Oil & Fuel Ford 1920 fuel filter mysterious spring

[kirkawilson]

The fuel feed line to the filter comes from the bottom of the tank (labelled B) and into the matching 'B' on the filter inlet side. The 2 lines in the top of the tank are for 1) venting/overflow of the filter and 2) diesel return line from injectors.

 

[Danica]

The fuel feed line to the filter comes from the bottom of the tank (labelled B) and into the matching 'B' on the filter inlet side. The 2 lines in the top of the tank are for 1) venting/overflow of the filter and 2) diesel return line from injectors.

Oh jeez, dumb me! Thank you, I’m just siphoning all the old fuel out and going to put in 5gal that I just went and got minutes ago.

 

[JC-jetro]

I also down loaded your fuel tank and other component parts.

 

[Danica]

I also down loaded your fuel tank and other component parts.

Thank you so much! Well I siphoned out the old fuel and replaced with 5 gal brand new. Same problem! By now I have changed fuel filter and rings plus spring, tested with tank cap off, and am in a real quandary. It runs beautifully for 15 to20 min and then starts to act like it is fuel starved and the engine speed drops random increments over the course of 5 min at which point it dies. Next day, it starts right up but cycles thru same exacerbating die off described a week ago.

I’ve got probably 10 hours into this ridiculous issue. I guess I will have to maybe check some fuses (seems like a long shot) and perhaps a heat sensitive solenoid someone else cited as a possible culprit in another thread.

Thank you in advance for any ideas or thoughts you might have.

Danica

 

[JC-jetro]

I think your 1920 has engine shut off solenoid. Does the engine shuts off right away when you turn the ignition key to off position? that solenoid is normally closed by action of spring internally. 12 volts with the key in on position activates the solenoid for the fuel to be pumped from injector pump to injectors. You're solenoid coil might have a break or short that causes the solenoid to loose current and it automatically goes to normal position that is closed. you can check it by a voltmeter or test line just as soon as engine dies. you need to make sure you have voltage to the solenoid. The solenoid should be between filter out let and injector pump inlet. it id worth checking. Just a typical solenoid below for comparison.

Amazon.com

 

[Danica]

Wouldn’t you think it would instantly go back to it default (closed) position and cause an instant shutdown I.e, complete fuel cutoff? In my case the “die down” takes about 10 min of slow reduction in rpm. Further, it always happens when the engine temp gauge get to the norm (midpoint) level. Just did it 30 min ago and even tapped the solenoid ur talking about a couple times with wrench with no effect. I know that’s not the same as getting my voltmeter out and maybe that’s what I should do. The new solenoid on Amazon is more than $50 I think. Is there any other solenoid that would slowly shut down fuel delivery based on a thermostat?

Thanks for your suggestion. I REALLY don’t want this to escalate to sending it to a dealer…I’ve never done that. So far on 2 tractors there hasn’t been a problem I couldn’t fix myself. Plus it probably would cost min $300 with pickup and return!

 

[Danica]

Sorry, your link was to the same unit sitting in my out basket right now

 

[JC-jetro]

Yes, I was saying if voltage is cut off for host of different reasons then it shuts off the solenid valve due to spring action. The open in theh circuit can happen when the solenoid gets hot also. Again, my link was a suggestion so you would know what the solenoid looks like. Banging on it is not a test. Get an alligator clip , remove the connector and put 12 volt on it see it clicks or not. When it clicks the winding magnetizes and pulls the solenoid plunger back in causing the fuel path to open.

 

[Danica]

Yes, I was saying if voltage is cut off for host of different reasons then it shuts off the solenid valve due to spring action. The open in theh circuit can happen when the solenoid gets hot also. Again, my link was a suggestion so you would know what the solenoid looks like. Banging on it is not a test. Get an alligator clip , remove the connector and put 12 volt on it see it clicks or not. When it clicks the winding magnetizes and pulls the solenoid plunger back in causing the fuel path to open.

Ok I had schematics for solenoid and see how it works. I will do it properly with a voltmeter on Saturday. Btw, yes when I turn key off, yes-it turns right off and Vice versa.
Danica

 

[Danica]

I think your 1920 has engine shut off solenoid. Does the engine shuts off right away when you turn the ignition key to off position? that solenoid is normally closed by action of spring internally. 12 volts with the key in on position activates the solenoid for the fuel to be pumped from injector pump to injectors. You're solenoid coil might have a break or short that causes the solenoid to loose current and it automatically goes to normal position that is closed. you can check it by a voltmeter or test line just as soon as engine dies. you need to make sure you have voltage to the solenoid. The solenoid should be between filter out let and injector pump inlet. it id worth checking. Just a typical solenoid below for comparison.

Amazon.com

Just ordered the solenoid after monitoring voltage which became very erratic as engine started to die down erratically. Fingers crossed that was it.
Thank you again,
Danica

 

[kirkawilson]

Hmm...you do have a strange problem. Another thought is that the power to your fuel solenoid shutoff is fed from your ingition switch through a fuse block to the to the solenoid. You might wiggle your ignition switch when it starts acting up and see if the terminal points in the switch are bad. Also, you might pull the fusesto check and reseat them to make sure they are tight.
Another thing I have done is used a jump box to apply 12V to the fuel solenoid connections to keep the solenoid valve open. I just 'bungeed' my jump box to the front end loader frame to hold it in place and connected the jump cables to the solenoid terminals. If this fixes your problem, then you have an electrical issue somewhere in the power feed to your solenoid.

 

[Danica]

Hmm...you do have a strange problem. Another thought is that the power to your fuel solenoid shutoff is fed from your ingition switch through a fuse block to the to the solenoid. You might wiggle your ignition switch when it starts acting up and see if the terminal points in the switch are bad. Also, you might pull the fusesto check and reseat them to make sure they are tight.
Another thing I have done is used a jump box to apply 12V to the fuel solenoid connections to keep the solenoid valve open. I just 'bungeed' my jump box to the front end loader frame to hold it in place and connected the jump cables to the solenoid terminals. If this fixes your problem, then you have an electrical issue somewhere in the power feed to your solenoid.

Replaced solenoid and checked voltage to it as the die down process began. I totally think that it is possible that this fuel starvation issue could be linked to erratic voltage to the solenoid but why would it always start happening when the temp gauge reaches a certain point (right in the middle). When I put voltmeter on solenoid as engine slowly dies down (more like it is trying to maintain say 1,500 rpm but just loses it and I can watch the needle jump back and forth until it can’t maintain 1,300 then lower and lower…

Checked terminal points and reseated all fuses too, btw. This one really has me in a quandary. The saga goes on in a more recent thread that has generated 10pp of ideas. The best one now sounds like replacing the 22 year old fuel lines would be prudent…

 

[JC-jetro]

Replaced solenoid and checked voltage to it as the die down process began. I totally think that it is possible that this fuel starvation issue could be linked to erratic voltage to the solenoid but why would it always start happening when the temp gauge reaches a certain point (right in the middle). When I put voltmeter on solenoid as engine slowly dies down (more like it is trying to maintain say 1,500 rpm but just loses it and I can watch the needle jump back and forth until it can’t maintain 1,300 then lower and lower…

Checked terminal points and reseated all fuses too, btw. This one really has me in a quandary. The saga goes on in a more recent thread that has generated 10pp of ideas. The best one now sounds like replacing the 22 year old fuel lines would be prudent…

Now try to get wire directly from the battery to solenoid, remove the old connector to solenoid. This is basically bypassing the solenoid and manually keep it open. obviously you cannot kill the tractor by switch but can verify it is the circuit interruption rather than the solenoid.

 

[Danica]

Now try to get wire directly from the battery to solenoid, remove the old connector to solenoid. This is basically bypassing the solenoid and manually keep it open. obviously you cannot kill the tractor by switch but can verify it is the circuit interruption rather than the solenoid.

I will try this. Nothing else has worked and new fuel hoses don’t arrive for a few days.

 

[JC-jetro]

I will try this. Nothing else has worked and new fuel hoses don’t arrive for a few days.

Just have to keep at it, eventually you will crack the code. Fooling the solenoid to keep it open can be effective to eliminate intermittent electrical signal.

 

[Danica]

Just have to keep at it, eventually you will crack the code. Fooling the solenoid to keep it open can be effective to eliminate intermittent electrical signal.

Yeah new solenoid and four hoses later have same issue. Since it *seems* temp related I’m going to flush the radiator as that prob hasn’t been done in 10 years if ever.

 

[Danica]

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[stevem5215]

My Ford 1900 would run about 10minutes and then die. I'd leave it sit for 5 minutes and then crank and crank and crank and it'd start and run again for another 10 and die again. I found on mine that there was blockage (bees actually) in the fuel inlet blocking the fuel coming in. I found it by taking the line off the bottom of the tank and turning the fuel on and it basically dribbled out. After cleaning the tank of the junk in the bottom with a siphoning hose and then using a paint filter and dumping the fuel back in filtered that the tractor was fine afterwards and fuel POURED out of the bottom of the tank. Not a problem after that. Bugs in the tank literally!

 

[Danica]

My Ford 1900 would run about 10minutes and then die. I'd leave it sit for 5 minutes and then crank and crank and crank and it'd start and run again for another 10 and die again. I found on mine that there was blockage (bees actually) in the fuel inlet blocking the fuel coming in. I found it by taking the line off the bottom of the tank and turning the fuel on and it basically dribbled out. After cleaning the tank of the junk in the bottom with a siphoning hose and then using a paint filter and dumping the fuel back in filtered that the tractor was fine afterwards and fuel POURED out of the bottom of the tank. Not a problem after that. Bugs in the tank literally!

Yep, same thing just happened to a frien about two weeks ago but in this case he (foolishly) left the cap off a 5 gal fuel container for a couple weeks in the shed. Wasps made a pretty big nest then died. He then unknowingly poured this ‘bee soup’ in his tank. Got 20 min of running before no go.

In my case, while the engine slowly loses RPMs the fuel still comes gushing out of tank if I disconnect hose to filter bowl.

 

[Danica]

Just have to keep at it, eventually you will crack the code. Fooling the solenoid to keep it open can be effective to eliminate intermittent electrical signal.

Yes I have def checked fuel flow on both sides of filter housing while it did this and no problem. I am nearly positive this pre-1999 shibauru engine does not have a lift pump.

I have a diesel mechanic coming over for $40/hr Friday so will se what he has to say. I did replace the solenoid but totally understand that I could remove the elect connection going to the key switch and direct connected to the POSITIVE (??) terminal of battery. Sorry, electrical stuff quickly becomes overwhelming for me. Nonetheless, this will be first time I’d 20 years with two tractors that I needed to bring in a ‘consultant’

Someone else had suggested this and I’d swear they said pos batt term to solenoid would force it in the open position. I just never tried it but now it is more clear that an electrical (harness) issue could be leading to the fuel starvation symptoms.