BX1850 engine trouble

[drag_slick]

A few months ago at 310 hrs my oil pressure light would flicker at idle, other than that no strange symptoms. Replaced the sender and it still does it so we put a gauge on it. 7.5 psi at idle and 25psi at 3100.

Dumped the oil and cut the filter apart and there was a bunch of metal shavings so the engine was yanked and dropped the pan off. Looks like the main bearings are shot, the crank can be wiggled about 1/8".

I've owned the tractor since new, and all maintainence was done at recommended intervals. After the initial oil change I switched to synthetic and have been running Amsoil 5w-30 diesel oil.

Just trying to figure out what happened here and if I did something to cause it. Unfortunatley the tractor's a year out of warranty so I'm guessing I'm outta luck.

Edit... guess I could be more specific about usage...
Bought the tractor in 2006 with a loader and tiller. First two years was tilling yard, tree rows and a couple gardens and loader work, tractor sat the winter indoors and was started maybe once a month to keep a charge on the battery.
In 2008 I bought a 50" 3pt snowblower and spent a lot of time snowblowing as the winters the last two years have been crazy. The tractor sits inside in an unheated garage, and I always let it warm up until the temp needle is up almost to the middle before heading out, and the summers are still mostly loader work.

Any thoughts?

 

[leonz]

A few months ago at 310 hrs my oil pressure light would flicker at idle, other than that no strange symptoms. Replaced the sender and it still does it so we put a gauge on it. 7.5 psi at idle and 25psi at 3100.

Dumped the oil and cut the filter apart and there was a bunch of metal shavings so the engine was yanked and dropped the pan off. Looks like the main bearings are shot, the crank can be wiggled about 1/8".

I've owned the tractor since new, and all maintainence was done at recommended intervals. After the initial oil change I switched to synthetic and have been running Amsoil 5w-30 diesel oil.

Just trying to figure out what happened here and if I did something to cause it. Unfortunatley the tractor's a year out of warranty so I'm guessing I'm outta luck.

Edit... guess I could be more specific about usage...
Bought the tractor in 2006 with a loader and tiller. First two years was tilling yard, tree rows and a couple gardens and loader work, tractor sat the winter indoors and was started maybe once a month to keep a charge on the battery.
In 2008 I bought a 50" 3pt snowblower and spent a lot of time snowblowing as the winters the last two years have been crazy. The tractor sits inside in an unheated garage, and I always let it warm up until the temp needle is up almost to the middle before heading out, and the summers are still mostly loader work.

Any thoughts?

The loss of your engine with low hours would defintely lead me to say its was the synthetic oil in my opinion.

Ii dont use the synthetic oils simply because I am unsure of them to this day with all the adequate lubrication isssues and oil adhesion to wear parts.
was the water pump in good condition? do you know if it was adequately pumping coolant?
Did you look at or tear down the oil pump to see what condition it was in?
Is there a screen to catch any metal in the sump?

The chaff screen for radiator is another issue with over heated coolant heating up the oil breaking it down sooner.

My other concern is air flow and air filters only from a maintenance standpoint.

if your air filter has an inner element it needs to be changed every time you change the outer elelement as it is referred to as the safety element.

The The air filter tattle tails are not fool proof either and even thses littel engines should have cyclone precleaners which are available-I will gladly tell you where they can be purchased.


I have never run a multi-viscosity oil in my machines and I use a salamander to heat everything up when the time comes in the colder months or sooner only because I know the transmissions and the oil tank on the processor will need to be warmed up to avoid pump and oil flow issues.


I would contact a kubota engine only distributor to see if they have an exchange rebuild program or not and see if they will take your engine in towards a new one.

It will be much more costly to buy one from your local dealer to replace it.

The only way to tell why it failed is to have an oil analysis done through Exxonmobil or others at every oil change which tells you if there are trace metals in the oil from the bearings. etc.


I am sorry you lost your prime movers engine but the only guaranteed way to find problems or prevent them is with oil analysis.

There are many kubota engine dealers nation wide that handle the small engines as they were made for other purposes prior to them being used in small tractors so finding your engine with them will be easy to accomplish.


The engine dealers are linked through the Kubota corp homepage and you can find one through there.

 

[MessickFarmEqu]

Actually, I'm not sure how helpful Kubota engine would be. We get really good prices on crate engines.

 

[dodge man]

I seriously doubt it had anything to do with the oil. Just a guess on my part, the engine was dusted or you had a bad crank and or bearings, or a bad oil pump.

I would think overheating would be an issue with a warped head and such, so I would guess that isn't the problem

 

[rdsaustintx]

the engine was dusted

I thought dusting killed rings and valve seals, not main bearings.

Any thoughts?

Drag, my only thoughts are the obvious heartbreak you must be feeling. 310 hours is nothing. This is probably the worst story I've ever read here. Yeah, a few people have had hydrostatic transmissions self-destruct, but infant mortality in a Kubota diesel engine? Yikes.

Please keep us updated on whatever you can find out. Personally, I would be talking to my dealer and the regional rep. I don't buy Am$oil, but if I did, I would be all over those guys. Warranty or not, 310 hours is awfully low.

 

[drag_slick]

Never had a problem with overheating, actually never have seen the needle even close to red, assuming the gauge was correct.

Only time the air filter looked real bad was after I tilled my yard which was in the spring of 2007, then I replaced it. After that, it's been replaced at least yearly.

About 2/3rd's of my hours were put on in the last two winters snowblowing.

Every oil change since new we've cut the filter apart, the last change was at 270 hours and didn't see anything bad in the filter.

The guy that's tearing it down for me suspects bad crank, bearings, oil pump too. I just want to make sure if it was me that I don't do it again. These little diesels get pricey fast.

 

[dodge man]

I agree, it would have to be dusted pretty bad, but I wonder what the top end of the engine looks like? What does the pistons, rings and cylinders look like.

 

[SPYDERLK]

That is very strange. I have not treated my BX1500 engine as good as youve yours and its running strong at 1470+ hrs. The engine has been used at full load for hrs on end mowing and snow throwing. It doesnt sound like your engine was ever right to go bad that way. Are you speaking of endplay in the crank being 1/8"?
larry

 

[Kubota-guy1911]

It is definately NOT the oil. I've been running Amsoil in 2 different 3 cylinder Kubota engines for a long time. The oldest since 1987.

kj

 

[drag_slick]

I do also have an oil analysis report, if there's any values anybody's curious about, they did flag tin and aluminum as high, and silicon was a little elevated.

 

[funwithahoe]

I do also have an oil analysis report, if there's any values anybody's curious about, they did flag tin and aluminum as high, and silicon was a little elevated.

If you figure you're into a new engine anyways, Why not stick it back together and see how long it runs? I have seen these things run forever even messed up! Only symptom was a little low oil pressure? Were there really that many metal shards and isn't there suppose to be some fore and aft play in the shaft when you have it torn off like that? Don't think you would ruin anything else by running it.

 

[KubieTwo]

That is very strange. I have not treated my BX1500 engine as good as youve yours and its running strong at 1470+ hrs. The engine has been used at full load for hrs on end mowing and snow throwing. It doesnt sound like your engine was ever right to go bad that way. Are you speaking of endplay in the crank being 1/8"?
larry

Spyder, what weight and brand motor oil are you running?

I am not saying his engine was killed by his choice of oil but I also don't know of anybody with a fleet of diesel trucks, compressors, generators and tractors that runs Amsoil either. They also don't use 5w-30 all year and bad bearings on low hour engines is unheard of under normal conditions. I can understand the thinner oils for extreme winter conditions but I would never run it with temperatures over about 40 degrees. Most fleets I know use either 15w-40 Shell Rotella or 15w-40 Chevron Delo in all their diesel equipment. Maybe they are all wrong, but if I were going to use anything but Kubota motor oil in my tractors, it would be one of these. Just my opinion.

 

[taborekle]

Don't know engines really well, but I've always heard that lugging a engine was bad on the bearings. Since this is a hydro model, is it possible that the OP ran the tractor at low engine rpms and used the go pedal to find a transmission range that worked? Or that the snow blower could be implemented with the engine running low rpms?

 

[drag_slick]

The manual states 10w-30 or 10w-40. The reason for the 5w-30 is up here in the winter we regularly get periods of -20 F temps, and the tractor sits in unheated storage.

As far as my snowblowing habits, it's low range on the HST with the throttle at ~3100rpm. Ground speed depends on how deep the drift is, I creep along so the engine isn't lugged down. I've never tried it, but I would imagine that the blower would be pretty useless at low rpms.

 

[KubieTwo]

No question the thinner oil is required for the low temps. My concern has always been with 5w-30 at higher temperatures. My tractors are not stored outside so cold startup is not a problem, nor do we get any -20 degree temps. As a result, I stay with 15w-40 year round. If I had -20 temps I might run 10w-30 in winter then change back in early spring. No scientific reason, just personal opinion.

 

[oldnslo]

If it is determined to be an oil issue doesn't Amsoil have some form of guaranty ? Seems to like I have read or heard of this as one of their selling points.

Good luck

Roy

 

[leonz]

I do also have an oil analysis report, if there's any values anybody's curious about, they did flag tin and aluminum as high, and silicon was a little elevated.

The high tin, aluminum and silicon levels are the red flag for your engine and the resulting wear and its failure do to excess wear and heat I can tell you more if you post it or send to me- lots of tin and aluminum indicates high heat in the crancase sump literally melting the soft metals used in the bearing caps, crank bearings inner races. I would be curious to see what the flywheel pulley bearing looks like if there is anything left of it to examine but if you can move the crank both bearings are gone.


i would strongly recommend you purchase a salamander to heat it up the during the nine cold months and use the recommended oil only because of the cold temperatures and your heavy duty cycles especially when using the snow blower.

I have used my salamander for 17 plus years and have been very hapy in using it to warm up my machinery as it is is easier to start everything and its is fully warmed up before I even turn the key or pull a starter rope.

 

[SPYDERLK]

Spyder, what weight and brand motor oil are you running?

I use rotella 5w-40. In N Dakota even at 5W-30 I cant see to blame his oil, esp with the life of non lugging pretty much inherent wth HST drive. I think his crank had endplay from the beginning, and it has taken its toll on the rod bearings & pistons.
larry

 

[leonz]

The manual states 10w-30 or 10w-40. The reason for the 5w-30 is up here in the winter we regularly get periods of -20 F temps, and the tractor sits in unheated storage.

As far as my snowblowing habits, it's low range on the HST with the throttle at ~3100rpm. Ground speed depends on how deep the drift is, I creep along so the engine isn't lugged down. I've never tried it, but I would imagine that the blower would be pretty useless at low rpms.

Yup they are as all they do is spit it 2 feet

 

[oldnslo]

Dumb question from an old fart.

In my younger days before the multiple viscosity oils became popular or even existed we ran straight 10 weight in the winter and 30 weight in the summer. So how is running a 5w-30 worse? To my feeble knowledge and understanding the "benefit" of using multigrade oils is that they give better cold weather starts and then as the oil/engine warms up it gets thicker for better lube.

1st suspicion would be an incorrectly adjusted oil pump relief or piece or debris blocking this valve open
2nd I would suspect a loose or cracked oil pump pickup tube or possibly partially clogged. Have these been know to break or crack from engine vibration?
3rd Incorrectly installed or missing construction port plug in one of the oil galleys causing loss of flow.
4th Bad assembly from day one

Roy