Back-up Generators

[hr3]

you cant just put the transfer switch ahead of the meter

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Oooo and the transfer switch goes after the meter not in front of the meter...

 

[hr3]

Well from my standpoint, I cannot in good conscience sell a client the idea that i can simply add the transfer switch to his loaded out panel and he should expect it to be trouble free automatic transfer without a hitch. What happens if the power fails in winter and he forgets to turn off the hot tub heater (automatically keeps hot tub to 102 F) and forgets to turn off water heater and emergency back up heat unit.....

You can see where i am going with this. I have to guarantee my install for 2 years

On your split panel do you only put load enough to not overload the gen set.. ?? 10kw gen.. you only load to 8kw in your panel.. Just trying to understand not hounding you,,

 

[grsthegreat]

On your split panel do you only put load enough to not overload the gen set.. ?? 10kw gen.. you only load to 8kw in your panel.. Just trying to understand not hounding you,,

Your not hounding me at all. The panel i install allows up to 125 amps on the generator portion of the panel. I simply place up to the generators rating worth of circuits (actual tested load) and leave the rest on the non-generator portion of the panel. Then anyone can change circuits as needed within the panel, and not have to re-fed a separate gen panel later on.

I try and do the install the cheapest LEGAL way. I guess some other people just want to do it the cheapest way. I have tried to just install the transfer switch in the past, and the inspector made me install a separate generator panel rated for the generator. Now if the geherator IS large enuf, i will simply install the transfer switch.

 

[hr3]

Your not hounding me at all. The panel i install allows up to 125 amps on the generator portion of the panel. I simply place up to the generators rating worth of circuits (actual tested load) and leave the rest on the non-generator portion of the panel. Then anyone can change circuits as needed within the panel, and not have to re-fed a separate gen panel later on.

I try and do the install the cheapest LEGAL way. I guess some other people just want to do it the cheapest way. I have tried to just install the transfer switch in the past, and the inspector made me install a separate generator panel rated for the generator. Now if the geherator IS large enuf, i will simply install the transfer switch.

Local or state inspector.??. If a transfer switch is rated for 100a say and the generator has a breaker rated for 50a. What reason would the inspector give for not installing it.. ??

Ooo the Generac 200a tranfer switch has a load shedding feature for ac/heat pumps units and hot tubs,, so no worry about overloading gen set,,

 

[grsthegreat]

Local or state inspector.??. If a transfer switch is rated for 100a say and the generator has a breaker rated for 50a. What reason would the inspector give for not installing it.. ??

Ooo the Generac 200a transfer switch has a load shedding feature for ac/heat pumps units and hot tubs,, so no worry about overloading gen set,,

Idaho has state inspectors. They just insist that a separately derived power source be sized according to the demand. Even though it may be circuit protected, its not able to work properly if it trips from overload. Its just what were required to do up here. They wont even ALLOW an automatic transfer switch to be used if the person is planning on using a portable generator. It HAS to be pad mounted and hooked up to a ready source of fuel.

 

[kude]

Thanks very much for the split panel explanation. The more you know up front helps.

 

[dstig1]

So what alot of people do are buy a 50 amp generac (home depot special) auto start generac generator and they want to power their 200 amp panel. I tell them we cant power the heat, water heater and stove with this unit. So i have to install a smaller 50 amp panel next to the 200 amp panel (if theres room) with a 100 amp auto transfer switch between the two. I power the new 50 amp panel from thew house panel, then i have to re-run all the circuits that the owner wants to run off of the generator to the new panel. 6 hours later, hes up and running, with alot of drywall repair.

...

Or, i pull out the old panel and install the new panel (1-2 hrs work) add a feed to the generator and I'm done. The new panel is a legal split bus panel that will LEGALLY allow the installation of the lower amperage generator as you can move circuits to balance the load to match generator output.

This is the part I don't follow. Most of the "HD Specials" come with a prewired transfer switch, to my knowledge. You pull the wires from the breakers in the main panel and tap into them with the prewired bundle from the Xfer switch. Like this:
Generac Power Systems -EZ Switch

I can't see how that is 6 hrs of work whereas pulling everything out of the old panel and moving it into a new panel is 1-2 hrs. Cleaner install - sure, but not appreciably faster, best I can tell.

I thoroughly agree with your point about needing a big enough gen to do the whole house Xfer. While one of us persnickety people like myself could manage it just fine with an underrated generator by managing the load manually, when you are installing professionally, you can't count on that. Nor can you count on any future owners to be that way. Besides, it's just good practice to do it right.

 

[David_Kb7uns]

You either have to have a generator big enough to power everything, a split panel for the backed up loads or seperate panel. Under the newer NEMA the Load Shedding also qualifies and that is why you see the new 200 amp supply side transfer switch with load shedding relays.

Put in 20KW Generac with 500 gal tank (holds 400Gal propane) last year. Need 330,000 BTU hour so at 0 degrees 325 gallon tank is needed. Also the 20KW Generac burns over 3 gallons an hour fuill load so to get seveal weeks you need to size bigger or turn off when not needed.

David Kb7uns

 

[kiotiken]

I've had a 16KW Generac running propane for about 4 years now. No problems at all other than a dead batt. this spring. I live in Ottawa and we'll dip into the -35 C (-31 F) range when we're lucky. That's when you can have issues with it starting. I don't have a heater and it's only failed to come on for one of its "exercise" runs once that I know of (it tries 3 times and then quits). If I had a heater, I'm sure it would never be an issue.

Propane is better than gas because it doesn't go stale and it burns cleaner which translates into less maintenance (oil is changed once a year). You also don稚 have to stop it every couple hrs to fill it up again. You can keep a much larger amount of propane on hand than gas. I can run for 2+ weeks at full load, 24hrs a day, with my tank.

It "exercises" automatically once a week for 14 min. That translates into over 12hrs a year + outages, so it does use up a fair amount of propane a year. The benefit of exercising is that it starts when it needs to start. A big advantage over a portable gas generator or a PTO driven generator, is it doesn't matter if you're home or not, it will come on and prevent your basement from flooding, your fridge from spoiling etc. You also have full power restored in less than a minute with no effort vs going out the shed, setting up a generator and praying it starts.

My recommendation if you go for this generator is to buy a whole house transfer switch instead of using the supplied transfer switch that limits the number of circuits that can be backed up. If you turn you electric stove on, do a load of laundry in your electric dryer, crank up the A/C and turn on all your lights while watching your big screen T.V, you'll be in trouble, but if you're sensible about what you use when the powers out, it's a much better option.

 

[RalphVa]

I've heard that a lot of people have had troubles with Generac.

Ralph