Buying an argon cylinder

[Arc weld]

I would have wanted the same size cylinder back.

 

[PILOON]

In my area the gas companies are about the most independent SOB snobs around.
Besides all the woes previously noted they keep the most awful hours, all close up at 4m and noon on Friday.
To ask for info they act as if you are disturbing them. The only way to get any attention is to peruse the most expensive MIG/TIG set up on the display floor, then they trip over each other as I guess they get commission on welders.

 

[IslandTractor]

I don't know how much Argon Joshua thinks he'll use as I think he is a hobby welder (like me). I just bought a new 40cf tank for $100 and paid $20 for a fill at my LWS. No pro would want a tank that small. However, for an amateur the convenience of being able to carry it in one hand and perhaps even own two so you always have a spare around would seem to be reasonable considerations. The LWS was $30 cheaper than Cyberweld.

 

[ultrarunner]

I bought a large oxygen cylinder several years ago at Roberts Supply in Maryland. I used it for three years and when it was empty I took it back for a refill. They insisted that it was a leased tank and wanted an outrageous amount of money for a lease payment. They would not believe that I bought it and when I refused to pay, they confiscated the tank and were quite nasty. I went home and found my bill of sale with the serial number of the tank on it and took it back to them. They gave no apology and still refused to return the tank or fill it. I told them I was calling the police to press charges for theft of MY tank and as soon as I took out my cell phone they got all huffy and agreed to "give" me a smaller tank as consolation. Their excuse was that the employee that sold me the tank was wrong and and had since been fired. Never got any sort of apology and they were as rude as they could possibly be. I will never go back there again.

I think it would have been time well spent in small claims...

 

[Arc weld]

"Their excuse was that the employee that sold me the tank was wrong and and had since been fired. Never got any sort of apology and they were as rude as they could possibly be. I will never go back there again."

Maybe it's still their fault for not properly training the sales staff? You should keep your bill of sale, even make a copy for them to keep on file basically giving you a lifetime lease since you can prove you did by the cylinder.

 

[joshuabardwell]

I went down to the local Airgas today to pick up some parts for my TIG torch. I was a little disappointed that they were out of several of the things I wanted. I'm a big fan of, "support your local welding supply," but I can order the parts from Cyberweld just as fast as they can order them from the warehouse, and Cyberweld delivers right to my doorstep. Of course, the LWS has helpful hands to give you the kind of advice and attention you can't get online, right? Well... I asked what size gas cup to get, and the guy behind the counter--as helpful as he was trying to be--didn't have a clue. Not a TIG welder. But they did helpfully set me up with the obscure fitting that I needed to get my regulator hooked up, and I figured as long as I was there, I'd pick up an argon cylinder. Now bear in mind that Airgas only does up to 80 cf user-owned, and they ask $220 for the cylinder (full), while PraxAir will sell up to 125 cf and they ask around $190. So Airgas is more expensive two ways--on the initial purchase and on subsequent fill-ups for the life of the cylinder. But I figured what the heck, I'm here, I'll bite the bullet.

Whoops. 100% out of user-owned argon cylinders today, sir. Total bill ended up being $15 for a couple gas lenses and the regulator fitting. Could have been closer to $300 if they had had a single darn thing I wanted to buy. Times like this, I don't exactly bemoan the way that online shopping is challenging brick-and-mortar.

I don't know how much Argon Joshua thinks he'll use as I think he is a hobby welder (like me). I just bought a new 40cf tank for $100 and paid $20 for a fill at my LWS.

I won't go through much, I don't think, but I still want a reasonably large tank because they're so much cheaper to fill. Looks like 125 cf is what I'm going to end up with. At a nominal 20 cfh, that will last me about 6 hours of welding.

Maybe it's still their fault for not properly training the sales staff? You should keep your bill of sale, even make a copy for them to keep on file basically giving you a lifetime lease since you can prove you did by the cylinder.

I think that's a tough one. Employees are usually not authorized to make exceptions to company policy, so if an employee sells a cylinder that he shouldn't have, I would think that, legally, the sale would be null and void, although it would be in the company's best interests to be nice about fixing the situation, in order to keep you as a customer. I mean, if I walk into the car lot the day that the salesman has decided to make as much trouble as possible before he quits, and he sells me a car for a dollar, is that going to stick when I end up in court being sued by the dealer to try to get the car back?

 

[ultrarunner]

^^^ Don't make an enemy out of a customer and if a mistake was made... a full refund including any taxes paid is due.

I worked at a dealership during high school and put the wrong price on a clean used Ford pickup...

We had two blue trucks the same year and model... one had A/C and very low miles... the other was well used with high miles.

Anyway... the salesman wrote up the deal with the low price for the nice truck...

The buyer was just about to leave when the accountant wanted to know why we had just sold a truck for $700 less than cost...

After some discussion... the owner told the buyer he got a heck of a deal and offered the guy $250 to rescind...

The Dealership let the sale stand and over the years that customer referred many because because he told all his friends we were honest...

The place is still there and has been since 1942

 

[brain55]

These threads about the problems with getting tanks filled is always curious to me. I've owned my tanks for years and had tanks filled for companies I worked for, for years before that, and never even had a second look. I just take them in, swap them for the same size cylinder or up and down as needed and not always at the same store or even the same parent company never a problem.

Brian

 

[CliffordK]

One would think that a company would make it nearly impossible to sell something they didn't want to sell.

I.E. Walk in to the store, and you don't find a price tag on the cash register. Somewhere there would have to be a value associated with the cash register, but an employee can't just sell it.

Likewise, if they look up the cost of a rental only gas cylinder on the price lists, there should be a big note NOT FOR SALE. It may be a little different because a customer might want to know the recovery fee for a lost cylinder. But, it should be clear that it isn't a sale price. Try to print out a receipt, and it says NO SALE.

If the store downgrades the cylinder, they should either offer the difference in value, or an option for a full refund at the CURRENT VALUE.

I also find my local welding supply a bit frustrating to deal with. I ended up with a Generic MIG welder. What do you know, they don't sell replacement tips for the Generics, even though apparently several use the same tips. Very few welding rods in stock. There was something else. I think it was that they had stock silver flux, but didn't sell basic brazing flux for brass. Or, something odd like that. And, of course, my online prices are at least half of what I pay in the local store.

For many things, I like to shop locally. But, I refuse to drive all around town hunting at multiple stores for something that I can purchase with the click of a button.

 

[IslandTractor]

I went down to the local Airgas today to pick up some parts for my TIG torch. I was a little disappointed that they were out of several of the things I wanted. I'm a big fan of, "support your local welding supply," but I can order the parts from Cyberweld just as fast as they can order them from the warehouse, and Cyberweld delivers right to my doorstep. Of course, the LWS has helpful hands to give you the kind of advice and attention you can't get online, right? Well... I asked what size gas cup to get, and the guy behind the counter--as helpful as he was trying to be--didn't have a clue. Not a TIG welder. But they did helpfully set me up with the obscure fitting that I needed to get my regulator hooked up, and I figured as long as I was there, I'd pick up an argon cylinder. Now bear in mind that Airgas only does up to 80 cf user-owned, and they ask $220 for the cylinder (full), while PraxAir will sell up to 125 cf and they ask around $190. So Airgas is more expensive two ways--on the initial purchase and on subsequent fill-ups for the life of the cylinder. But I figured what the heck, I'm here, I'll bite the bullet.

Whoops. 100% out of user-owned argon cylinders today, sir. Total bill ended up being $15 for a couple gas lenses and the regulator fitting. Could have been closer to $300 if they had had a single darn thing I wanted to buy. Times like this, I don't exactly bemoan the way that online shopping is challenging brick-and-mortar.

I won't go through much, I don't think, but I still want a reasonably large tank because they're so much cheaper to fill. Looks like 125 cf is what I'm going to end up with. At a nominal 20 cfh, that will last me about 6 hours of welding.

I think that's a tough one. Employees are usually not authorized to make exceptions to company policy, so if an employee sells a cylinder that he shouldn't have, I would think that, legally, the sale would be null and void, although it would be in the company's best interests to be nice about fixing the situation, in order to keep you as a customer. I mean, if I walk into the car lot the day that the salesman has decided to make as much trouble as possible before he quits, and he sells me a car for a dollar, is that going to stick when I end up in court being sued by the dealer to try to get the car back?

The counter staff at local welding stores I have used are almost NEVER experienced or even amateur welders. They know the stuff they stock but rarely have advice I cannot get just looking at the package. I use my LWS for buying stuff I need that day or that I want to hold in my hand before buying but I use Cyberweld or Indiana Oxygen for most other stuff including welders.

I was planning on getting an 80 cf tank from Cyberweld but was surprised at how reasonable my LWS price was for the 40 cf and fill. Even if 40cf is only two hours of actual welding time, that should last me months. If I go through it faster, I'll just pick up another to have as a spare. $20 for a fill isn't outrageous IMO and I'd rather be able to easily lift and carry the tank instead of needing a hand truck. I'm sure I'd feel very differently if I was putting in two hours a day or even per week of TIG arc time but for hobby use I imagine the 40cf will be fine.