Bath Room Electrical?

   / Bath Room Electrical? #31  
That's what I was saying, you have to go to parallel 12/2 downstream UNLESS you put GFCI in each outlet. An example that I actually have: A 12/3 run that has a series of 6 square boxes on it. The first, third and fifth boxes have a GFCI outlet with a second conventional outlet wired through the GCFI, all hooked to the "red" phase. The "black" phase is just wired through these boxes. the second, fourth and sixth boxes have the same setup except wired to the "black" phase. As a result, I ran about 100 ft of 12/3 instead of 200 ft of 12/2 but used 6 GFCI outlets instead of 2. A big deal? No but that's the way I did it.

i know what your saying. ive seen people run a 12/3 to a kitchen (1st box) then split off to 2 separate 12/2 runs. one run to box 2,4,6 & 8. The other 12/2 to 3,5,&7. this gives alternate circuits, but only 2 gfci's.

price wise...not sure which is cheaper. Personally, i try to locate a sub-panel in most of my houses close to a kitchen (i wire large 3500 - 8,000 SF horses mostly). the kitchen has most home runs of anything in house. ultimately this saves money.
 
   / Bath Room Electrical? #32  
:confused2: Nooo....


Again not so,, Gfci's do not look back on the power lines,, If you run a 12/3 to a junction box and take 2 12/2's out of the box to a gfci outlet then on to the rest of the protected outlets it will work fine..

So are there some circuits you would not want to be gfi protected besides lights? where it's better to have AF protection.

I guess I was doing the 3 wire right but didn't know it :) when I remodeled I ran four 12/3's to the attic for future needs. Used 2 of them already, just put them in a deep 4" work box and came out with two 12/2's.

JB
 
   / Bath Room Electrical? #33  
Bath room electrical related question,

Regarding 20 Amp GFI, of course 20A outlets have a T-shaped nuetral slot WHY? I have never ever seen a male cord end with that T-blade. I'm a contractor 28 years, have all kinds of tools, work in churches, schools, hospitals and Govt buildings and have never seen a T-blade corded appliance or tool.

Also since 15A GFI's can be wired thru with 20A isn't it actually rated for or built like a 20A? besides the blade configuration and can they be used on a 20A circuit. I'm sure you couldn't use a 20A GFI on a 15A circuit though.

JB.
 
   / Bath Room Electrical? #34  
Bath room electrical related question,

Regarding 20 Amp GFI, of course 20A outlets have a T-shaped nuetral slot WHY? I have never ever seen a male cord end with that T-blade. I'm a contractor 28 years, have all kinds of tools, work in churches, schools, hospitals and Govt buildings and have never seen a T-blade corded appliance or tool.

Also since 15A GFI's can be wired thru with 20A isn't it actually rated for or built like a 20A? besides the blade configuration and can they be used on a 20A circuit. I'm sure you couldn't use a 20A GFI on a 15A circuit though.

JB.

they make both 15 amp and 20 amp gfci receptacles. for commercial we have to use 20a. for residential, no one seems to care.

the t-shaped receptacle fits a plug as shown in attached picture. a true 20 amp, 110 volt plug has one terminal at a 90 degree angle to the other.
 

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   / Bath Room Electrical? #35  
they make both 15 amp and 20 amp gfci receptacles. for commercial we have to use 20a. for residential, no one seems to care.

the t-shaped receptacle fits a plug as shown in attached picture. a true 20 amp, 110 volt plug has one terminal at a 90 degree angle to the other.

Yeah, I said t-blade, that was wrong, I've seen those at supply house, just never on a cord.

JB
 
   / Bath Room Electrical? #36  
the t shapes 20 amp recepticle is set to accept either the regular blade OR this 20 amp blade. thus the t shapes.
 
   / Bath Room Electrical? #37  
Basically the code requires every 120v circuit in residential applications that is not GFCI protected to be AFCI protected.. :mad:

Lovely, as another poster said earlier, more junk to drive the cost of a house up.

I think grsthegreat gave a good example with the metal cover shorting terminals. the reasoning makes sense to me, when a cord strains down it leaves the hot and neutral blades partly exposed, not large enough a gap to touch with fingers, but some metal object could fall in there causing a hazard. I was thinking of my daughter with her metal chains, falling behind a nightstand.
JB.

I can see where the metal covers are thin enough to slip into said gap; but why would anyone remove a cover with the cord still plugged in? I know, I know, some dam fool somewhere probably has.

My opinion is that some of these rules are added in by manufacturers rep's. sitting on the boards. They get an instant profit center out of the deal.

Yep.
 
   / Bath Room Electrical? #38  
So are there some circuits you would not want to be gfi protected besides lights? where it's better to have AF protection.

I guess I was doing the 3 wire right but didn't know it when I remodeled I ran four 12/3's to the attic for future needs. Used 2 of them already, just put them in a deep 4" work box and came out with two 12/2's.

It's best to protect only circuits that are required to be GFCI protected by code.. and this does include lights in showers as others have mentioned,,

The 12/3's are good choices to run for spares "as a homeowner" but as an electrician I would have to run 12-2-2 so that each hot conductor would have it's own neutral.. This is because any new circuit "except GFCI circuits" ,,run from a panel now has to be AFCI.. and the hots and neutrals need to match up..
 
   / Bath Room Electrical? #39  
It's best to protect only circuits that are required to be GFCI protected by code.. and this does include lights in showers as others have mentioned,,

The 12/3's are good choices to run for spares "as a homeowner" but as an electrician I would have to run 12-2-2 so that each hot conductor would have it's own neutral.. This is because any new circuit "except GFCI circuits" ,,run from a panel now has to be AFCI.. and the hots and neutrals need to match up..

yup..that new ark fault rule...this is going to suck. people are already complaining about increase in bid price to cover the 30% increase in copper wire prices. wait till this one hits them.
 
   / Bath Room Electrical? #40  
yup..that new ark fault rule...this is going to suck. people are already complaining about increase in bid price to cover the 30% increase in copper wire prices. wait till this one hits them.

I was told when I pulled my building permit for my remodel last year that I just barely missed the cutoff for needing Arc Fault breakers. The electrician that put in the new panel kept telling me how lucky I am that I didn't have to do that.

What is the arc fault supposed to protect against?
 

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