Creating a Lake

[patrick_g]

Eddie, bet you are getting near full now. My worst drought stricken pond was one of the three in the back yard (several acres) but with snow and ice melt over the last week it is near overflow, much of its fill coming from the catfish pond I made upstream of it which is overflowing.

Pat

 

[EddieWalker]

Pat,

There are a few areas on top of the dam that have some ruts in them and are almost perfectly flat that I want to add some dirt to. Over the full length of the dam, I might add another hundred yards to shape the crown better and make it smoother to walk and drive on. I know that's not a significant amount compared to the size of it, but it is more dirt, so that's a good thing.

We received almost half an inch of rain on Saturday, but I can't tell any difference on the yard stick. It's still in the same spot. I don't understand how that's possible, but there is also very little sign of runoff. Those slow soakers just dont provide for very dramatic changes in my water level. hahaha

Charlie,

My neighbor is one of those guys who's spent thousands and thousands of dollars getting his bermuda pastures in. He's disked and treated the soil to get it just perfect, the spriged it and fertalized after the sprigs started to grow. He fertalized it again in the fall.

The following spring, he disked it all in again and spriged it again with a different supplier. He wasn't happy with the results from the previous year.

Then he fertalized again after the sprigs came in. Then over he summer, he overseeded it with a few thousand dollars worth of bermuda seed.

He's probably got about 40 acres in grass overall and I can't even guess how much money he's spent. I have five acres in grass and mine looks just as good as his. He doesn't agree with me and is always suggesting that I do what he's doing. Neither of us are growing hay, or raising livestock, so I'm at a loss as to why I'd want to do anything more than what I am.

Bermuda will come in nicely, but it will take a year or two before it covers everything. I'm not in a rush, so I'll stick with doing it the cheap way. hahaha

Bob,

I've had good results with the Pennington bermuda seed from Walmart, Sams, Lowes and Home Depot. I'm sure it's all the same stuff, but it's a little cheaper at Sams. Recently I've switched to the seed from my farm supply store. His seed is 99.0% pure bermuda seed and when I do the math and compare that to the purity of the Pennington brand, there is a significant difference.

Rox,

Thank you. We're very exited and proud of the lake. If you had any idea of what I imagined it to look like, and how it's turned out, you wouldn't believe me. I never expected the drought or the digging conditions to be what they were. The lake is in the only place I have to put it, but it's still a terrible location to build one. I got very, very lucky with the weather. If the drought hadn't been as severe as it was, and lasted for as long as it did, I would have something that I know think I might have been embarassing.

I got very lucky.

Thanks,
Eddie

 

[have_blue]

Eddy,

Sounds like your neighbor is just as obsessed with grass as we are with ponds.

I've had real good luck with Pennington Sahara bermuda. It takes mine one summer to cover solid. I use about 1/3 as much seed as the instructions, because it is was way too much. Of course I'm blessed with a lot more rain and soil moisture than you, so my seed may be surviving better. I never mow my bermuda fields, and it only gets ~8-10" tall. I bush hog my levees as low as I can with good, sharp blades, and they look nearly like a lawn. The centipede is kicking in good now, and starting to take over the bermuda in about 30% of planted areas. With good rain, I think the centipede will be 90% by this fall. It won't ever need mowing either, and chokes out weeds way better than bermuda. I love the way centipede thickly drapes itself over the pond banks, and prevents wave erosion.

 

[EddieWalker]

Bob,

Your description of what the Centapede is just what I imagine. I've never seen it do this, or at least, never recognized it for Centapede, and sure would love to see a few pics if you have any???

As soon as it starts to warm up, I'll be planting more seed. I have the option of hulled or un-hulled depending on the conditions. If it's just right, the hulled will come up faster, but if not, it will rot or die on me. Un-hulled is a safer bet and what I'll probably use.

Thanks,
Eddie

 

[patrick_g]

I took a look at a sampling of my ponds today and all are overflowing. I get a lot of "helpful suggestions" about doing more bermuda but am not all that motivated. I have pretty good native grass over a lot of my 160 acres and it outperforms bermuda when it is dry. Fertilizer is mostly counter productive on native grasses. Without good rain when you need it fertilizer is money wasted on bermuda. Of course, if you have the water to go with the nitrogen you can grow bermuda like crazy and outperform my native grasses several times over by dumping huge quantities of $ into nitrogen fertilizer. The breakeven point or where additional units of nitrogen cost more than the value of the extra grass they provide comes with production 3-4 times (or more depending on costs) what you get without fertilizer.

I am resistant to getting too dependent on bermuda (fear of drought) and at most may experiment with say 40 acres or less of bermuda and leave the rest in mixed native grasses. Hedging my bets so I don't get skunked in a dry spell but with good water will have a bumper crop of hay from the bermuda.

I do encourage bermuda on the pond dams as it is a good erosion preventer. I want to get better bermuda coverage for some of the overflow swales but may have to get some BIG limestone gravel (riprap) in a few places. I also need to raise the overflow control height of a couple dams as they are too conservative (or have worn down over time.)

Pat

 

[Bird]

All this talk about ponds and lakes sure makes me jealous of being back out in the country. But I did have puddles Saturday. Of course they're gone now.

 

[riprap]

One thing I don't see mentioned here in discussing erosion protection is the use of geotextile fabric under your rip rap or other stone armor. Some type of filter fabric will make a tremendous difference in the depth of rock required to prevent undermining of the stone. As an example of the types/usage of material I am talking about here is one manufacturer - Mirafi Products Index, there are many around and most drainage/road construction supply places will stock appropriate weights and sizes for this usage.

It really should be considered manditory to use fabric under stone for erosion protection since it is relatively low cost, easy to install and worth its weight in many tons of stone.

 

[MarkV]

All this talk about ponds and lakes sure makes me jealous of being back out in the country. But I did have puddles Saturday. Of course they're gone now.

Bird, you have a nice start there but I believe you need to excavate a little deeper before you stock your pond.

MarkV

 

[EddieWalker]

Pat,

My understanding and experience with bermuda and the drought we just had is very positive. We had a very hot July, August and September with many days over 100 degrees. We didn't get any rain for months at a time and the fire danger was extreme. During all that, my bermuda stayed green and looked nice. It didn't grow very much, and maybe that's the difference.

You must be growing grass for livestock and not to look pretty? And I want grass to cover the ground and look pretty.

I don't fertalize or spend any money on it once it's planted. It just grows and does it's own thing. Mowing is about all I do for it.

My biggest concern, and maybe that's the wrong word, is what to do in the shadey areas. I don't even know if I want grass to grow around all the trees, or is I like the more natural look of leaves and whatever is already there??? At least I still have plenty of time. My thinking is to let it go and see what happens. If the bermuda gets enough sun, it will grow under the trees just fine, if not, then I'll have to come up with Plan B.

Bird,

Your pictures reminded me of my brother. He'd through out a few decoys in a puddle like that in the back yard, or even the neighbors yard after a heavy rain. But I remember puddles like that as being the most fun around when I was a kid. We'd go crazy for something like that!!!!

riprap,

Welcome to TBN!!! Until just now when I read your post, it never occured to me to put down fabric. I should have done that when I put the culverts in.

I can tell you that my thought process was very limited in this area. My goal was, and is, to channel all the runoff water that I can catch and direct it to the lake. Then get it under my shoreline road without causing any damage and to keep as much silt out as I can. I'm guilty of focusing too much on the water getting to the culverts, and almost nothing on what happens when it leaves the culverts.

Laying out fabric and the proper sized rock would have been the best way to go. I'm not sure if it's too late or advantagous to change it now, but will spend some time thinking on it. Thanks.

Mark,

Good point. Maybe Bird can find a friend with a tractor who will dig a hole for him???? hahaha Lots of folks think a fishing pond adds value to there land!!! hahaha

Thanks,
Eddie

 

[have_blue]

I have pretty good native grass over a lot of my 160 acres and it outperforms bermuda when it is dry.
Pat

Pat,

The native grasses in my area outperform bermuda by 10:1. That's why I prefer bermuda (and eventually centipede) to the native grasses.

In all seriousness, the native grasses here grow way too fast and too tall. My goal is good erosion control, little or no bush hogging, no fertilizer needed, and dominance over weeds. Appearance is way down the list, but centipede looks awesome once it takes over the bermuda. Bermuda needs fertilizer to look nice, but I want the centipede to take it over anyway. Centipede does great without any fertilizer at all.

Eddy,

I'll try to get some pics. My land is a wreck right now from all the equipment, cold weather causing brownout, and ~30" or rain since October.