Finally an article that puts numbers to the argument of Min Wage

[Larry Jones]

To all the minimum wage earners: Guess what? When you get that government mandated raise, you are STILL MAKING MINIMUM WAGE.

 

[dave1949]

While those revenues sound great, what is their net income? Citing revenues instead of net always makes the business owner look like the greedy 1%er to the "stupid" voter.

<snip>

That's certainly not my intention. That information is not in the article. Since those are generally privately held companies their balance sheets aren't public. If you Googled around there is probably some anecdotal information on net income.

I could guess it varies considerably from a franchisee with three stores each with $2M in revenue, down to below the ~$60K average. ROI would be the more useful income comparison for high revenue, high capital investment cases I think. Those folks are putting money to work, not their cooking skills . No doubt different amounts of net income result from equal revenue based on several factors.

 

[dave1949]

Automation is another factor in wage levels. Automation has taken over a goodly number of what were decent jobs all across the skill level spectrum.

More jobs could be automated and I suspect they will be.

Forum moderation could be automated. Just scan for the no-no words and the density of key words with a rich emotional or political content-- ZAP! :laughing:

A robot lawyer could create a legal will by asking a few relevant questions.

Your coffee doesn't require a barista. We've had buttons and knobs for ages now.

I could see an automated Fry-o-later tied to the order input system complemented by daily 5 min. interval sales histories.

I think eventually, if not already, we will have a surplus of capable people with no useful way to employ them. Switzerland already held one national referendum on implementing a "universal wage" that is not tied to employment.

 

[aczlan]

That's certainly not my intention. That information is not in the article. Since those are generally privately held companies their balance sheets aren't public. If you Googled around there is probably some anecdotal information on net income.

I could guess it varies considerably from a franchisee with three stores each with $2M in revenue, down to below the ~$60K average. ROI would be the more useful income comparison for high revenue, high capital investment cases I think. Those folks are putting money to work, not their cooking skills . No doubt different amounts of net income result from equal revenue based on several factors.

For a McDonalds making 2M/year, if they have a 8% profit margin, the owner is making $160k per year on the store.
If http://www.bluemaumau.org/sites/default/files/Janney-McDonalds Income Statement mock.pdf is correct, gross sales of $2.7M would net the store owner $157k/year.

Aaron Z

 

[jerrybob]

Based on my experience with some customer service reps this past weekend, I'd say minimum wage is right where it should be!:thumbsup:

 

[dave1949]

Based on my experience with some customer service reps this past weekend, I'd say minimum wage is right where it should be!:thumbsup:

You have to flesh out the story more than that. How much were these people earning? Were they empowered by manglement to actually think for themselves, or just the usual?

 

[Steppenwolfe]

True story... just finished up 3 separate construction jobs in Pa. , had a minimum wage worker for site clean up through Labor Ready. Used same guy on all three projects because he was always on time, always had a smile on his face, and worked hard. Bought him lunch every day, paid his bus fare, and gave him a nice bonus in cash at the end of each project. Even bought him a much needed pair of new work boots, $140.00 . Talked to him about possibly coming to work for me because I was so impressed. Twice the money he was making. Guess what? Monday morning of our last week there he never showed up. No phone call, no call to his Labor Ready office, nothing. We figure I scared him away because of the increased pressure of having a " real " job, and responsibility. Moral of the story, most people are where they want to be...

 

[Cat_Driver]

Eddie, good morning. So your theory is that illegal practices by business owners should be curtailed by paying low wages?

We don't have the illegals problem here that border states do, so I don't want to judge something I know little about. Our friends in Canada only come to visit and swim in ice-free water. Our "aliens", although legal citizens, tend to be drug runners from NYC, Boston, and NJ.

I've lived in border stated for 30 years, and what is never ever reported is that illegals don't only take jobs from Americans they take BUSINESSES from Americans.

The Illegals typically start a business after being trained by an American employer. That business then competes for the same customers, sometimes the exact same customers. The Illegals do not pay any taxes, no insurance, no workmans comp, they refuse to get local city permits etc etc. They hire family, friends, other illegals so never a chance of getting turned into the state for no workers comp etc. If someone get hurt - oh well go to the Emergency room, for free.

This came to light recently while standing in line at a sub shop. I struck up a conversation with the two guys in line ahead of me who were wearing " marble counters by XYZ company " shirts. The wife wants marble counters so I was getting some info on what they do and at what cost. They said they used to work for XYZ company ( who is huge in my area ), but no longer work for them - they just wear the shirt. They started their own company and tehy told me they are 50% less that XYZ company for the same work.

A few years ago the neighbor had a pool put in, not one guy spoke English, and they were doing a " side job", BUT they were using the bosses trucks, tools, equipment etc. and doing the job for 1/2 price no license etc.

I'll pass on this funny antidote that I saw that day. I always see pump trucks pump concrete quite a distance in difficult areas, but not with these guys. They lined up 20-25 wheelbarrows and the concrete truck dumped a load and off the guy went, and the next, the next the next and soon they had a rhythm and a circle of wheel barrows. The circle went from the truck to the back yard and pool area, patio. I watched them unload three trucks in what seemed like minutes rather than hours. They were like bees building a hive.

After the dumping 20 of the "runners" left and 5 finishers remained. It was all done in cash, the neighbor saved 20K, the Illegals all got cash so no one paid a dime in taxes, and the real pool company lost a pool install to these illegals poaching his customers.

Local businesses don't ask if you are an American citizen when you apply for a license so you can see why these Illegals are not picking crops, they are poaching business who follow the rules, pay the fees and get screwed in the long run.

Illegals have NOTHING to lose. If they get deported they are back the next morning - this I've seen with my own eyes. A cook was deported on a raid once at a restaurant I worked at. He was on time for work the next day.

Last story about this. Remember that line I was standing in at the sub sandwich place. Well a Mexican lady was making the sandwiches for the two Mexican guys and she didn't weigh a thing as far as the meat and toppings. She LOADED those sandwiches up so high and thick they would not fit in the sub bags the shop made for the sandwiches. When it was my turn I said I'll have what those guys had. Mine was 1/3 the size of her brethren . Just sayin

 

[dave1949]

I've lived in border stated for 30 years, and what is never ever reported is that illegals don't only take jobs from Americans they take BUSINESSES from Americans.

The Illegals typically start a business after being trained by an American employer. That business then competes for the same customers, sometimes the exact same customers. The Illegals do not pay any taxes, no insurance, no workmans comp, they refuse to get local city permits etc etc. They hire family, friends, other illegals so never a chance of getting turned into the state for no workers comp etc. If someone get hurt - oh well go to the Emergency room, for free.

This came to light recently while standing in line at a sub shop. I struck up a conversation with the two guys in line ahead of me who were wearing " marble counters by XYZ company " shirts. The wife wants marble counters so I was getting some info on what they do and at what cost. They said they used to work for XYZ company ( who is huge in my area ), but no longer work for them - they just wear the shirt. They started their own company and tehy told me they are 50% less that XYZ company for the same work.

A few years ago the neighbor had a pool put in, not one guy spoke English, and they were doing a " side job", BUT they were using the bosses trucks, tools, equipment etc. and doing the job for 1/2 price no license etc.

I'll pass on this funny antidote that I saw that day. I always see pump trucks pump concrete quite a distance in difficult areas, but not with these guys. They lined up 20-25 wheelbarrows and the concrete truck dumped a load and off the guy went, and the next, the next the next and soon they had a rhythm and a circle of wheel barrows. The circle went from the truck to the back yard and pool area, patio. I watched them unload three trucks in what seemed like minutes rather than hours. They were like bees building a hive.

After the dumping 20 of the "runners" left and 5 finishers remained. It was all done in cash, the neighbor saved 20K, the Illegals all got cash so no one paid a dime in taxes, and the real pool company lost a pool install to these illegals poaching his customers.

Local businesses don't ask if you are an American citizen when you apply for a license so you can see why these Illegals are not picking crops, they are poaching business who follow the rules, pay the fees and get screwed in the long run.

Illegals have NOTHING to lose. If they get deported they are back the next morning - this I've seen with my own eyes. A cook was deported on a raid once at a restaurant I worked at. He was on time for work the next day.

Last story about this. Remember that line I was standing in at the sub sandwich place. Well a Mexican lady was making the sandwiches for the two Mexican guys and she didn't weigh a thing as far as the meat and toppings. She LOADED those sandwiches up so high and thick they would not fit in the sub bags the shop made for the sandwiches. When it was my turn I said I'll have what those guys had. Mine was 1/3 the size of her brethren . Just sayin

Interesting, thank you. Relating those experiences informs those of us from far away more than ranting about illegals. It doesn't sound like a situation that encourages any legitimate business to "play by the rules" even if they would like to.

I believe there are workers from south of the border, Honduras I think, that work in forestry crews in Northern Maine. Planting seedlings, clearing undesired tree species from commercial stands with forestry saws and such. If anyone built a house around here (it's been a rare event since 2008) I don't know who would show up but the number of non-white illegals is so limited here (to my knowledge) they would stick out.

There are young people that come from various countries for summer work in the tourist area motels and restaurants. One of my son's friends married a Belarus girl that he met that way. I think quite a few come from Jamaica too. Most of those places roll up the sidewalks for winter after Columbus Day and the temp workers go home or somewhere.

 

[Tomtint]

Big business has ALWAYS sought out the cheapest labor possible. Starting from the slaves to the exporting of jobs to China and other 3rd world countries. The corporate world is not stupid, the less they pay for labor, the more the CEO and CFOs get as the bottom line goes up. Raising Maw here will make the cheap overseas labor even more attractive to manufacturers. It's a great way to drive business that was trickling back to the U.S., off shore all over again.