Creating a Lake

[EddieWalker]

Pat & David,

I need to take some pictures, but I'll try to be clearer on the rip rap.

When the water leaves the culvert, it's flowing very quickly, just like Pat said.

My concrete chunks are bigger than they should be. They are from the Rifle Range the Army built here in WWII. I own Rifle Range #4 of Camp Fannin. The concrete is busted up to various sizes. Some are hundreds of pounds and I can only move them with the hoe stick. Others are as small as tennis balls. I sort of created a path for the water to take on it's way to the pond.

The overall drop is about six feet right now and should be 4 feet when the lake is full. For most of the distance, it's fairly flat, then when it gets to the water, it drops of fairly quickly.

The problem I've noticed is the water gets under the concrete and starts digging channels. I dumped sacks of readi mix in between the spaces of the concrete to form a solid path for the water to travel. It's not smooth, but random with contours and high spots. The more water that goes through the culvert, the more it will be tumbled.

It's not that I planed that to happen, but that I wanted a rough looking path for the water to travel. In my mental picture, I see the grass groing to the edge of the concrete in random paterns and a semi natural look. If I ever find any rocks here, that's where I'll put them to make it look more natural.

The concrete sacks were to stop the water from taking out the soil as it entered the culvert. With massive downpours, I was loosing my soil around the entrance to the culvert. The 40lb sacks have dried nicely and are very solid. I no longer have any erosion problems there.

Thanks,
Eddie

 

[patrick_g]

Pat,
If I understood Eddie's post, he is using sacks of Redimix that remain in the sack. It is used all of the time in areas of California where streams flood roads due to excessive rain fall or an early snow melt. I have no idea of how long it lasts.
David B

David, Well DU-UH, I just didn't get it! For absorbing the energy of the running water and preventing erosion I think the $ would be better spent with riprap as described in previous post for the reasons stated instead of buying concrete.

How long will a bag of concrete last that "goes off" in the bag? A very long time. A friend of mine and I wanted to grout in some large iron rings on piton like little posts set into crevices in a rock outcropping in the middle of a submerged volcanic crater at an island off the Pacific coast of Mexico.

We took a bag of READY CRETE wrapped up in a plastic garbage bag down with us when we sailed to that island. My buddy was in the dinghy and I was carying the crete to the starboard rail to hand it down. Everyone kept hollering at me to keep a hand under the bag so it wouldn't rip, so I did. One hand holding the top of the bag and one hand supporting it from below. as I leaned over the side of the plastic bag split open and the bag of crete barely missed the dinghy and my friend and went to the bottom in over 30 ft of ocean.

The next time we went we were even more careful and grouted in the rings which were so multiple yachts could easily use the rock for a bow mooring. When we snorkeled the little basin formed by the volcanic crater with one side missing (where we saied in and out) we always were reminded of the earlier thrilling episode because the sack of crete was still there. The paper sack was long since deteriorated and returned to the ecosystem but the pillow shaped sack of hardened crete was and still most likely is there. This was, I think, in the late 70's. We mused over what marine archeologists would make of it centuries from now.

A breeze fluttered my Bimini shade and an aluminum pole about 1 inch by 8 ft fell over the side (a retaining tie wasn't properly tied, ARGHHH,land lubbers!) and when I dove down to get it I found it next to the concrete pillow. This was maybe 10 years or more later. NO telling how long it might last.

Used as described downstream of a culvert, a lump of crete may be eroded over time if there is a sand and gravel transport in the flow of water but if there is no abrasive it coild last a very long time indeed. I have dug up fence posts that were in the ground over 50 years that had been set in concrete just dumped in the hole dry with no added water. Takes a while to cure but still does a decent job.

Pat

 

[EddieWalker]

I read where tilapia require 76 to 84 degree water. This was in a state paper on raising them commercially. What is the average annual temperature of the air at your locaton Eddie?

Sorry I didn't reply to your question earlier.

A non official observation is that April, we'll be in the 80's everyday and 60's every night. This will increase until July, when it will be in the 90's during the days and 70's at night. During the worse of the summer heat, we'll break 100 degrees. Usually it only happens a few times a year with high 90's being the average tempatures in August and September. By October it's real nice out again until December.

Guys on PondBoss that live in my area report there Talipia dying off then.

Thanks,
Eddie

 

[patrick_g]

Eddie, If tilapia are to be considered as an annual, how large must they be when you stock them to get adequate size in one season? Are they particularly fast growing in your climate?

Pat

 

[EddieWalker]

I went down to the lake this morning to take these pictures of the culvert and how the water drains through it to the lake.

The first picture shows the water as it drains into my silt pit, fills up and then enters the culvert. You can see the concrete sacks that I put rebar through them. They are doing a great job of stoping erosion along the edges of the culvert.

In the background of that picture, you can see Lake Marabou. The island looking area is realy the brush that I left on the undewater island. It's two feet under water in this picture and all you see is the tops of the brush. I considered removing it, but decided to keep it as a level of shelter for my minnows when I put the fish in this spring. It's kind of ugly, but it will disapear in time.

The second picture shows the other side of the culvert with water flowing through it. I still need to do allot to make it pretty, but this picture should do a better job of explaining what I'm doing than I did with words.

The third picture shows it the same thing, but further back. You can see how the water is flowing over my readi mix/concrete chunk mixture, to where I haven't finished. I have allot more concrete in the area I'm burning, but it's too muddy to get the backhoe in there and get out again with two wheel drive.

Eddie

 

[patrick_g]

Eddie, A load of gravel the size of your fist and larger would sure help.

Pat

 

[EddieWalker]

Eddie, If tilapia are to be considered as an annual, how large must they be when you stock them to get adequate size in one season? Are they particularly fast growing in your climate?

Pat

Hey Pat,

This is one of those things that I don't have a clue about. The guys who do this every year, have been studying the results and growth of thier bass compared to having Talipia and not hanving them. They feel the advantage is more than worthwhile.

My only hesitation is that I'm not putting bass in until this summer when I have a few spawns of fathead minnows. Then the bass will have plenty of forage to feed on.

I'll wait until I talk to the suppliers and decide at that time wether it's a good idea to put Talipia in this year, or wait until 2008.

Thanks,
Eddie

 

[patrick_g]

Eddie, I guess I get it now. You are interested in the tilapia as bass food. Tilapia are sold in stores for people to eat and I have been told that if you like bass you will like tilapia. My question was regarding the tilapia getting to a good pan fish size in one season. Not important if they are bass food.

I stocked my fathead minnows almost two years ago when I stocked 200 4 inch channel cats and haven't a clue how well they did. I guess I will either have to electrofish to get a representative sample or at least partially seine the pond with fine mesh to get an idea if they did OK.

Pat

 

[EddieWalker]

We had an inch of water in my rain guage this morning, so Steph and I figured it would make the math real easy to see how much the water came up in the lake.

I was 29 inches low when I put the yardstick in the ground, and this morning, it reads that I'm 26 inches low.

One inch of rain, raised the lake three inches.

This is allot less than I expected. I have at least 20 acres of watershed, and it could be as much as twice that with my neighbors land above me. What I'm seeing is the areas that I've cleared the trees, I'm getting lots of water run off. The area with all the timber still on it isn't giving me hardly anything.

In my previous post, you can see all the water that I'm getting through my 15 inch culvert. That is the small one. I have an 18 inch culvert that should be handeling almost twice as much area, but it's not getting half the water the 15 inch culvert is.

I've walked the area and there is just no sign of runoff, erosion or any evidence of water running across the ground. All I can think of is that the ground is just sucking it all up.

Eddie

 

[patrick_g]

Eddie, I see the same effect. If it rains enough and frequently enough the ground will get wet enough to let water run off. If you do the measurement each time you will see variable results, not like having a paved parking lot for a water shed. Don't worry till the lake comes up less than the rain gage indicates.

Pat