Compact telehandlers

[Xfaxman]

Here is my anchor.

 

[mike69440]

You have some decent tires on that thing. Counts for a lot.

 

[Xfaxman]

The telehandler hydraulic trailer hitch: Quick Hitch: Cat Telehandler Operator Tip (Europe) - YouTube

 

[mmancuso13]

That is really handy!

 

[Xfaxman]

ArmyDoc, we need an update, please, Did you decide on a decision?

 

[ArmyDoc]

Going to go see one a week from Friday. Hadn't been able to get away till now to take a drive up to the dealership. But based on what I've read so far, and unless I find something unexpected, I suspect I'll pull the trigger.

 

[Piston]

That high flow hydraulics option would have me sold over other brands right away.

I️interested to see what you end up with.

 

[ArmyDoc]

That high flow hydraulics option would have me sold over other brands right away.

I️interested to see what you end up with.

That has been the deciding factor for me too. Kind of a winding road to get here though. I started out wanting a tractor with a Cab and FEL. When I told the tractor dealer what I wanted to do, he expressed a lot of concern about using a tractor to do it. He felt I said I should have someone with a forestry mulcher come in and cut brush and scrub sweetgum down, the use the tractor to keep it under control afterwards. And he's probably right, that would be a cheaper way to do it. Problem is I know myself. I won't do that. I've already had someone cut in fire breaks etc. But the ones in the back of the property, I don't see and don't get around to keeping in check. I have my hands full with the parts of the property that I do keep up. I can only spend once a year doing the other parts. (still, probably cheaper to hire it out...)

Anyhow, I started to look at heavy CTLs with a forestry package and forestry mulching heads...whew. Can easily get north of 100k. Then I found the JCB teleskid. It had high flow hydraulics and a telehandler boom. Nice machine, but still ~80k. With a heavy grapple and heavy brush cutter, looking at 90+. Then I found the Merlo machines. They had a telehandler with high flow hydraulics and a 3point with PTO on the back. It seemed perfect. Unfortunately they are only bringing the heavy and medium duty machines over initially (~150hp and ~90hp) and at 145k and 115k, they were out of my reach. I practically begged them to bring over the 27 series in a multifarmer, but they say not possible. No parts network set up, hasn't had emissions certification for the US and too expensive to get for just one machine etc. Oh well.

The 27.6 plus telehandler is just over $65k. It doesn't have the PTO but seems to be the least expensive way to get high flow hydraulics up from front with a strong FEL capability. I'm going up to look at one next friday. Hoping a) find no deal breakers in person and b) that the new job gets my pay figured out by then.

 

[ArmyDoc]

Well, I went and saw it. Nice machine. Handles well, very intuitive. Have some reservations.
First, it has a merlo specific quick-attach called the Tac-lock. I really like it, but, if I get my implements with that on them, would make it hard to re-sell them. If I use the SSQA adapter plate, it's an extra $1800, and the SSQA is manual. No biggie, but with a V519 or JCB 25-60, Its controlled from inside the cab and is a standard SSQA. Merlo Tac-lock implements are more expensive... so the price advantage for the merlo quickly goes away

Second is a double edged sword. It has high flow hydraulics. This is good, because I could run high flow equipment. This is also bad, because I can't run standard flow equipment. The JCB teleskid had both standard and high flow, so I thought that if it had high flow, it would have standard flow too. Apparently not the case for any of the telehandler lines (merlo, JCB, bobcat or what ever) They all have whatever flow they have, and that's it.

Third, the Valves don't have check safeties - would have to add that. So, for example if you're using a grapple, and a line is cut, the grapple will snap down by gravity. With a check-valve, it would stay up. Bobcat and JCB are standard/included. This just kind of bugs me... kind of a nickel and dime thing which doesn't make me feel good.

Lastly, tires are smaller. (thanks a lot tungularafishcamp, Since you pointed it out it's been bugging me.) Rims are 16.5 inches. JCB is 18 and Bobcat v519 is 20, with commensurately wider tires.

They can do a rear hydraulic package on it, for ~$600, and it can have a hitch, just not a 3-point like I wanted. They have a 3-point for it in europe, but not avail here. I even asked if they could order the parts from europe and put them on here. Was told no... :grumpy:

Anyhow, going to take a closer look at the bobcat now. Have seen the JCB, and I like it quite a bit. Probably all three machines are very similar and I won't go wrong with any of them... but that won't stop me from sweating out the details. :laughing:

 

[Xfaxman]

Thanks for the update. Too bad it was negative.

Waiting now for your report on the V519.

 

[mike69440]

Tires are a big Issue with a heavy machine. I have a ballasted Kubota L39, only +8,000 lbs not the 6 tons of a tele-handler and the small tires suck.
There was a used nice Bobcat the went on auction recently, too bad you missed it.

 

[ArmyDoc]

Here's a comparison of the machines I've been considering. Won't let me post columns or an excel spreadsheet, so I just took a picture of the spread sheet


Turns out makes 3 versions of the 525-60 - the Agri and Agri plus models, and their construction version, which is now called teh 505-20TC. The construction version is about the same performance as the 525-60 Agri, which is about the same as the Bobcat v519, but is cheaper by quite a bit. Now I have to find out what the real difference is, besides smaller tires... Also need to find out which Agri the quote for $76k is... hoping the plus.

 

[Xfaxman]

See if this is readable in the post:

 

[ArmyDoc]

Cool! Thanks.

Couple of notes - the JCB guy hasn't given me a detailed quote - just that the 505-20TC is ~60k without a CAB, and ~ 65-66k with. He said the Agri line was about 75-76, but didn't specify which. He said the main difference was:

Construction machine is a great machine, the difference with Agri is

Faster hydraulic cycle times (Plus has 3770 psi vs 505-20TC's 3408, and 23.75 gpm vs 21.1gpm)
Larger tires and wheels (12.5/80R18 vs 12/70R16.5)
Faster travel speed (Plus is 19mph vs 505-20 16mph)
More torque for pushing (don't know what he means - engine is same. But drive is hydraulic, so maybe because of increase pressure / flow)
Transmission dump pedal, it disengages the transmission when you push the pedal so that you can raise the RPM and operated them at a higher speed without driving forward. Would be like pressing clutch on a manual transmission, but this is hydrostatic.
(merlo has this too they call it an Inching Pedal, as does the v519. v519 also it has the ability to keep drive speed low while running engine at full to get full hydraulic power to implement. JCB has "proportional constant flow" which may be similar...have to ask.)

All in all, JCB base model, merlo and v519 are extremely close in terms of specs. v519 has some nice features that are only found on JCBs + model. JCB seems to be least expensive (in 505-20tc model), then the Merlo, bobcat v519 and finally the JCB agri plus model.

Merlo doesn't have safety check valves to protect from a line rupture - JCB does. I think v519 does... Merlo doesn't have standard SSQA. JCB does, v519 has Bob-tach which I understand is the original SSQA. Merlo doesn't have boom stabilization/isolation when driving while JCB and v519 do. So Merlo is out of the running for me.

I need to ask about rear hydraulics. JCB has them as an option. Both the JCB and v519 have hitches that can be mounted in the rear. Having a rear aux could allow for a hydraulic pto or other power source for a pull behind implement, such as a harrow with hydraulic wheels, etc. Haven't physically seen the v519 - they don't have one in stock. Asked the manager to call me if one comes in or even if a customer brings one in for servicing, so I could see it. (ideally drive it) He said he would call... Hmm. May have to take another road trip.

 

[aczlan]

Merlo doesn't have safety check valves to protect from a line rupture

That is odd, you can buy them for $9 each from Surplus Center (
1/2" NPT 18 GPM Check Valve 65 PSI Cracking | Dynamic | Brands | www.surpluscenter.com ). I wonder if they could be retrofitted onto the Merlo.

Aaron Z

 

[Xfaxman]

Another difference with the JCB construction machines is they have R4 tread tires. I like R1 much better.

The Manitou is also a good one:

 

[Thall303]

Is it air conditioned?

 

[ArmyDoc]

All the ones I'm looking at have CAB with A/C.

 

[rScotty]

All the ones I'm looking at have CAB with A/C.

The telehandlers are very neat, but I can't help wondering about alternatives.
Your budget would also buy nice machinery in the nearly new market.

For example You could buy two machines that both come with spacious cabs, AC, and give yourself the advantages of a known product with local dealerships and technical support. This would give you an easy way to educate yourself on what features you need.

One machine could be a low hour construction loader/backhoe ike an JD 310SK. This type of machine has the safety and capability that comes with size. As nifty as a telehandlers are - and I love them - a construction backhoe will easily perform many of the same chores in comfort. There's good reasons why TLBs are so popular all around the world. A spacious cab is nice. Your back will thank you for touches like an air-suspended seats and the optional "comfort ride". Filtered air and sound isolation good enough to listen to FM radio, too.

And to that machine could be added a second which would be any of several name brand cabbed 100 HP Ag tractors for the 3pt capability. Simply pick one that you like the looks of. The market is full of these large reliable low hour Ag tractors. from the mid 90s on up. Like the TLBs, Ag tractors also have the heavy construction and size to isolate you in AC comfort from whatever carnage is being worked by the three point implement being towed behind you.

You couldn't buy both of these machines new in the budget you've posted, but I think low hour used ones could be had by a determined salesman. It would be interesting to see what your local dealers could come up with. Unlike telehandlers, these types of machines have dealerships most everywhere which creates an active used market with a known used value. So that in the future if the perfect telehandler came along you coud sell out and make the switch. That would not be so easy to do in the other direction.

It's worth thinking about...
rScotty

 

[ArmyDoc]

The telehandlers are very neat, but I can't help wondering about alternatives.
Your budget would also buy nice machinery in the nearly new market.

For example You could buy two machines that both come with spacious cabs, AC, and give yourself the advantages of a known product with local dealerships and technical support. This would give you an easy way to educate yourself on what features you need.

One machine could be a low hour construction loader/backhoe ike an JD 310SK. This type of machine has the safety and capability that comes with size. As nifty as a telehandlers are - and I love them - a construction backhoe will easily perform many of the same chores in comfort. There's good reasons why TLBs are so popular all around the world. A spacious cab is nice. Your back will thank you for touches like an air-suspended seats and the optional "comfort ride". Filtered air and sound isolation good enough to listen to FM radio, too.

And to that machine could be added a second which would be any of several name brand cabbed 100 HP Ag tractors for the 3pt capability. Simply pick one that you like the looks of. The market is full of these large reliable low hour Ag tractors. from the mid 90s on up. Like the TLBs, Ag tractors also have the heavy construction and size to isolate you in AC comfort from whatever carnage is being worked by the three point implement being towed behind you.

You couldn't buy both of these machines new in the budget you've posted, but I think low hour used ones could be had by a determined salesman. It would be interesting to see what your local dealers could come up with. Unlike telehandlers, these types of machines have dealerships most everywhere which creates an active used market with a known used value. So that in the future if the perfect telehandler came along you coud sell out and make the switch. That would not be so easy to do in the other direction.

It's worth thinking about...
rScotty

First, I want to thank you for taking the time to write this. Thoughtful, constructive input is really helpful, as this is not an easy decision process.

There are two sides to what I need to do. The first would be best filled by a tractor, of that I have no doubt. For managing pastures, tractors seem ideal. But I only have 12-15 acres of pasture at present. The other ~175 acres is planted pine forest.
I'm not sure a back hoe would work very well for that part. Some areas of the forested land are fairly open (12-15ft spacing)and level, and I suppose a back hoe would work in those areas. But, others are fairly tight (8ft spacing) and on a slope.

It was suggested that I get a CTL for managing the forest. (though I'm not sure how the the CTL would do on the slopes... Skids steers are tippy, but maybe a CTL is less so?) Xfaxman's numerous posts on what he does with his telehandler are what got me looking at these. They are small, maneuverable, have better FEL capablites than even the CTL, and seem to be well suited for the forestry portion. I'm sure they aren't as good as a tractor for pulling, but they do have hitch capabilities, out weigh my 45hp tractor and though they don't have a pto (in this size range) they do have rear hydraulics.

So, I don't know. I might be better served with a used CAB tractor and a CTL/skid steer. But my mechanical abilities are poor, and I worry about buying used equipment, both from a maintenance standpoint and from the standpoint of recognizing a lemon...