Ford 1710 will crank but not start

   / Ford 1710 will crank but not start #11  

vvanders

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Oct 15, 2016
Messages
653
Location
Sequim, WA
Tractor
Kubota L4760
Great video, that makes everything pretty clear. Smoke looks much like our 1500 starting, usually when I underglow I get lighter smoke so it seems like your getting compression and ignition.

How's the throttle linkage look? I wonder if the governor isn't givning it enough fuel or the like.
 
   / Ford 1710 will crank but not start
  • Thread Starter
#12  
OP
G

grateful4

New member
Joined
May 19, 2018
Messages
11
Location
Zone 8a, Arkansas
Tractor
Kubota L2250 and Ford 1710
Thank you vvanders!

Here is a photo I took of the replaced glow plugs and you can see the throttle linkage where it attaches to the kiki injector pump.



The linkage appears stock but I do not have the operators manual with starting procedure. Do you think the linkage may need adjustment?

Now the injection pump did not have the proper plug when I purchased it... the previous owner said it was spitting oil from that hole there and he only had a plastic screw in it. I adapted an M12 (British metric) with a plug and filled it with approx 4 oz 15W/40.

I've tried pumping the throttle while turning it over and nearly had it started a few times.. felt as if air was in the lines. Since then I have bled the lines at the fuel filter, the injection pump and at the injectors.

I appreciate all the help! WSM arrives friday!
 
   / Ford 1710 will crank but not start #13  

vvanders

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Joined
Oct 15, 2016
Messages
653
Location
Sequim, WA
Tractor
Kubota L4760
You'll get it figured out, may just take a bit of time.

One thing to try is starting at wide open throttle and if you get it running just ease it back as rpms rise, our 1500 seems to like starting at full throttle easier.

The other thing it could possibly be is bad timing. If the injectors are not firing near TDC it could be working against your starter.

Turning over speed looked okay to me, I don't know an easy way to check the timing on the 1710 however.
 
   / Ford 1710 will crank but not start #14  

Dave M7040

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Dec 10, 2012
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Location
Williamstown Ontario Canada
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Kubota M7040 Nuffield 465
I am not convinced your glow plugs are working even though new. Sometimes people make changes and don't understand that some GP's are wired in series and some in parallel.

Your GP indicator never seems to glow red hot.

Lets wait until your WSM arrives re GP wiring. I repeat don't go applying 12 volts to a glow plug!!!!

Looking at the side photo of your engine which shows the GP's, there is a heavy black wire connected to the GP's at the cylinder closest to the radiator.
Where does that wire go or come from.

I am not impressed with your starter but before condemning it, post some photos of the battery cables and the ground connection to the engine. A boost will deal with a bad battery but not poor cables and connections.

Dave M7040
 
   / Ford 1710 will crank but not start #15  

vvanders

Platinum Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2016
Messages
653
Location
Sequim, WA
Tractor
Kubota L4760
I am not convinced your glow plugs are working even though new. Sometimes people make changes and don't understand that some GP's are wired in series and some in parallel.

Your GP indicator never seems to glow red hot.

...

Just for reference I've never seen our GP indicator *ever* glow at all on our 1500.

Here's the wiring diagram from the 15xx/17xx/19xx service manual I have if that helps:

IMG_20180522_205515.jpg

IMG_20180522_205512.jpg

Let me see if I can dig up the timing section and will upload that as well if GP look okay.
 
   / Ford 1710 will crank but not start #16  

vvanders

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Joined
Oct 15, 2016
Messages
653
Location
Sequim, WA
Tractor
Kubota L4760
Here's the section on timing + diagrams. There's a part on the previous page about getting to the gears, if you need that as well let me know.

IMG_20180522_210402.jpg
IMG_20180522_210411.jpg
 
   / Ford 1710 will crank but not start #17  

thepumpguysc

Elite Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2010
Messages
2,605
Location
South Carolina
Tractor
Injection Pump Rebuilder
Hold a volt meter on the GP's & turn the key to activate.. You'll find out REAL QUICK if you got power..
TOW START the tractor.. the black smoke is telling me you have fuel.. not rollin fast enough.. or boost off another car..
 
   / Ford 1710 will crank but not start #18  

Dave M7040

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Dec 10, 2012
Messages
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Location
Williamstown Ontario Canada
Tractor
Kubota M7040 Nuffield 465
Am I seeing teflon tape on the new GP's?..

According to the posted wiring diagram you have parallel wired GP's which depend upon a good ground with the block to heat up.

The teflon may be blocking the necessary ground for the GP's

The GP indicator is wired in series with the GP's so no current going to ground through the GP's means not curreent to heat up the indicator.

Power in the switch flows from terminal 30, to 19 in the heat position and then to the GP's through 17.

Just having voltage at the GP's means nothing is there is no ground.

Dave M7040
 
   / Ford 1710 will crank but not start
  • Thread Starter
#19  
OP
G

grateful4

New member
Joined
May 19, 2018
Messages
11
Location
Zone 8a, Arkansas
Tractor
Kubota L2250 and Ford 1710
vvanders;

My manual came in this morning! Those diagrams appear identical. Thank you very much for taking the time to upload those diagrams!

I am comparing the diagram to the tractor wiring right now. If I can get the indicator to glow I will let you know. I can feel heat on it when I hover my hand over the indicator.

pumpguysc;

I will put the new multimeter on the glow plugs. When you pull start what gear and speed do you have it in when you drop the clutch?

DaveM7040;

I have headed your warnings thus far and I appreciate them! I will be checking for a good solid ground today. The current ground is attached to the loader mount which is attached to the chasis... I've cleaned it but it may be not be a proper ground? Similiar to grounding to the front axle?

Thank you all for your caring support!
 
   / Ford 1710 will crank but not start
  • Thread Starter
#20  
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grateful4

New member
Joined
May 19, 2018
Messages
11
Location
Zone 8a, Arkansas
Tractor
Kubota L2250 and Ford 1710
Also this tractor is a Sept, 1985.
 
 
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