does speak to the need to have a clean idea about security vs. automation.
Proprietary sensors make no sense. Any good system will work with a wide array of sensors. Everything needs to home run to a central point where you need at least a 4' x 4' sheet of plywood (or equivalent area). If you go into a closet, be prepared to vent the door and maybe add a fan. That unfinished basement is a good spot for all this if you have a utility room down there.
All the functionality you mention is doable by existing security and home automation systems. All those decisions can come later.
Wireless only makes sense you don't have wires :confused2:. You can add wires now, so do it. If you miss something, then you can sider a wireless work around later. It will be more expensive and less reliable.
1) Is there a standard for security sensors?
Not really. But I've stared at this at lot, and have been able to find all all of the following that run on 12 VDC and have contact closure for output:
Motion, Smoke, Water, CO, glass break. Door sensors are virtually all magnetic and therefore contacts and no power or electronics. There are some that are hidden and fit in a 3/8" hole, and there are the ones one the outside of the door you can see. Now on the contact side of all this, some are normally open and some are normally closed. None of this affects your pre-wireing and virtually all devices can be configured to work with which ever type you have. I can get all these sensors for you later if you can't get them.
A simple round box in the ceiling works for the motion, smoke, CO and glass break detectors. You'll want to tape the wire in the back so the drywall guys don't cut it. You'll want to put an extra 6" in the wall you can pull through for when they do :laughing:. The inspectors may want to see a tie-down device at the box, in which case you add the loop just before drywall goes up. My inspectors didn't say a word about any of the low voltage. I'd consult with them before pulling anything to avoid surprises.
The power consumption by all of these devices is low enough that you can use a pair on a CAT5 cable to power the device. Most of the powered sensors can also be purchased with a "tamper" switch that tells you if someone has removed the cover. So you _could_ use 3 of the 4 pairs in a CAT5 cable and use any of these sensors. Again: CAT5, don't worry about it, it will work.
I only use 3 kinds of wire for everything:
CAT5
18 gauge stranded pair (in a jacket)
Quad shield coax
If you can get a few different colors of CAT5 that helps.
So for the above mentioned powered sensors, just a cat5.
Keypads just need a cat5.
I tried both a pair on the CAT5 and and 18 gauge for door sensors. It was easier to wire up the 18 gauge pair than the cat5, and the wire is more robust (less likely to get beat up by drywallers and finish carpenters).
For video camera locations, I run an 18 guage for power, a coax, and a CAT5 for future internet camera ability.
For "places with TVs", I like a 2" or 2.5" conduit in the wall. I have a breakout at TV level and at outlet level for the "floating TV" look. Since your basement is unfinished, just bring the conduit to the basement. For the "living room" TV, the TV seems to like to be in the middle of the wall. For the master bedroom, I put it very high up so that when I'm watching it in bed, I'm viewing it through the "far" portion of my bifocals. Old house had master bed room TV on a stand, new house has it up in the air, big win. Details, details.
Something not mentioned yet are speakers for an automation system. There are good $50 in ceiling speakers that take a 5" round hole in the ceiling. You can coil up some 18 gauge on a floor joist, take a picture _and_ a measurement, and go back later to put in the speaker.
So there you have the answer to your 1st questions about sensors (and wires).
Pete
General:
Am agreeing with what dstig1 said.
brin's comments about monitored or not depends on if local 911 center takes autodial alarm systems calls or not. If they do, it's a rotary bank you call _not_ 911. This is a decision for later as is the all in one vs. security and automation system.
Woodlandfarms comments are good.
Sounds like CurlyDave is protected by Smith and Wesson :laughing:. But he does speak to the need to have a clean idea about security vs. automation.
Proprietary sensors make no sense. Any good system will work with a wide array of sensors. Everything needs to home run to a central point where you need at least a 4' x 4' sheet of plywood (or equivalent area). If you go into a closet, be prepared to vent the door and maybe add a fan. That unfinished basement is a good spot for all this if you have a utility room down there.
All the functionality you mention is doable by existing security and home automation systems. All those decisions can come later.
Wireless only makes sense you don't have wires :confused2:. You can add wires now, so do it. If you miss something, then you can sider a wireless work around later. It will be more expensive and less reliable.
1) Is there a standard for security sensors?
Not really. But I've stared at this at lot, and have been able to find all all of the following that run on 12 VDC and have contact closure for output:
Motion, Smoke, Water, CO, glass break. Door sensors are virtually all magnetic and therefore contacts and no power or electronics. There are some that are hidden and fit in a 3/8" hole, and there are the ones one the outside of the door you can see. Now on the contact side of all this, some are normally open and some are normally closed. None of this affects your pre-wireing and virtually all devices can be configured to work with which ever type you have. I can get all these sensors for you later if you can't get them.
A simple round box in the ceiling works for the motion, smoke, CO and glass break detectors. You'll want to tape the wire in the back so the drywall guys don't cut it. You'll want to put an extra 6" in the wall you can pull through for when they do :laughing:. The inspectors may want to see a tie-down device at the box, in which case you add the loop just before drywall goes up. My inspectors didn't say a word about any of the low voltage. I'd consult with them before pulling anything to avoid surprises.
The power consumption by all of these devices is low enough that you can use a pair on a CAT5 cable to power the device. Most of the powered sensors can also be purchased with a "tamper" switch that tells you if someone has removed the cover. So you _could_ use 3 of the 4 pairs in a CAT5 cable and use any of these sensors. Again: CAT5, don't worry about it, it will work.
I only use 3 kinds of wire for everything:
CAT5
18 gauge stranded pair (in a jacket)
Quad shield coax
If you can get a few different colors of CAT5 that helps.
So for the above mentioned powered sensors, just a cat5.
Keypads just need a cat5.
I tried both a pair on the CAT5 and and 18 gauge for door sensors. It was easier to wire up the 18 gauge pair than the cat5, and the wire is more robust (less likely to get beat up by drywallers and finish carpenters).
For video camera locations, I run an 18 guage for power, a coax, and a CAT5 for future internet camera ability.
For "places with TVs", I like a 2" or 2.5" conduit in the wall. I have a breakout at TV level and at outlet level for the "floating TV" look. Since your basement is unfinished, just bring the conduit to the basement. For the "living room" TV, the TV seems to like to be in the middle of the wall. For the master bedroom, I put it very high up so that when I'm watching it in bed, I'm viewing it through the "far" portion of my bifocals. Old house had master bed room TV on a stand, new house has it up in the air, big win. Details, details
.Something not mentioned yet are speakers for an automation system. There are good $50 in ceiling speakers that take a 5" round hole in the ceiling. You can coil up some 18 gauge on a floor joist, take a picture _and_ a measurement, and go back later to put in the speaker.
So there you have the answer to your 1st questions about sensors (and wires).
Pete
eepete
Platinum Member
2) Where would you put sensors?
Everywhere. Next question please :laughing:.
You are in the fog of construction, so you need to figure out the "gotta haves", and then everything else in order of importance. When you run out of resources (time, money, wire, sleep) you stop. With that strategy in mind, here's what I'd do:
Gotta Haves:
All exterior doors.
Door between garage and house.
Door to basement.
Smoke Detectors in all bedrooms and bedroom halls.
Smoke Detectors in the laundry for when the dryer catches fire.
CO detectors in all bedroom halls.
You may have to have AC operated ones to pass code for now, then the low voltage ones will supplement the AC ones when you automate.
Motion detectors in the area where you come into the house from the garage, front door, and basement.
Motion detector in bedroom halls.
Water sensors at laundry, dishwasher, and refrigerator.
Speakers in each room.
Keypads at garage, kitchen, and master bedroom.
CAT5 to doors for doorbells (now and camera ones of the future)
Everywhere you think you want a phone, run up to 3 cat5s. One for phone, one for computer, one for the future.
Nice to Haves:
Keypad in master bath.
CAT5 to box in ceiling for temperature sensor in kitchen and garage (and tractor parking area in basement?).
Glass break in rooms that have widows at ground floor level.
CAT5 for phone near toilet.
2 CAT5s to a central place with an outlet for your router. DSL in, ethernet for house out, and router will have WiFi.
Box in hall ceilings with 18 gauge for future emergency lights.
Coax and 18 gauge for amplifier to attic for off-air TV. You may need to put the big antenna up there before drywall.
Conduit from basement to attic.
CAT5 behind toilet for water sensor.
You'e already got the conduit for the beginnings of a driveway sensor.
So that's a lot of wire and boxes. Be sure everyone is OK with having a new house with lots of blank cover plates showing. You could leave the wires coiled in the ceiling and go back later and use retrofit boxes. It would be a bit quicker to install now, drywallers would be happier, but a bit more later. Comes back to the fog of construction and acceptability of blank plates.
Let me touch on the subject of video cameras. I have one in the garage, one that shows you who's at the front door, and one in the basement. There are no cameras in the "people" part of the house. I also have cameras outside that look back at the house, but that's a lot of outside work. One of the most useful cameras is one I did not pre-wire for, but added later. It looks down the driveway. When the driveway sensor makes a noise, I can turn on a TV and look and see what's coming. So if there is a window with a good view down the driveway, a box high up by the window will let you add this feature.
It's a great feature. I added the cameras after we had been in the house for almost 2 years. I've attached a picture of a quad combiner that takes the two outside views of the house (people door and garage door), the people front porch, and the view down the driveway.
Topic for another post when you're ready is how to do the door sensors.
Final though for this "Where to put sensors" business. I put no sensors on any windows. It's a pain to do, price of failure is high, and it requires a lot of co-ordination with the window installers. Instead, I put some sensors on inside doors. The thinking is that the "bad guys" break into your house and will open up certain doors. Good candidates are closet doors and doors to the master bedroom. When you leave the house, you can make sure these doors are shut. Then, if these doors open when you are in "away" mode you treat it like an exterior breach- immediate alarm. And this is a good segue-way into your 3rd question....
Pete
Everywhere. Next question please :laughing:.
You are in the fog of construction, so you need to figure out the "gotta haves", and then everything else in order of importance. When you run out of resources (time, money, wire, sleep) you stop. With that strategy in mind, here's what I'd do:
Gotta Haves:
All exterior doors.
Door between garage and house.
Door to basement.
Smoke Detectors in all bedrooms and bedroom halls.
Smoke Detectors in the laundry for when the dryer catches fire.
CO detectors in all bedroom halls.
You may have to have AC operated ones to pass code for now, then the low voltage ones will supplement the AC ones when you automate.
Motion detectors in the area where you come into the house from the garage, front door, and basement.
Motion detector in bedroom halls.
Water sensors at laundry, dishwasher, and refrigerator.
Speakers in each room.
Keypads at garage, kitchen, and master bedroom.
CAT5 to doors for doorbells (now and camera ones of the future)
Everywhere you think you want a phone, run up to 3 cat5s. One for phone, one for computer, one for the future.
Nice to Haves:
Keypad in master bath.
CAT5 to box in ceiling for temperature sensor in kitchen and garage (and tractor parking area in basement?).
Glass break in rooms that have widows at ground floor level.
CAT5 for phone near toilet.
2 CAT5s to a central place with an outlet for your router. DSL in, ethernet for house out, and router will have WiFi.
Box in hall ceilings with 18 gauge for future emergency lights.
Coax and 18 gauge for amplifier to attic for off-air TV. You may need to put the big antenna up there before drywall.
Conduit from basement to attic.
CAT5 behind toilet for water sensor.
You'e already got the conduit for the beginnings of a driveway sensor.
So that's a lot of wire and boxes. Be sure everyone is OK with having a new house with lots of blank cover plates showing. You could leave the wires coiled in the ceiling and go back later and use retrofit boxes. It would be a bit quicker to install now, drywallers would be happier, but a bit more later. Comes back to the fog of construction and acceptability of blank plates.
Let me touch on the subject of video cameras. I have one in the garage, one that shows you who's at the front door, and one in the basement. There are no cameras in the "people" part of the house. I also have cameras outside that look back at the house, but that's a lot of outside work. One of the most useful cameras is one I did not pre-wire for, but added later. It looks down the driveway. When the driveway sensor makes a noise, I can turn on a TV and look and see what's coming. So if there is a window with a good view down the driveway, a box high up by the window will let you add this feature.
It's a great feature. I added the cameras after we had been in the house for almost 2 years. I've attached a picture of a quad combiner that takes the two outside views of the house (people door and garage door), the people front porch, and the view down the driveway.
Topic for another post when you're ready is how to do the door sensors.
Final though for this "Where to put sensors" business. I put no sensors on any windows. It's a pain to do, price of failure is high, and it requires a lot of co-ordination with the window installers. Instead, I put some sensors on inside doors. The thinking is that the "bad guys" break into your house and will open up certain doors. Good candidates are closet doors and doors to the master bedroom. When you leave the house, you can make sure these doors are shut. Then, if these doors open when you are in "away" mode you treat it like an exterior breach- immediate alarm. And this is a good segue-way into your 3rd question....
Pete
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eepete
Platinum Member
3) Are there motion detectors that don't get triggered by cats?
Yes.
I did not use them since I have inside doors wired for security stuff. My motion detectors are for lighting control. Motion detectors are built using an infrared sensor and a funny lens. The lens takes the heat from moving objects and focuses it on the sensor in a way that when the object is in motion, the sensor sees the object, then doesn't, then does, etc. The lenses look like they have either little embedded plastic squares or little horizontal bars.
Some sensors are for ceiling mount, and have a conical (ice cream cone) shaped pattern. They see anything that moves, including cats. The sensors often have a dip switch inside that lets you set how many "hits" or "counts" must be seen before the contacts close. This is to avoid false triggers due to HVAC systems turning on or a sensors that sees outside through a window. The higher the counts, the longer you have to be in view of the sensor.
There is also a wall mount version that has little vertical bars in the lens. This is what you often see with outside flood light detectors. They have the lens with some down-tilt so it can see the ground. The further away you get, the faster you have to be moving and the "bigger" you have to be. This was discussed when you asked about such flood lights.
You can take a sensor like this and mount it in a hallway at about the 5' level. Unless you cats are bouncing off the walls, only people walking will trigger these sensors. They "shoot" across the small part of the hall. You can also mask the sensor to adjust the active zone.
There are sensors that claim to be "pet proof" and have the weight of the pet that will set it off. These use a mix of counts and playing with the sensitivity of the sensor. They have strict mounting requirements, since a mouse at 1 foot looks like a dog at 9 feet. I've just not heard a lot of success stories with them.
Finally, you could place a ceiling detector at about 4' up on a wall, and then use the little paper cut-outs to mask the lens down to a very small cone. When a person walks through the small cone, it triggers. The paper blocks things low in the pattern, and lets anything tall come through.
You can probably see the aesthetic aspects of such a sensor- it's an ugly bump on the wall vs. the ceiling mount. There are also IR light beam sensors that need two boxes on the wall, same aesthetic problems.
So you get to decide if you want to try the interior door alarm method, or if you want a sensor on the side of a wall. Is the motion detector for security or lighting? I think CurlyDave's comments about the real value of a home security system come into play here too.
You could hide a cat five at the 4-5' level behind a wall on a stud and take careful pictures and measurements and decide all this later. I hope with this post it's clear what's information and what is my personal bias.
So if you use the motion detectors for lighting, how do you control the lights? That's a topic for your 4th question.
Pete
Yes.
I did not use them since I have inside doors wired for security stuff. My motion detectors are for lighting control. Motion detectors are built using an infrared sensor and a funny lens. The lens takes the heat from moving objects and focuses it on the sensor in a way that when the object is in motion, the sensor sees the object, then doesn't, then does, etc. The lenses look like they have either little embedded plastic squares or little horizontal bars.
Some sensors are for ceiling mount, and have a conical (ice cream cone) shaped pattern. They see anything that moves, including cats. The sensors often have a dip switch inside that lets you set how many "hits" or "counts" must be seen before the contacts close. This is to avoid false triggers due to HVAC systems turning on or a sensors that sees outside through a window. The higher the counts, the longer you have to be in view of the sensor.
There is also a wall mount version that has little vertical bars in the lens. This is what you often see with outside flood light detectors. They have the lens with some down-tilt so it can see the ground. The further away you get, the faster you have to be moving and the "bigger" you have to be. This was discussed when you asked about such flood lights.
You can take a sensor like this and mount it in a hallway at about the 5' level. Unless you cats are bouncing off the walls, only people walking will trigger these sensors. They "shoot" across the small part of the hall. You can also mask the sensor to adjust the active zone.
There are sensors that claim to be "pet proof" and have the weight of the pet that will set it off. These use a mix of counts and playing with the sensitivity of the sensor. They have strict mounting requirements, since a mouse at 1 foot looks like a dog at 9 feet. I've just not heard a lot of success stories with them.
Finally, you could place a ceiling detector at about 4' up on a wall, and then use the little paper cut-outs to mask the lens down to a very small cone. When a person walks through the small cone, it triggers. The paper blocks things low in the pattern, and lets anything tall come through.
You can probably see the aesthetic aspects of such a sensor- it's an ugly bump on the wall vs. the ceiling mount. There are also IR light beam sensors that need two boxes on the wall, same aesthetic problems.
So you get to decide if you want to try the interior door alarm method, or if you want a sensor on the side of a wall. Is the motion detector for security or lighting? I think CurlyDave's comments about the real value of a home security system come into play here too.
You could hide a cat five at the 4-5' level behind a wall on a stud and take careful pictures and measurements and decide all this later. I hope with this post it's clear what's information and what is my personal bias.
So if you use the motion detectors for lighting, how do you control the lights? That's a topic for your 4th question.
Pete
eepete
Platinum Member
4) Do you guys have any other suggestions?
A 40 byte question that generates a megabyte response :laughing:.
I posted a lot of the off the wall stuff in an earlier post, but I think I've covered what's realistic for you. So let me toss out two ideas. 1st crazy stuff :confused2:, then my ideas on lighting control.
Crazy Stuff:
I have a cat5 into each room for a small display panel that shows stuff like outside temperature, security status, and other information (such as caller ID) as it happens.
I ran a cat-5 into the attic so I can know when I have an attic fire.
I ran a cat-5 in the general area of the gaslog flue so I can tell if it's too hot.
I ran a cat-5 into the attic for a vibration sensor so I can tell if a tornado is hitting the house (told you this was crazy stuff....).
I have a cat-5 outside under an east deck for outside temperature and humidity and light sensing. Ok, that ones not crazy at all.
I have a lot of current transformers in breaker boxes, but you can add those later.
I have another attic coax for a discone antennae for a weather alert radio with a serial port that interfaces into my automation stuff. It lets me know when my area is under a tornado/thunderstorm warning.
I have duel driveway sensors so I can tell if someone is coming or going. If I'm driving, I still don't know if I'm coming or going :laughing:.
Every interior door has a sensor. Both for security and lighting. If you come out of a bedroom, the hall light turns on.
Not low voltage, but as I previously mentioned I have a lot of outlets in halls with the built in LED nightlights.
Lighting:
Lighting can be retrofitted at a price. There are systems where you place a $85 box with a serial port that runs to your automaton system, and then you can replace an existing Decora (square style) light switch with a fancy one that the box can control. The switches run about $120 each. The win is you don't have to think about that now. The loose is the price when you want to do something. The devices talk over the power line.
What I did was to run a 14-3 from the wall light switch box that has the wire that goes to the light to a double box. The black is power, the red goes to the light, and the white (with a red tape on it so it isn't confused with neutral) goes to the switch (i.e. the part of the switch that _used_ to go to the light). You wire-nut the red and white, and cap off the black. The double box also has a 18 gauge wire for a future relay. The relay is set up with the common going to the light. The normally closed goes to the switch. The normally open goes to power. So the automation system can turn on the light independent of the switch, but if the relay is off or the automation system is down, everything works normally. The cost of a board with a relay on it is in the $20 range (it's something I will be making or you can wire up a relay yourself). You'll want to explain this to your wiring inspector, ours were OK with it with 3 houses in this area. Worst case put the AC on one side of the double box, insert an orange divider, and put the 18 gauge low voltage on that side. No code issues. The double box is, of course, somewhere you can get to it like in a closet.
Then you pick which lights you want. If you have flood lights that are not automatic, they are good candidates. You can also control hall lights. A garage light is good too. It's nice to have the hall and garage light come on when you open the door. It's sweet to have the flood lights come on when you or someone else drives in the driveway.
I just walked around our house. A few more things. Put wires/boxes in the main TV area for rear surround speakers. Consider a cat5 to a box by a location where you might look out at your great view so you can put a weather station display there.
I put a cat5 in the area where the litter boxes are, along with a 3" duct and an outside dryer vent. Plan is to use a motion detector in the litter box so that it vents for 20 minutes after the cat leaves. That's :confused2::confused2::confused2:.
I know this all covers a lot. This is like going to a restaurant when you're hungry. Everything on the menu looks good. You'll have to sort through it all and decide what to do. When you're ready, I can post some tips on how to pull the wire and do the doors.
I apologize to thread readers who have to wade through my replies, I'm writing for the OP and hope this helps him make some decisions. Ok, I'm also just a long winded sort... :laughing:
Pete
A 40 byte question that generates a megabyte response :laughing:.
I posted a lot of the off the wall stuff in an earlier post, but I think I've covered what's realistic for you. So let me toss out two ideas. 1st crazy stuff :confused2:, then my ideas on lighting control.
Crazy Stuff:
I have a cat5 into each room for a small display panel that shows stuff like outside temperature, security status, and other information (such as caller ID) as it happens.
I ran a cat-5 into the attic so I can know when I have an attic fire.
I ran a cat-5 in the general area of the gaslog flue so I can tell if it's too hot.
I ran a cat-5 into the attic for a vibration sensor so I can tell if a tornado is hitting the house (told you this was crazy stuff....
).I have a cat-5 outside under an east deck for outside temperature and humidity and light sensing. Ok, that ones not crazy at all.
I have a lot of current transformers in breaker boxes, but you can add those later.
I have another attic coax for a discone antennae for a weather alert radio with a serial port that interfaces into my automation stuff. It lets me know when my area is under a tornado/thunderstorm warning.
I have duel driveway sensors so I can tell if someone is coming or going. If I'm driving, I still don't know if I'm coming or going :laughing:.
Every interior door has a sensor. Both for security and lighting. If you come out of a bedroom, the hall light turns on.
Not low voltage, but as I previously mentioned I have a lot of outlets in halls with the built in LED nightlights.
Lighting:
Lighting can be retrofitted at a price. There are systems where you place a $85 box with a serial port that runs to your automaton system, and then you can replace an existing Decora (square style) light switch with a fancy one that the box can control. The switches run about $120 each. The win is you don't have to think about that now. The loose is the price when you want to do something. The devices talk over the power line.
What I did was to run a 14-3 from the wall light switch box that has the wire that goes to the light to a double box. The black is power, the red goes to the light, and the white (with a red tape on it so it isn't confused with neutral) goes to the switch (i.e. the part of the switch that _used_ to go to the light). You wire-nut the red and white, and cap off the black. The double box also has a 18 gauge wire for a future relay. The relay is set up with the common going to the light. The normally closed goes to the switch. The normally open goes to power. So the automation system can turn on the light independent of the switch, but if the relay is off or the automation system is down, everything works normally. The cost of a board with a relay on it is in the $20 range (it's something I will be making or you can wire up a relay yourself). You'll want to explain this to your wiring inspector, ours were OK with it with 3 houses in this area. Worst case put the AC on one side of the double box, insert an orange divider, and put the 18 gauge low voltage on that side. No code issues. The double box is, of course, somewhere you can get to it like in a closet.
Then you pick which lights you want. If you have flood lights that are not automatic, they are good candidates. You can also control hall lights. A garage light is good too. It's nice to have the hall and garage light come on when you open the door. It's sweet to have the flood lights come on when you or someone else drives in the driveway.
I just walked around our house. A few more things. Put wires/boxes in the main TV area for rear surround speakers. Consider a cat5 to a box by a location where you might look out at your great view so you can put a weather station display there.
I put a cat5 in the area where the litter boxes are, along with a 3" duct and an outside dryer vent. Plan is to use a motion detector in the litter box so that it vents for 20 minutes after the cat leaves. That's :confused2::confused2::confused2:.
I know this all covers a lot. This is like going to a restaurant when you're hungry. Everything on the menu looks good. You'll have to sort through it all and decide what to do. When you're ready, I can post some tips on how to pull the wire and do the doors.
I apologize to thread readers who have to wade through my replies, I'm writing for the OP and hope this helps him make some decisions. Ok, I'm also just a long winded sort... :laughing:
Pete