Tractor News DPF PROBLEMS ON A BRASON 4520R

[jeff9366]

At least, with Branson you can still get a brand new tractor and have the possibility of also having a emission-free tractor.

Not very well worded.

Branson may operate with emission control apparatus removed, but its exhaust will be extremely dirty relative to Tier IV standards.

 

[the old grind]

At least, with Branson you can still get a brand new tractor and have the possibility of also having a emission-free tractor.

It isn't just Branson going back to EGR and DOC with common rail injection (AKA computer controlled/cleaner) to make Tier IV vs PDF and regen cycles with mechanical injection. Massey is doing it with Shibaura CUTs, Mahindra with a slew of models sourced form Earth, and we might be surprised to see who else is going there with their next model changes.

So, we gotta check model by model from now say until we all have self-driving electric tractors that run on clean, beautiful coal.

 

[ericm979]

Branson uses mechanical injection and a DOC+DPF that does low temp continual regen rather than periodic high temp regens that other DPF systems use. While I found a paper describing this system and application in buses, as far as I know Branson is the only one using it for tractors. There's no electrical tie between the DOC+DPF and the engine, just the data recorder that lights up the dash light. I haven't seen anything about Branson or their parent company Kukje changing the emissions system.

The only DPF with mechanical injection system I know about is Kubota's B3350, which is getting a new EFI engine. Probably because it had a lot of emissions related problems, especially in cold weather.

 

[ptsg]

Not very well worded.

Branson may operate with emission control apparatus removed, but its exhaust will be extremely dirty relative to Tier IV standards.

Branson tractors are sold, here in my country, without any of the emissions apparatus from the factory. Just a simple gold ol'muffler. Other than a tiny bit smoke at the start up, which is normal, it won't smoke at while working.

Now, we are yet to see if all these emission apparatus are actually beneficial for the environment or not... I can't still understand the point of having to run the tractors pretty much wide open plus wasting extra fuel during regens while in the end the DPF will dump all that crap out anyway. But that's another discussion and there are lots of threads about it everywhere.

It isn't just Branson going back to EGR and DOC with common rail injection (AKA computer controlled/cleaner) to make Tier IV vs PDF and regen cycles with mechanical injection. Massey is doing it with Shibaura CUTs, Mahindra with a slew of models sourced form Earth, and we might be surprised to see who else is going there with their next model changes.

So, we gotta check model by model from now say until we all have self-driving electric tractors that run on clean, beautiful coal.

Not sure if I fully understand your post but does any of those brands mentioned, other than Branson, allow you to take the DOC canister and the data logger out, and still have a perfectly running tractor? Without any lights flashing at you or something preventing the tractor from running.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

Not very well worded.

Branson may operate with emission control apparatus removed, but its exhaust will be extremely dirty relative to Tier IV standards.

Only the opinion of someone who hasn't done it, doesn't have the tractor in question, with the system in place that we are talking about.

Thanks for stopping by.


I have one. I've done the mod. I can tell you from my own personal experience of "Then-vs.-Now" that the tractor runs as clean as before when in use. The ONLY thing you'll notice is the puff of smoke at start up. That's it. The rest of the time, you wouldn't be able to tell it from an identical model running next to it that still had the DOC razz-matazz in place. It no longer smells like newborn puppy farts, but there is NO SMOKE while in use.

Again, thanks for stopping by.

 

[the old grind]

... does any of those brands mentioned, other than Branson, allow you to take the DOC canister and the data logger out, and still have a perfectly running tractor? Without any lights flashing at you or something preventing the tractor from running.

DOC is just a diesel version of catalytic converter, runs all the time, needs no controls or monitors. I have a tier 4A(AKA interim) Shibaura 1.7L that has DOC and EGR with mechanical injection, the part of a diesel that's about as sophisticated as an old-fashioned gas engine ignition, perhaps with mechanical, but without vacuum advance. When the injector pump is timing the engine, what compensates for load, rpm, etc??

Massey's Shibaura engines seem to have added the common rail, like Mahindra, letting computer 'time' according to sensor inputs. DOC and EGR, and yes, the computer would surely monitor, say relative input/output pressures. Even a crude 'cat' can plug up. Any Mahindra guys seeing different than I? I see soot cookers fading someday, perhaps at the expense of the risk of incipient 'digital dependence'.

I wouldn't take a DOC off. (AKA Cast iron mufflers on my three) Guys who say their stuff runs fine with a few bits removed are certainly to be believed, esp if some onboard computer didn't go goggy when a sensor was bypassed, removed, or 'cheated' (add resistor/thermistor, etc).

 

[ptsg]

DOC is just a diesel version of catalytic converter, runs all the time, needs no controls or monitors. I have a tier 4A(AKA interim) Shibaura 1.7L that has DOC and EGR with mechanical injection, the part of a diesel that's about as sophisticated as an old-fashioned gas engine ignition, perhaps with mechanical, but without vacuum advance. When the injector pump is timing the engine, what compensates for load, rpm, etc??

Massey's Shibaura engines seem to have added the common rail, like Mahindra, letting computer 'time' according to sensor inputs. DOC and EGR, and yes, the computer would surely monitor, say relative input/output pressures. Even a crude 'cat' can plug up. Any Mahindra guys seeing different than I? I see soot cookers fading someday, perhaps at the expense of the risk of incipient 'digital dependence'.

I wouldn't take a DOC off. (AKA Cast iron mufflers on my three) Guys who say their stuff runs fine with a few bits removed are certainly to be believed, esp if some onboard computer didn't go goggy when a sensor was bypassed, removed, or 'cheated' (add resistor/thermistor, etc).

Ok, so you answer my question anyway. Basically you can't remove it unless you hack all kinds of sensors. Which doesn't NOT happen with Branson.

As I and others said, Branson uses a bolt on DOC canister (which is definitely not cast iron) and NO EGR.

To remove it, it's as simple as remove the DOC and Data logger. Simple and easy. Not EGRs, no computers, no hacks going on, nothing. It's just a simple tractor with a normal muffler like they use to be. In fact, Branson sells the same tractors without DOC, in some countries on Europe.

I'm pretty sure non of those brands you mentioned, work that way. Specially since those brands uses all kinds of electronics for everything.

 

[the old grind]

I have two of these. One is on a Tier III tractor ('06), and this one is on a Tier IV-interim. ('13)



Example, 2019 M-F 1735E uses DOC vs DPF, and has computer-control for the common rail injectors. There are no regen cycles. btw, Their 'cat' is sheet metal, like my Tier II '04 has, vs the newer two I have that might not be CI after all.

I guess neither Euro Bransons or American non-Bransons are going to help the OP much.

 

[RFJ]

Does anyone know of a source off stock Branson mufflers, someone here suggested that some of the European countries are not using TIER 4 emissions?
I spoke with Branson in Georgia yesterday and there solution is run tractor at 2200 rpm . Which to me is completely unreasonable. If that the case why even set idle speed at 800 rpm?

 

[ptsg]

I'm afraid you won't be able to get a factory muffler from an European Branson on the US.

What the user Slowpoke Slim did, was to get an aftermarket muffler, and went to an exhaust shop for them to mount. Let me say, it came out almost like a factory one. They did really nice and clean job.