Bucket Hooks/Hitch/Level Indicators

[JB4310]

I googled CUT and didn't find it. Should I be afraid to ask?...ha something utility, tractor? Kind of like New Holland making 'Boomers' because the baby boomers can afford them now...ha

Wow, it's like that scene from the movie National Treasure, I know something that someone else doesn't?
Let me bask in this a moment--------------- the C is for Compact, you got the rest of it. Not exactly sure of the definition but something like, all these tractors from probably 40 HP and under regardless of brand.

 

[Dargo]

Hey Dargo,

I understand your point but it might not be as bad as you make it out to be. I use the edge of my bucket to pry rocks out of the ground all the time. I use the corner of the bucket so I can see what I am doing. Often I exceed the break out point as I can't dig them out all the time. To me this is no different than hooking to the top corner. My comment about the system is, if designed properly, pulling, digging, hooking from an extreme corner should not exceed the safety factor; in other words, the hydraulics will fail to lift before you reach the point where you should wreck something. IF the system is properly designed!

Well, not actually. Again, I'm not going to argue the point. As I said previously, take that up with the engineers and manufacturers. However, in over 30 years of operating equipment I've always used the curl (break out) power of the bucket when prying things with the bucket. This action does not generally put stresses on the loader arms since the bucket is almost always sitting on the ground and the tilt cylinders are doing the prying. Besides, you get more breakout power this way without tipping the tractor. (If you need to know, yeah, I've gone over in a tractor....but it wasn't my fault, really ) If anything it would bend the bucket; far less expensive than loader arms or loader mounts.

I'm really trying to not sound rude, but I really don't care where someone puts hooks on their tractor. They paid for it, I didn't. However, it is indisputable with engineers that the hooks should be in line with the lift arms or inside them. I only took one year of physics in college and no engineering, so I am not a good source for the mathematics and such, but the stability factor is pretty obvious. Maybe it's just me being cheap, but tractors cost quite a bit of money in my opinion and I'm not going to do anything I know will greatly increase the chances of damaging my tractor if I can help it. Having said that, I promise, I won't be upset if someone wants to mount hooks on the outside (sides) of their bucket. Really. I do think using a trailer receiver hitch on the bucket is far better than any 3 pt. hitch trailer mover unless you need to move the trailer great distances. I designed and built several 3 pt. hitches many years ago but none are as convenient as the receiver on the bucket. Here is a picture I posted here on TBN about 2 years ago of a receiver hitch on a bucket in use http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...f/59614d1155932226-hitch-bucket-hitch-use.jpg
In my opinion that makes all the 3 pt hitch trailer movers useless. I have 2 collecting dust under my work bench.

 

[whiteh2o]

Wow, it's like that scene from the movie National Treasure, I know something that someone else doesn't?
Let me bask in this a moment--------------- the C is for Compact, you got the rest of it. Not exactly sure of the definition but something like, all these tractors from probably 40 HP and under regardless of brand.

Drew a blank on the "C"...ha

 

[DMF]

Well, not actually. Again, I'm not going to argue the point.

Well, apparently you are arguing the point.

I only took one year of physics in college and no engineering, so I am not a good source for the mathematics and such, but the stability factor is pretty obvious.

I never claimed it doesnt cause stability problems, but that's kind of relavent to the situation in which you find yourself. Obviously, all things being considered equal, if you are on flat ground and you lift from the center of your bucket (which I have a hook there as well, BTW) you are going to have less chance of lifting a rear wheel than if you lift from the outer edge of your bucket, that applies to mounting them in front of the arms as well you realize.

I am an Engineer and have been in the engineering and design field for 26 years and I'll say again: is it better to mount them in front of the loader arms? Yup, but I'm not going to worry about where they are either.

 

[ditzel]

Got to try them out today. My welds are holding and I didn't even bend the angled hooks.

 

[whiteh2o]

Looks very very good. Thanks for starting the thread!!!

 

[chumly2071]

I'm However, it is indisputable with engineers that the hooks should be in line with the lift arms or inside them.

I'm going to vote that it depends on what you are trying to avoid damaging...
If your scope only includes the loader arms, then I agree with you, in that it should be welded inline with the arms, or better yet, right in the middle to evenly distribute to both arms. however, keep in mind the loads and placement of the loads you are expecting the bucket to resist now. from the bucket's perspective, I'd mount them near the edges to give better vertical support to help minimize bending the top of the bucket down, even with reinforcement.

 

[bigshovel]

Here's my 2 cents. I appearently went about my hook welding and upgrade all wrong because I didn't ask anyone how to do it. First I cut 2 pieces of 5/16 steel 2 x 3 inches, then welded hooks angled toward center of bucket. Then took and welded plates with hooks attached 3" in from edge of bucket and 3" out from outside edge of loader arms, due to that's where I felt the strongest point was. I then proceeded to weld a 3/8 clevis hook to same size plate and then center of bucket. At that point I spray painted black to match bucket. Project done. In my testing phase I hooked 3/8" chain to hooks and centered on my Leinbach 7 rear blade around 400 lbs picked it square on LEVEL GROUND IN CONTROLLED ENVIRONMENT no problem. Last week I loaded railroad ties on my small trailer, they were longer than trailer so I rested them on the top rail on the tongue end of the trailer about 20 degrees. When I arrived at home I got the tractor out hooked a chain to uneven ties and began to raise off of trailer. Tie swung due to load not being level and jolted the tractor pretty good, but no harm done. I would not have attempted this type of lift with more than three hundred pounds due to this is a small machine. Moral of the story my hooks held and did not bend or fail, loader arms and bucket are not bent and nothing on tractor broke. I'm pretty sure regardless of where hooks are placed that damage can occur if one is not carefull and tries to ask more of a machine than it's capable. In a dynamic load condition of hard swing or unanticipated load shift damage will occur at some point during use regardless of hook location or application.

Brad

 

[Dargo]

Okay, one final time. Since I was not the genius who engineered the buckets, the hydraulic system, the axles, the loader arms, the loader mounting system etc. on the tractors, maybe I'm a fool for opting to believe the engineers at the Gainesville, GA Kubota plant who actually manufacturer loaders; one of which was on a Kubota tractor I owned. Several years ago my Kubota dealer called and actually spent quite a bit of time on the phone with a couple of engineers who explained to him exactly why any hooks welded or otherwise placed on a loader bucket should be placed in line with the loader arms or inside the loader arms. Since my warranty was at risk should I opt to believe the guy in the trailer down the street that has a 15 year old Jinma he got for $300 and mount the hooks as he did, I went with what the engineers and very large multi-line dealer told me. Apparently the engineers at CNH and JD are just as foolish as the ones employed by Kubota because they said the same thing.

So, you guys feel free to laugh all you want and give me all your reasons why I'm so foolish as to believe the manufacturers and the actual engineers who designed the loaders because that is exactly what I'm going to do. As I stated several times before, I really don't care where you mount your hooks on your tractor; it's your tractor. Mount them on your wheels for all I care. I just thought I'd post what is advised by the manufacturers and engineers who actually build the loaders for the remote reason someone would actually want to do what those guys advise. Obviously I missed on that one as well. I suppose to go along with the seasoned guys here, I'll just say "get 'er dun!" and leave it at that.

 

[AchingBack]

Okay, one final time. Since I was not the genius who engineered the buckets, the hydraulic system, the axles, the loader arms, the loader mounting system etc. on the tractors, maybe I'm a fool for opting to believe the engineers at the Gainesville, GA Kubota plant who actually manufacturer loaders; one of which was on a Kubota tractor I owned. Several years ago my Kubota dealer called and actually spent quite a bit of time on the phone with a couple of engineers who explained to him exactly why any hooks welded or otherwise placed on a loader bucket should be placed in line with the loader arms or inside the loader arms. Since my warranty was at risk should I opt to believe the guy in the trailer down the street that has a 15 year old Jinma he got for $300 and mount the hooks as he did, I went with what the engineers and very large multi-line dealer told me. Apparently the engineers at CNH and JD are just as foolish as the ones employed by Kubota because they said the same thing.

So, you guys feel free to laugh all you want and give me all your reasons why I'm so foolish as to believe the manufacturers and the actual engineers who designed the loaders because that is exactly what I'm going to do. As I stated several times before, I really don't care where you mount your hooks on your tractor; it's your tractor. Mount them on your wheels for all I care. I just thought I'd post what is advised by the manufacturers and engineers who actually build the loaders for the remote reason someone would actually want to do what those guys advise. Obviously I missed on that one as well. I suppose to go along with the seasoned guys here, I'll just say "get 'er dun!" and leave it at that.

Still, you see this on Flusher's new loader. Clink on link, and scroll down to image.http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/mahindra-owning-operating/107275-club-25-a-10.html