CK series owners- clarify where you fill your engine oil: location on engine

[747driver]

UPDATE ! So i finally got around to getting the tractor to the dealer last week. Started it up for them and the mechanic ( 30 yrs. experience ) said ...looks like a bad fuel injector. Smelled the smoke and fluid coming out of the exhaust, and said...thats fuel not oil ! So they called me today and said one of the injectors is not closing....which keeps letting fuel in the cylinder. They said this could have been what i heard as the cylinder filled up with fuel. Anyhow i am going to get all 3 injectors replaced vs having them rebuilt...not the much more money for new ones. Will update when they call back and tell me if anything else is wrong !!

 

[DK35vince]

Thanks for the update.
Hope it solves your problem.

 

[Coyote machine]

Injectors are part of emissions, which falls under 5/50K* miles, (*automotive federal law for replacement by manufacturer/hence dealer).
Kioti has specific statements in their warranty boilerplate on their website regarding this type of failure. This supersedes the manufacturer's warranty limitations, BUT lots of dealer's 'play' ignorance, or are ignorant of the Emissions warranty requirements and just stick the parts replacement onto the customer- YOU! Seek the document(s) on the Kioti site, then bring it to the dealer for discussion.

I'd only replace the defective one, it's unlikely the others are bad too, and if they were, they too would show signs of same problems.

I seem to recall the signs pointed to checking out the injectors way, way back in this thread, yes?:confused3:

 

[747driver]

Injectors are part of emissions, which falls under 5/50K* miles, (*automotive federal law for replacement by manufacturer/hence dealer).
Kioti has specific statements in their warranty boilerplate on their website regarding this type of failure. This supersedes the manufacturer's warranty limitations, BUT lots of dealer's 'play' ignorance, or are ignorant of the Emissions warranty requirements and just stick the parts replacement onto the customer- YOU! Seek the document(s) on the Kioti site, then bring it to the dealer for discussion.

I'd only replace the defective one, it's unlikely the others are bad too, and if they were, they too would show signs of same problems.

I seem to recall the signs pointed to checking out the injectors way, way back in this thread, yes?:confused3:

I will look up the Kioti emissions warranty. Yes...the fuel injectors were discussed as maybe a possible problem. I just decided since the tractor was at the dealer to go ahead and replace all 3. Since they have the engine opened up might as well replace the other 2 as well. I am learning daily about diesel engines from this forum !! I do alot of my own vehicle maintenance but when it comes to doing things that require special tools and expertise i just let the appropriate mechanics do the job.

 

[ritcheyvs]

Driver: FYI, replacing injectors is similar to replacing spark plugs, except they connect with rigid tubing vs floppy wires. The Kioti injectors are relatively accessible, except the loader may hinder access. Your injectors (even new ones) should be "pop tested" to ensure they pop at nearly the same (in-spec) pressure and also to ensure they don't leak or drip before or after they pop (which was your apparent problem). I suspect some mechanics won't do this with new injectors. If your other injectors tested OK (pop pressure, no drip, and spray pattern) they don't need to be replaced. Considering that they cost $150-200 each (just for the part), if it were me, I would not replace injectors that test good. If injector pressures vary too much (either from the spec or from each other) the engine will run rough or poorly; the fix is to open up the injector and change the shims under the big spring. Maybe Kioti injectors come from the factory as balanced sets, but I doubt it. A rebuilt injector should be as good as new. Rebuilding involves replacing the pintle and nozzle (the only parts that wear) with new parts and shimming to the pop spec. In recent years, the quality of many injectors (and parts) has become suspect. Even big-name companies (like Bosch) have been subcontracting to low-bidder third-world manufacturers. This may be a good reason to get an actual Kioti part. Some dealers will only use new Kioti parts vs rebuilding. It sounds like the mechanic at your dealer knows his onions. If so, take your business there and hope he is still around if you ever really need him.

By the way, Diesel fuel is basically oil so the fuel drip from the leaky injector should not have damaged your engine. In a gasoline engine, a similar excess of fuel can "wash" the oil film off the cylinder walls and rings, causing excessive wear.

 

[Coyote machine]

I will look up the Kioti emissions warranty. Yes...the fuel injectors were discussed as maybe a possible problem. I just decided since the tractor was at the dealer to go ahead and replace all 3. Since they have the engine opened up might as well replace the other 2 as well. I am learning daily about diesel engines from this forum !! I do alot of my own vehicle maintenance but when it comes to doing things that require special tools and expertise i just let the appropriate mechanics do the job.

Skip the warranty wording- I checked it, and it doesn't state specifics about emissions, though it may have in earlier versions. I didn't know your specific year, etc. when searching the details so I may have accessed a warranty for another segment of year(s).

Anyway,
unless you like spending unnecessary $ replace only the bad tested and failed injector. It can be rebuilt, or better yet kept as a spare to rebuild if and when needed.
Replacing all is just unnecessary, period. I speak from the viewpoint of a former owner of a foreign auto repair and sales shop that dealt with diesels day in/day out, in harsh VT mountain climate.
Nothing could be easier to work on than diesel injectors, vs. any other EFI or similar engine fuel control system- as stated by Ritcheyvs, and myself....

 

[747driver]

The new parts are OEM from Kioti. I took the loader off before taking the tractor to the dealer.

Being i still go back and forth from Chicago to Knoxville on my 2 days off i don't have much time to dig into the tractor. So i just figured since they have the tractor and its opened up go on ahead and just replace all 3. I will get the old ones and keep those as spares.

First time i have taken it to this dealer as i bought it out of state. Nice clean shop and dealership. Like you said i will give them the business and go from there !

It was a relief though to know i didn't harm the engine from filling the oil to fast !!

 

[Coyote machine]

The new parts are OEM from Kioti. I took the loader off before taking the tractor to the dealer.

Being i still go back and forth from Chicago to Knoxville on my 2 days off i don't have much time to dig into the tractor. So i just figured since they have the tractor and its opened up go on ahead and just replace all 3. I will get the old ones and keep those as spares.

First time i have taken it to this dealer as i bought it out of state. Nice clean shop and dealership. Like you said i will give them the business and go from there !

It was a relief though to know i didn't harm the engine from filling the oil to fast !!

Atta boy! Keep the old ones as spares, or sell them as used to recoup some of the costs.

 

[747driver]

Update again ! They have the injectors replaced and the tractor is running. But it is not running to the satisfaction of the mechanic. #3 cylinder is at 80% but said i can take the tractor home but would not be happy , hence dragging it back to the dealer. He doesn't like to return equipment thats running 100%. Anyway, he is thinking there is some possible piston or ring damage in #3 from the excess fuel that was being put in that cylinder. Excess fuel tends to wash the cylinder walls and rings away. Do these engines have sleeves in the cylinder or not ? At least they are being honest and letting me know. I did get my oil sample back from the Lab. No metal found and no antifreeze found. Just a small amount of fuel was found though. So i should get the final answer this coming week !!

 

[747driver]

Final Update ! I brought home the tractor yesterday. In what was thought as a hydrolok due from filling the oil to fast thru the manifold service port, turned out to not be the case at all. The hydrolok occurred due to the #3 fuel nozzle leaking and filling up the cylinder. So when i went to start the tractor i had a partial lok. Thats what was causing the tractor to smoke. The dealer changed all 3 nozzles ( my request since i had the tractor there ) but tractor still smoked. The #3 nozzle was found to have debris in it, probably when i changed the fuel filter ? They removed the head and found #3 piston rod bent due to the fuel hydrolok. This resulted in a complete #3 cylinder rebuild. Total price on the repairs was $3000. I contacted Kioti USA to see what warranty i had left. Very helpful and to my satisfaction Kioti paid $2100 of the bill !!!. I paid for the fuel injectors as they were not under warranty. Very good mechanics at Homestead Tractor in Cleveland, TN. They didn't want the tractor leaving the shop until it ran normally. Now i can get back to a list of projects that have piled up for me !!

Thanks for all the advice everyone !!