Ford and Powerstroke Engines

Dallas_Lilly · Feb 28, 2007

Interesting Article. I am sure that it will all wash out in the end but what if it did not? What would Ford Do?

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rback33 · Feb 28, 2007

Very interesting reading there. If it's true, then GM and Dodge should be smiling. I wonder if it would have to do with the horrific rumors flying about the 6.0 warranties?

Kendall69 · Feb 28, 2007

From another site:

Ford may have a contract with them they are great at not sending all the money for a given shipment. This requires them to chase Ford down for the rest of the money. A super big hassle.

My guess is that Ford estimated an number of 6.4L sales and IH negotiated for that amount of engines. With the economy slowing and the cost of fuel rising/high I bet the sales are lower than Ford had hoped for. Their only recourse is to invent an issue. By Ford paying less than the agreed amount to IH they force IH's hand to stop production. This means that Ford gets what they really want, fewer 6.4L engines, without having to meet their projected monthly commitments. Ford now can sell less trucks which is where the market is at without having to eat the extra production that they estimated and contracted they would need.

Ford is good at shenanigans.

Sadly this hangs IH out to dry as they also have commitments and their suppliers will be the ones to carry the largest losses due to lower volume sales. It usually is the little guys that are hit the hardest. They need to eat the most in less profits.

Lynkage · Feb 28, 2007

That is kinda sad.

I am a Ford truck owner and always have been. I also like the Navistar motors. I hope that they do work it out.

rback33 · Feb 28, 2007

I did some research and the stoppage appears to be real. The Detroit Free Press reported an almost identical story. I have heard rumors lately over a disagreement over warranty on the 6.0 engine and wonder is this is how the beast is roaring it's ugly head. I heard (but don't BELIEVE) that a class action suit was going to cause Ford to buy back all the 6.0's. That has got to be bunk at best, but I do believe they have warranty issues there. I too was a Powerstroke owner, but am now glad to have a Cummins.

DieselPower · Feb 28, 2007

Here's a few more articles on it.

Navistar cuts off engines to Ford - Financial Times - MSNBC.com

Stroke It, FoMoCo! Navistar Stops Shipping Power Stroke Diesel Engines To Ford - Jalopnik

Ford cutting Super Duty output tomorrow

Chuck_Lind · Feb 28, 2007

The article doesn't surprise me at all. My neighbor wanted to buy a new Ford F-250 with the PowerStroke diesel last year, but his brother-in-law (who is a VP for Ford) advised him NOT to buy any pickup with a diesel engine.

It's too bad there isn't a magic method to combine all the good features of Dodge/Ford/Chevy diesel pickups into one really great machine!!

I owned a 2000 Ford F-350 diesel (7.3 litre) and it was great. Not the best fuel mileage, but it sure could tow. Wish I didn't trade it...in a way. With diesel fuel prices...who knows.

workinallthetime · Feb 28, 2007

power smoke is going up in smoke with the rest of ford, maybe toyota needs a IH engine since they want to be so big?

Donnyj · Mar 1, 2007

International has resumed shipping engines.............. Remember, there are 3 sides to a story, Fords, Internationals and the truth.

BB_TX · Mar 1, 2007

A power play by both companies. Neither side can afford to go at it very long. They will both be back in production before long. Although long term, a break is probably on the horizon.

Lynkage · Mar 1, 2007

Yes this is kind of odd.
Ford has bought IH engines for many many years not just for pickups.
There mid sized line has always had the option of IH clear back to the 70's

radman1 · Mar 1, 2007

Courts have ordered Navistar to temporarily resume shipping to Ford. They will probably battle it out in the courts.

BTI · Mar 1, 2007

All paraphrased in a nutshell:
Ford wants money for warranty because engines are no good. (Fords opinion)
Navistar says engines are good it's your engine management system that is crap. (Nav's opinion)

='s Stalemate
Nobody wins, especially the poor guy with a 6.0 that is having trouble.

BTI

Donnyj · Mar 1, 2007

It sure isn't Fords injectors, turbos, Egr coolers, headgaskets, oil leaks. That is all courtesy of IH.

rback33 · Mar 1, 2007

I am guessing this will be a long and ugly battle. In the end no one will win. Except as I said earlier...GM and Dodge....

cp1969 · Mar 3, 2007

from the article:

Navistar says trade editors who have driven Ford's 2008 F-250 equipped with the Power Stroke have given it rave reviews.

Are these the same people who gave the 6.0 rave reviews when it came out? I wouldn't give a plugged nickel for the opinions of these writers. They drive a truck for a weekend. Unless the thing craps out over that tiny period, you get no indication of the reliability and they probably would whitewash it anyway. After all, they want to be catered to by FMC again, and saying negative things about their product will bring that to an end.

I think this is a make-or-break situation for Ford. If this engine starts out with any of the problems the 6.0 had, it will be lights out. Ford is apparently unable to make money on cars and the pickup line has been their bread and butter for years.

Chuck_Lind · Mar 3, 2007

rback33 said:
I am guessing this will be a long and ugly battle. In the end no one will win. Except as I said earlier...GM and Dodge....

Well...I wouldn't say that "no one" would win.

And the winner is.......THE LAWYERS!!!!!

They're always the winners in situations like this.

BrianW · Mar 3, 2007

Gee this seems like the Firestone battle all over again. Ford keeps this up and no one will want to partner with them!

workinallthetime · Mar 4, 2007

gm looked at cat befor the d-max maybe ford should do the same, a ford with a cat and a allison trans that would sell just with the badging they would have to put on the side

ScottAR · Mar 5, 2007

Cat and Ford used to be pretty close. The 3208 was developed for the Ford L series medium duties. My uncle knows a man that bought a 79-80ish (not sure)
Ford pickup with a Cat 4 cyl in it. Claims it was some sort of factory test mule cast off. Still driving it so it musta been a pretty good engine.

I'd give a Cat a shot even though I'm completely satisfed with my 7.3 IH.
A coworker test drove a 6.4 recently, Said it was a hot rod.