Ford 1715 PTO Clutch Adjusment -- Help

[JC-jetro]

Does this make sense?

Thanks!!!

Yes.. they all make sense. Now one more question. With the tractor off, gear in neutral and PTO lever " NOT" engaged then the pto shaft should spin freely by your hand.

Can you turn the pto by hand with the same condition above with the exception of PTO lever "ENGAGED" and transmission in "Gear"? if pto shaft spins almost freely then you ratchet is bad. If it is hard to spin, then, can you get a pipe wrench and try " GENTLY" spin the pto shaft? How would it feel? would you feel gear/metal grinding? If so and you might have chewed up ORC or may be your sliding coupler that joins your pto layshaft and final PTO shaft has chewed up gears.

JC,

 

[audoguy]

OK. Those experiments sound like a good plan. I'll try Friday and post results for the curious...

Thanks again

Audo

 

[audoguy]

I got to the experiment today.

Tractor Off, PTO disengaged
Free, smooth, spinning in either direction by hand

Tractor Off, PTO engaged, transmission in 1st
Reasonably smooth (very minor ratcheting feel) easy movement clockwise
Could barely turn with 18" pipe wrench. There was some slipping, but not a lot of noise.

Seems like the ORC. Even if it is not, it appears I will have to tear it apart to determine what it is. I have the service manual, but any advice on tearing apart that portion of the tractor is appreciated.....

Audo

 

[JC-jetro]

I got to the experiment today.

Tractor Off, PTO disengaged
Free, smooth, spinning in either direction by hand

Tractor Off, PTO engaged, transmission in 1st
Reasonably smooth (very minor ratcheting feel) easy movement clockwise
Could barely turn with 18" pipe wrench. There was some slipping, but not a lot of noise.

Seems like the ORC. Even if it is not, it appears I will have to tear it apart to determine what it is. I have the service manual, but any advice on tearing apart that portion of the tractor is appreciated.....

Audo

Audo,
with conditions marked in red and, with the ratcheting mechanism, you should be able to turn in one direction easily and there is nothing wrong with that. You should not be able to easily o turn in opposite direction without pushing the tractor forward. If you able to slip easy going two opposite direction that your ORC is toast.

One other thing, You might be slipping right at the main clutch either due to clutch wear or bad adjustment. If the torque you require for your tiller is less than grabbing force between your flywheel, pressure plate and clutch disk combination and your tiller tine would bug down. clutch disk replacement will be lesser of two bad choices .. clutch plate change vs ORC change.

JC,

 

[audoguy]

Major Update on this Topic:

There is a service bulliten and a new and improved one-way clutch for this tractor!!! I found this out when I went to purchase mine. The (fairly old, highly knowledgable) service guy said "oh yeah we replaced these like hot cakes when these tractors were new. Run this tractor with a tiller and you're sure to need one of these."

The part was only $185, but getting to it was ****!!! I am now 100% confident this will fix my problem. So, if you have a 1715 with a PTO that stops under load, but the PTO engagement lever stays engaged, and the tractor still has plenty of power at the wheels, you need to consider if this is your issue....

Holding the PTO engagement lever in with excessive force will cause the problem to go away for a while as it puts additional force to the shaft, but once it is slipping you may want to plan some significant down-time in the future.....

I'll post an update once the tractor is running again to verify if this fixed the issue.

Regards

Audoguy

 

[audoguy]

BTW, the ****!!! in my last post was "h" "e" "double hockey sticks" or the place bad people go when they die. I don't use other four letter words

 

[JC-jetro]

Hey Audo

Thanks for the update. I'm pretty interested on how this is done. I have not myself heard anything about the pto internal ORC clutch issue on 1000 series tractor. I have used both brush hog and tiller while I owned the tractor and seems to be working just fine even under very heavy load. Just let me know if the differential need to be separated from transmission, or if it can be done from the end where pto output shaft is. If you can please take a few pics. Below you have a pic of the internal ORC clutch for the 1700. Does your new one resemble that? If you go to NH website they show all the components of the ORC but the pic below is the whole assembly.


JC,

 

[audoguy]

JC,

Yep, had to seperate the rear differential and remove each of the rear axels. I probably could have left the axels on had I had the guts to hit some of the shafts a little harder with a hammer+drift to drive off the pressed gears and bearings.

I'll post some pics soon, but mine is much different than that and looks much weaker. That one is hardened. Mine is not even hardened! I am jealous.

Pics to come soon.

Audo

 

[JC-jetro]

JC,

Yep, had to seperate the rear differential and remove each of the rear axels. I probably could have left the axels on had I had the guts to hit some of the shafts a little harder with a hammer+drift to drive off the pressed gears and bearings.

I'll post some pics soon, but mine is much different than that and looks much weaker. That one is hardened. Mine is not even hardened! I am jealous.

Pics to come soon.

Audo

Audo,

Did you investigate if one could use a sliding coupler directly in lieu of internal ORC. With option like that a guy would be able to buy an external ORC from TSC for around $50 and have exact same functionality, At least you don't have to take the darn differential separated if ORC failed.

JC,

 

[audoguy]

I did, but here is a picture (more to come). I would need a very long coupler (~14") or two couplers and a custom shaft. Both of those were more expensive than the ORC, and the parts guy at the New Holland dealer said he has never "replaced the replacement" part so I should feel fairly confident I will not have to tear the whole tractor apart again due to this specific issue. Only time will tell.

Thanks for the suggestion for the external ORC. I am considering an external "slip clutch" just to protect this internal part as it is supposedly the drastically varying torque loads that a tiller puts on the older, weaker, clutch. I don't want to test the new one quite as hard....

Audo