Ford 1000 injector pump timing

[reis]

I hope someone can help explain;

I am installing an injector pump into a Ford 1000. (please see attached manual page 17 and 18). I rotated the crankshaft till the marks matched and are lined up between the crank shaft to the idler pulley and the other marks are lined up between the idler and the camshaft gear (see attached picture).

Seems now we just need to align the injector pump gear to the idler ? But there are no more marks on the idler, both are being used; one for the crank and one for the camshaft.

Perhaps if I rotate to the 21 BTDC as it appears to suggest on page 18:25 this will free up a mark on the idler ?

And I am not clear exactly what we are doing looking for the spill-timing location as in 25:e

Perhaps someone has done this, figured it out, and can help explain

Thanks you in advance (no pun intended)

Rick

 

[TractorTech]

I can't zoom in on your idler gear picture, but there looks to be a mark at about 11:00. The spill timing is when the plunger in #1 is at the highest point in the pump chamber, so that would be the 21 deg

 

[reis]

Thank you TractorTech for responding to this post. Attached is a zoomed in pict of the idler gear. I do not see another mark. But I think that is ok because what you are saying now makes sense. And I think it lines up with the manual.

If I am understanding things correctly, the goal here is for the injection of fuel ( The spill timing is when the plunger in #1 is at the highest point in the pump chamber) into the front cylinder (#1cylinder) when it reaches 21 degrees BTDC and when it is in the compression stroke (intake and exhaust valves closed), not the exhaust stroke (intake closed exhaust open)

The picture I posted with the cam, idler and crank gear marks all aligned I believe is not 21 degrees before top dead center. It is simply the marks necessary for crank and cam gear alignment. Tomorrow I will rotate things to the 21 degrees as described above. I am hoping it moves the idler gear to a new position, such that when lined up with the pump gear mark, the injection pump #1 chamber will be at its highest point as you discussed.

Thank you again for your post

Rick

 

[thepumpguysc]

Before u get to carried away with this (a lot of work for nothing).
Spill timing IS NOT when the plunger reaches the highest point.
Without try to explain it.. look at the tappet in its bore.. your start of injection
(Spill Timing) is actually gonna be when your tappet is barely past flush on it’s up stroke.
U set your engine on 21* BTDC..and spill time the pump..
Cant u Google instructions to spill time an inline pump.??
The pumps control rack HAS TO BE HELD IN A CERTAIN POSITION FROM FREE..
If it’s left free, it’ll either be at starting fuel(21mm) or shut off fuel(0mm) and neither one will be correct..
It should be held 1/2 way in between..
Sorry to b the barer of bad news.. just when u thought u had a handle on it..

 

[reis]

Thepumpguysc,

Thank you for your response ~ you are no barer of bad news, just different news ~ It’s all a learning process.

I just hope you don’t mind explaining in a bit more detail

You mention (Spill Timing) is actually gonna be when your tappet is barely past flush on it’s up stroke.

I googled it as you suggested and watched a few videos and found this ~

”Injection timing, also called spill timing, is the moment when diesel fuel enters the cylinder during the combustion phase. When you adjust the timing, you can alter when the engine injects the fuel, therefore changing when combustion occurs”

So you say spill timing occurs when your tappet is barely past flush on it’s up stroke.

In the videos I watched, it appears they removed the spring and the “delivery valve” on #1 chamber of the pump. It looks like they then hooked fuel to the pump and simply rotated the pump shaft till the exact point fuel stopped coming out.


It seems one could do what you suggested by removing the delivery valve and placing a small rod in the chamber and noting when the tappet is barely past flush on it’s up stroke by watching the rod. Or would you suggest using fuel as in the videos….

Thank you again,

Rick

 

[thepumpguysc]

Rick, ur correct by using FUEL..
using the tappet as a guide, u can get it real close..
But u are correct, spill timing IS the proper way..
It’s been my experience (35yrs), if u can’t figure out what spill timing is.. watching the tappet is the way to go..
Although it’s not the correct way, if u(anyone) don’t have the correct timing procedure, I tell’m to access the side cover and rotate the pump until the tappet is even w it’s bore and stop..
That way they can rotate the drive, when the pump is done..until the tappet is where it was when they took it off..

 

[thepumpguysc]

The side cover is towards the engine side isn’t it.??
Which would make it very difficult to see AND to put the cover back on and tightened up..
One step I think ur getting confused.. u DONT take the DV out... u take the CENTER of the valve out, along w the spring... and screw the holder down and tighten..
Move your control rack to the center of its travel..& hold it there thru-out the spill timing procedure..
What u should do is, do a “dry run” on the work bench..
Lock the pump in a vise, careful not to clamp it on a sealing surface..
Leave the side cover off so u can watch the tappet moving up & down..
Remove the CENTER OF THE DV AND SPRING.. & tighten the holder..
Move the rack/ segments to the center of their travel and hold them there.
Now find some way to put fuel into the pump..
U HAVE TO find the correct rotation of the pump..
Look on the name plate and you’ll see a “R” or an “L” in the PES series of numbers..
Thats the rotation of the pump, LOOKING FROM THE FRONT OF THE PUMP. (standing in front of the pump)
Now squeeze the container u have fuel in & at the same time rotate the drive shaft..
The fuel will flow and then shut off.. u want to find the position of the drive shaft where the fuel just rises to the top of the holder.. just keep blowing the fuel off the top of the dv holder.. seeing u don’t have a drip tube..
That’s where u want it to be..
Now just for kicks, look at the tappet.. is it where I said it would be.?? (Dam Close)

 

[reis]

Thank you pump guy for your detailed explanation ~ very helpful !

And yes, this particular pump has the spring cover on the engine side. I see you know this pump

A “dry run” sounds like an excellent idea. I will try to make a drip tube just so the “dry run” isn’t so wet

This tractor came without an injector pump, but I found a used exact replacement - One bearing was shot so I replaced them both -

Question; for this particular pump, what lubricates these bearings and the rest of the moving parts within the pump body?

Thanks again,

Rick

 

[thepumpguysc]

U add engine oil to it..5oz if I recall correctly..
WHERE did u find a pump.??
I have 1 in the shop that needs 1 plunger and barrel.. that I can’t find..
It’s been here for months.!!

 

[TractorTech]

Before u get to carried away with this (a lot of work for nothing).
Spill timing IS NOT when the plunger reaches the highest point.
Without try to explain it.. look at the tappet in its bore.. your start of injection
(Spill Timing) is actually gonna be when your tappet is barely past flush on it’s up stroke.
U set your engine on 21* BTDC..and spill time the pump..
Cant u Google instructions to spill time an inline pump.??
The pumps control rack HAS TO BE HELD IN A CERTAIN POSITION FROM FREE..
If it’s left free, it’ll either be at starting fuel(21mm) or shut off fuel(0mm) and neither one will be correct..
It should be held 1/2 way in between..
Sorry to b the barer of bad news.. just when u thought u had a handle on it..

Thanks pump guy for the clarification of spill timing and correcting me. This needed your expertise!

 

[reis]

U add engine oil to it..5oz if I recall correctly..
WHERE did u find a pump.??
I have 1 in the shop that needs 1 plunger and barrel.. that I can’t find..
It’s been here for months.!!

"WHERE did you find a pump ? " I contacted tractor salvage yards.

But like I said the bearings were shot and it looks like it had some water sitting in it ie no lubrication. The bearing was powder. I don't see anything in the manual or specs on how it is lubricated ... so your 5 oz engine oil is probably right.

The one I got is missing part # 80 and the associated pieces (see attached drawing). Not sure exactly what it does or how important it is? Does the one you have in the shop have these parts .... If so, maybe you would be willing to sell what you have

Anyway, thanks again for your detailed help.

Rick

 

[thepumpguysc]

Rick.. #80 is very important.!!
That’s what sets the fuel and the torque settings..
I can take a measurement of the screw and u can use a solid bolt.. if u can find 1 that long.. with the correct threads..??

 

[reis]

I found a brass plug that fits and you are right the threads are a bit odd ~ it is an M16-1.0 thread. My plan was to drill and tap the center of the plug and insert a smaller stainless threaded rod with a slot in the top for a screwdriver to fit. It just seemed that there was more to #80 than that .... looking at the parts diagram....

 

[reis]

Of course the other option is to buy another injector pump and salvage the parts off it ..... but maybe just to get it running, I will just tap and thread the plug and put a long bolt in it .....

 

[reis]

And even another option; I just found a M16 -1.0 bolt with like 1.5” of thread ~ i may just weld a small length of rod onto it.

 

[reis]

You say, “That’s what sets the fuel and the torque settings..”

I can see the further this “bolt” screws down into the injection pump it makes it harder to torque the throttle lever … does it also set the idle speed ?

 

[thepumpguysc]

That adjustment is, an adjustment within an adjustment..

 

[thepumpguysc]

It looks like in your pic that the hi idle and low idle screws are missing.. they screw into the boss on the left..
Another question.. r u pushing on the control rack in your pic.??
Do u have the spring and shims.??

 

[jones6780]

Did you get the timing marks lined up? See note 24 on instructions

 

[thepumpguysc]

The extension of the screw like u measured yours is
2-1/2”.. hope that helps.