Driverless Cars

/ Driverless Cars #2  
I think what we'll be seeing in a lot of fields before full automation is remote presence -- things that can be piloted by someone at a distance. Kind of like how drones over the Middle East are piloted by a bunch of guys in an office park in Nevada.

It's a lot easier to make a car that can handle 99% of driving than one that handles 100%. If you make a car that can handle 99% -- and crucially, can tell when it's in a situation it can't handle -- you can have it flip to manual control when it realizes it's over its head. With remote presence that doesn't have to mean a driver in the car -- it can be a person in a service center. Imagine a giant call center* where all they do all day long is take over cars that have gotten into a situation they can't figure out, and getting them out of it. Probably a lot of the time that will just mean parking and calling for a tow. So yeah, you'd be able to sleep in the back.

(*In India, I'd imagine.)
 
/ Driverless Cars #3  
One thing processor driven cars can offer is fluidity and efficiency...no driver lag, hesitation, indecision etc., etc...not to mention rubbernecking and other distractions...

On the other hand...I tend to think that driverless cars would be taken advantage of by most aggressive drivers and would constantly be having to react...
 
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/ Driverless Cars #4  
What happens in the remote but eventually sure chance that there is a flare off the sun that at least temporarily disrupts GPS signals? Does everything instantly stop in signal absence or are there 100 car pile ups on every busy road?
 
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/ Driverless Cars #5  
What happens in the remote but eventually sure chance that there is a flare off the sun that at least temporarily disrupts GPS signals? Does everything instantly stop in signal absence or are there 100 car pile ups on every busy road?
I would assume there would be redundant inertial or another type of navigation systems in place...maybe something like virtual dead reckoning etc...

If the driverless car scenario were to play out like the OP suggested a possibility of...logically there would also be sensors either in the traffic lanes themselves or along a route's right of way...similar technologies already exist and are in use in the trucking industry...

IMO one of the biggest issues facing driverless cars/trucks is cars and trucks with human drivers trying to use the same lanes etc...
 
/ Driverless Cars
  • Thread Starter
#6  
These systems are definitely coming, and probably faster than we think. A lot of the driver (pun intended) for this is eliminating labour in commercial applications.

That Tesla driver died in 2016 mostly because they put too much faith in the technology - a quote from the BBC article touches on why I think this is going to be a continuing problem in the short-term:

"But while there's no doubt that fully autonomous self-driving cars are on their way, there are concerns that many of us may confuse assisted driving technologies - cruise control, lane keeping, automatic braking, collision avoidance systems and so on - with full autonomy.

And this could make us dangerously complacent."


Human nature..... the same complacency that I see here in Winter that puts 4x4 vehicles (unintentionally) 100 yards off the side of a major highway will create "issues", up until these systems reliably hit full autonomy.

There's an ancient joke about the guy who bought a new Winnebago, then crashed it the first time out because he put it on cruise-control then went in back to lie down. Today, that just sounds like a stupid joke, but does illustrate the perils of not understanding the limits of technology.

Rgds, D.
 
/ Driverless Cars #8  
What about 80,000 pounds being driver less? Currently happening, but a driver still has to sit behind the wheel to keep mere mortals happy!
David from jax
 
/ Driverless Cars #10  
These systems are definitely coming, and probably faster than we think. A lot of the driver (pun intended) for this is eliminating labour in commercial applications.

That Tesla driver died in 2016 mostly because they put too much faith in the technology - a quote from the BBC article touches on why I think this is going to be a continuing problem in the short-term:

"But while there's no doubt that fully autonomous self-driving cars are on their way, there are concerns that many of us may confuse assisted driving technologies - cruise control, lane keeping, automatic braking, collision avoidance systems and so on - with full autonomy.

And this could make us dangerously complacent."


Human nature..... the same complacency that I see here in Winter that puts 4x4 vehicles (unintentionally) 100 yards off the side of a major highway will create "issues", up until these systems reliably hit full autonomy.

There's an ancient joke about the guy who bought a new Winnebago, then crashed it the first time out because he put it on cruise-control then went in back to lie down. Today, that just sounds like a stupid joke, but does illustrate the perils of not understanding the limits of technology.

Rgds, D.

I feel the current Tesla model is fatally flawed. The machine does all the driving -- except for the most challenging parts, where a human needs to be able to take over? Humans aren't built that way. The machine needs to be all or nothing.
 
/ Driverless Cars
  • Thread Starter
#11  
Big Equipment, Powerful Diesels, What Could Go Wrong..... :cool:

....... Go Wrong.........

Wide open fields.... not much to hit. Gated community, relatively low speed and complexity. Not bad places to start.

Rgds, D.
 
/ Driverless Cars
  • Thread Starter
#12  
I feel the current Tesla model is fatally flawed. The machine does all the driving -- except for the most challenging parts, where a human needs to be able to take over? Humans aren't built that way. The machine needs to be all or nothing.

People seem to divide into mostly 2 camps. One group refuses to blindly trust technology, the other (probably larger) group is in a hurry to hand over control - the latter group is disinterested in understanding the nuances of what a particular system's limits are. <<<< That lack of understanding is where many problems may come from.....

Just thought of an old incident that happened to a friend of mine, many years ago. He was driving the 401 here, back when traffic was much lighter, late at night. He was west of Toronto, driving through farmland. Car was a 75 full sized Chev - headlight dimmer switch on the floor. After a few winters up here (salt on boots), those floor switches would barely work, and tended to stick a lot - so he was driving 70mph on Low Beams. Divided highway, no traffic, clear night...... no big deal, UNTIL a vertical wall appeared suddenly in front of the car !

Cranks the wheel, just about lost the car, went across both lanes and both shoulders till he finally pulled off to the right quite a ways up. Lost a couple of hub caps - walked back up the shoulder, not really expecting to find the hubcaps, but mostly wanted to see what the _______ it was he just about plowed into......

...... Turns out, it was just a big cardboard shipping box. It was lying totally flat in the lane and just before his lousy 1975 non-halogen sealed-beam Lo Beams lit it up, a gust of wind raised it up so it was vertical.

I wonder how AI would have handled that one...... ?

Rgds, D.
 
/ Driverless Cars #13  
Lol!

That's something you laugh about after the fact. The auto system probably would have been fine with something like that, as they react, hopefully, much faster and precisely.
 
/ Driverless Cars #14  
What happens with driverless cars on one lane county roads (plenty of them E and S of here) when one meets another car then you have to back up some or hunt for a wide place to pull over?
 
/ Driverless Cars
  • Thread Starter
#15  
/ Driverless Cars
  • Thread Starter
#16  
What happens with driverless cars on one lane county roads (plenty of them E and S of here) when one meets another car then you have to back up some or hunt for a wide place to pull over?

Complex situations like that - control probably gets handed back to the human. OK today..... might get interesting 20 or so years from now.....

Things don't have to be that complex sometimes, to have a failure.....

Volvo fail - Self driving car crashes into peoples - YouTube

Rgds, D.
 
/ Driverless Cars #17  
I just don't think it's going to happen to the point they don't have an option for human control. My example of one lane country roads is just one of many. What about pulling into a private garage, parking garage, etc, where there is no GPS or other signals? What about driving through a field to feed cattle? How about boat ramp traffic?
 
/ Driverless Cars
  • Thread Starter
#18  
I just don't think it's going to happen to the point they don't have an option for human control. My example of one lane country roads is just one of many. What about pulling into a private garage, parking garage, etc, where there is no GPS or other signals? What about driving through a field to feed cattle? How about boat ramp traffic?

With you there, and it's not my preference.

Things do change though. Many young (and even older) people living in high density urban centres don't bother owning a car today. Some don't have licenses, and many just rent a car when needed.

^ Point there.... many folks today (esp. urban) aren't that familiar with vehicle operation in varied environments.

City folks today can have a problem turning a car around on a narrow country lane. It won't get better as new generations grow up letting the vehicle make most/all of the decisions.....

Rgds, D.
 
/ Driverless Cars #20  
I just wonder if we will ever see the immense cost of this technology become cost effective. Forget about whether or not it will become accepted - it may become an accepted mode of transportation for urban america. Look at the condition of our transportation system - we are hesitant to expend the funds to maintain what we already have. What is going to happen to make us spend funds for a new system that will require mega funding and have no positive impact on our currently deteriorating system.
 

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