Footer questions

rswyan · Aug 21, 2005

Cowboy,

Thanks.

( I guess that combination could qualify as laminated. When I hear laminated in relation to beams and posts I think of Micro or parallam which is a whole different animal than what your are describing. )
Yup - they call it "nail-laminated"

( On a personal note...I would prefer a single member situation for at least my primary (4 corners & intermediates as needed based on structure size) supports. )
Any particular reason ? Cleary touts the laminated posts as being stronger than a solid post. (The order of strength is a spliced nail-laminated post being the weakest and is what Morton supposedly uses, with a soild post post being next, and continous nail-laminated being the strongest)

( Having only limited experience with heaving conditions I would probably want a foundation around the perimeter of the slab. )
Yeah .... I'm still trying to research this to find out what is workable for me in this climate .... obviously I don't want to spend a bunch of money and then wind up with a floor that cracks and heaves badly. If anyone with experience in this area of the country wants to chime in I'm sure the original poster and I would be all ears.

( One cost cutting measure might be to build the entire footing and stemwall, then ( if the area is large enough to justify) pour a third of the floor now, a third next year and a third the following year. You're going to need to saw cut the slab any way, so a cold joint would accomplish the same thing and might make the cost a little more tolerable. Just leave a little wire and rebar exposed to let you tie in the new pour. In the mean time you could lay DOT gravel in the area that will get poured later. You shouldn't even have to take up the gravel. Just compact it over time. This should give you a nice base.
)
That would definitely reduce the initial, immediate outlay (if not the eventual cost) .... I'd probably be inclined to pour two (of the three) bays initially .... simply because of what I need to store and because one of the areas would be the repair shop.

Cowboyjg · Aug 21, 2005

( Cleary touts the laminated posts as being stronger than a solid post. )

Well...IMHO.....If it were a true laminate I might agree. Here are some things that come to mind. A triple 2x6 continuous nailed post buried 4' below grade and only back filled will:

1) allow moisture to wick to the nails that bond the studs below grade causing degridation of the nails thus compromising the integrety of the nails and thus the bonding.

2) The seams between the studs serve as a natural wicking mechanism which can affect the nails further up the post.

3) the natural expansion and contraction of the individual members will, over time, effect the adhesive properties of the nails used to secure the post as a single unit.

None of this may necessarily result in the short term demise of the structure but, If you're gonna do it and spend alot of money to do it then get the most out of it.

With regards to the issue of heaving, I believe the mere size of the slab you are considering dictates a footing and stemwall. Particularly if cracking and heaving are an issue. Slab on grade situations should be limited to small driveways, sidewalks and other similarly sized pours. I would suspect that even most driveways there are asphalt.

daveman · Aug 23, 2005

Well the verdict is in. All the permits considered. The building project is on hold until spring. The extra $1200 (They charge by the square foot!) was not figured into the project. So we put up a shed to put the mowers in and everything else stays outside one more year. Might even look into the back of an old box truck for now. As long as it's not on a perminate foundation I could get by with that I guess. Probably less expensive than a shed! I always hate it when politics interfere with what you do on your own property. I know they have there reasons. Safety and such. But with how much the outbuildings increase your property taxes. You would think they would keep the permit cost down to more reasonable!? /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

LarryRB · Aug 23, 2005

go buy a used conex box for about 1800.00 or so. They're safe, strongly built and lockable.. 40 ft long should go about 1800. Some call these conex boxes "sea containers"

daveman · Aug 23, 2005

Never heard of that. I'll have to check around and see if I can find something like that around here!
Thanks

rswyan · Aug 24, 2005

Cowboyjg,

Good points all.

Like the Perma-Column I saw mentioned in another thread - the idea of not having any wood in direct contact with the soil makes alot of sense.

( If you're gonna do it and spend alot of money to do it then get the most out of it. )
Yup.

On the footing and stemwall I will scope that out .... I've been flipping back and forth between polebuilding and a regular stick building with a foundation.... dunno exactly which way I will end up going.

Alot of driveways are asphalt but there is no shortage of concrete around here either.

rswyan · Aug 24, 2005

( The extra $1200 (They charge by the square foot!) was not figured into the project. )
Ouch !!!

The village here charges by the sq. ft. as well .... just not as much .... 10¢ per square foot .... which would have been around $300 for me.

Of course that doesn't include the $200 application fee for the variance hearing before the Board of Zoning Appeals. (Non-refundable if they deny it of course ... what a scam !)

And that doesn't include any county permits either. (One each required for building, HVAC, plumbing, & electrical /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif)

( I always hate it when politics interfere with what you do on your own property. )
Hallejuah brother !

( I know they have there reasons. Safety and such. )
Heavens yes !!! Whatever would we do without big bro to look after our welfare and personal safety ?

( But with how much the outbuildings increase your property taxes. You would think they would keep the permit cost down to more reasonable!? )
Yeah .... you would think ..... /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

daveman · Aug 26, 2005

Found a place to buy the connex boxes from. What a deal! $1,900 for a 20ft. $2000 for a 40ft. Delivery was between $200 and $250 more. One of those would get me by until I could get the cash up to reevaluate my project. Now to get the wife to buy into the idea. She doesn't like the look! She did have a good point though. If we pull the cash out for this. It will take that much longer to get the other buildings going. I hate it when she makes sense! /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif But that was part of why I married her. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif I am thinking on the other hand that if I can swing the permits and get the ground work and poles set before the weather starts to turn. I can always finish it up as the Ohio weather goes arctic! /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

daveman · Aug 26, 2005

I forgot to mention. The $1,200 was trying to do everything legit. Permit for the Zoning, Building, Plumbing, Electrical, and all their other happy little fee's /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif. Seems they had a fee for everything. Thankfully I was back from the road about 60ft. So I didn't have to battle the 40ft from the road rule! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif At least that worked. The 10ft from the property line will be close though with the angle the wife wants to put the garage at. There is a well on the property that is right where the back part of the garage would be so with shifting around that it will be close!

Cowboyjg · Aug 26, 2005

That's really a good option daveman. You know, you could actually make the box a little more astetically pleasing by wrapping it in some sort of siding, maybe some inexpensive metal roofing and a paint job. You could screw 1x or 2x purlins to the box to attach the siding and roofing. Here I have a guy who will actually take off the two doors and "build to fit" an opening for an over head type door as well as a standard personal door or what ever you want.