Electric Cars: Chev Bolt seems to be the first practical one.

[houstonscott]

"Burst into flames", boy, I'm sure glad that isn't a risk with my Pinto. I wonder why so many of these ICE cars in bad accidents seem to burn up. Must be their batteries. :thumbsup:

Charging is not an accident.

 

[IslandTractor]

Charging is not an accident.

Anybody have statistics on how many people die in car fires? I'm betting there have been either none or only a couple in hybrids or electric vehicles. I'm also pretty sure that many hundreds die in ICE vehicle fires after accidents each year.

As for charging, I can charge at literally any outlet my 110v charger cord can reach. No special safety equipment needed. Check out the mandatory fire suppression systems installed in every gas station. Wonder which is safer?

 

[buickanddeere]

Show me a nuclear plant in the US that runs without massive federal subsidies - particularly for insurance, waste storage, disaster cleanup. No such thing. Nuclear so far, only shifts costs to future generations of taxpayers to clean up. Its fine when it works, not so good when something goes wrong.

Fukushima was such a mess that it had major impact on the national economy and will for years. Article. That was an American-designed plant.

I'm not saying stop nuclear, I'm saying account for ALL the costs when using it in a cost comparison.

Nuclear here is self supporting. Part of the operaring budget is to invest billions for decomissioning and storage .

 

[Egon]

I like the fuel cell concept.

The short range electric car for commuting set distances is also attractive. Different methods of charging are possible.

Someone associated the electric car range as dependant on the length of the power cord. Using this as an example the range of a hydro carbon burning vehicle would be the length of the bowser hose!

Nuclear has interesting facets. It's drawbacks are the type of designs chosen and politicians - accountants being in charge of the dollars. The Boffins should have control here as they do have the sceintific knowledge that is required.

The sceintific world is always evolving producing new ideas and methods.

The world we live in is all comprised of required energy for survival. Be it muscle power, wind, water, hydrocarbon, sunlight etc. It should be our goal to pick sources that will do the least damage to our ecosystems.

 

[buickanddeere]

Combine cycle power plants are pushing 70% efficiency, electric cars charging is over 90% efficient so are the motors. If coal burning plants are 50% efficient and the electric car converts 80% of that to mechanical power that would be about 40%. Adding fuel transportation and electric energy transmission losses would drop that to about 20- 25%. And that is about 4 or 5 times better than ICE.

I work in the industry so don't try to baffle myself and others here with numbers that houswives, green wee ies and the media don't know any better about. .

 

[Egon]

I work in the industry so don't try to baffle myself and others here with numbers that houswives, green wee ies and the media don't know any better about. .

o


And you're saying you do? Being encumbered with knowledge above and beyond the masses must be a burden.

 

[vvanders]

o


And you're saying you do? Being encumbered with knowledge above and beyond the masses must be a burden.

:laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

 

[buickanddeere]

o


And you're saying you do? Being encumbered with knowledge above and beyond the masses must be a burden.

Have to wonder how the green weenies who couldn't change out a battery in a car are so certain that pollution free wind and solar power is possible for the entire world . And the news media, politicians and general public believe their happy feel good dreams. Yet engineers and accountants who deal with the real world instead of feelings , they understand the limitations and cost of "free clean" green energy.

 

[houstonscott]

I like the fuel cell concept. The short range electric car for commuting set distances is also attractive. Different methods of charging are possible. Someone associated the electric car range as dependant on the length of the power cord. Using this as an example the range of a hydro carbon burning vehicle would be the length of the bowser hose! Nuclear has interesting facets. It's drawbacks are the type of designs chosen and politicians - accountants being in charge of the dollars. The Boffins should have control here as they do have the sceintific knowledge that is required. The sceintific world is always evolving producing new ideas and methods. The world we live in is all comprised of required energy for survival. Be it muscle power, wind, water, hydrocarbon, sunlight etc. It should be our goal to pick sources that will do the least damage to our ecosystems.

Hydrogen fuel cells got a lot of interest ten years ago, BMW built one. Greens envisioned solar PV panels creating hydrogen at fill up stations. They were all in... When a search was on for a liquid without the problems and expense of hydrogen they discovered one. Full of hydrogen, safe to refuel, cheap, and already available in the quantities necessary to go nation wide. It was diesel fuel. The greens pulled out support and the hydrogen car died.

 

[IslandTractor]

Hydrogen fuel cells got a lot of interest ten years ago, BMW built one. Greens envisioned solar PV panels creating hydrogen at fill up stations. They were all in... When a search was on for a liquid without the problems and expense of hydrogen they discovered one. Full of hydrogen, safe to refuel, cheap, and already available in the quantities necessary to go nation wide. It was diesel fuel. The greens pulled out support and the hydrogen car died.

Then fast forward ten years and it turns out that making diesel engines that don't pollute or require expensive and sensitive emissions control equipment is not so easy. It can be done but not cheaply. It also turns out that air pollution standards of ten years ago are not adequate to protect the urban/metro population from toxic effects of diesel emissions so the future will require even cleaner exhaust. It may be that hydrogen fuel cells never make a serious comeback but it is also clear that diesel has had its day in light vehicle propulsion. Look for the next ten years to be an exploration of various combinations of electric and hybrid power for passenger vehicles. Diesel will surely survive for heavy equipment and trucks but it looks increasing like the auto industry has simply given up on diesel as the motor of the future. It may have happened anyway because of the difficulties involved in getting clean exhaust from diesels but the VW fiasco put the nails in the coffin.