Getting a whole house genny installed...

[Midniteoyl]

Without medical imperative, a whole house auto-magic generator is only a money pit.

consider becoming familiar with the tranquillity of a temporary power outage.

A couple of Aladdin lamps and a wood stove go a long way towards necessary creature comforts.
At least I have come to appreciate the difference over the years.

Those of us on wells sure like having it work..

 

[coobie]

You AC can account for up to 50% of your electrical use.

You run a generator with everything in the house on, a 500 gallon LP tank won't last long.

Every 8 hours of run time = an oil change as well.

The electrician who installed my unit stated to change the oil/filter after 40-60 hours of run time which I do with 5w-30 full synthetic oil.Otherwise I change oil/filter once per year.My other suggestion and I found this out the hard way the constant trickle charge slowly boils the water out of your battery causing it to have a short life span maybe 2 1/2 years.I now fill my battery with distilled water twice per year.My battery life now is 5 years plus.

 

[murphy1244]

I change oil and filter every 2 years or 100 hours. Use Mobil 1, 5 w 30

 

[coralhead]

I have a small 6.5kw generac hooked up to my house to run the important things that are needed with the power out. Refrigerator, freezers, selected outlets in the kitchen and family room, lights and mainly the sewage sump for the basement bathroom. We heat with a wood stove, cook with propane. The unit is hooked up to our 500gal LPG tank. The automatic gen does come in nice when there are outages even for a short time. I remember the first time the power went out in an ice storm we would make coffee for the neighbors and take it to them. An auto transfer/start generator is pretty nice.

 

[check]

I have a small 6.5kw generac hooked up to my house to run the important things that are needed with the power out. Refrigerator, freezers, selected outlets in the kitchen and family room, lights and mainly the sewage sump for the basement bathroom. We heat with a wood stove, cook with propane. The unit is hooked up to our 500gal LPG tank. The automatic gen does come in nice when there are outages even for a short time. I remember the first time the power went out in an ice storm we would make coffee for the neighbors and take it to them. An auto transfer/start generator is pretty nice.

Autostart is really nice when you are not there during a power outage, but man oh man, does it ever use up propane when the power is out for days on end!

 

[techman]

Just be aware a 22KW Generac (on propane) will use 2.2 gal/hr at half load, or about 25 gal/day. Your tank will last a number of days, depending on how full it is. Make sure that the installer uses a propane line big enough to feed it. You may need to upsize the regulator as well. At full load it will use 350,000 BTU/hr, and this should determine the regulator and pipe size.

Paul

 

[grsthegreat]

Just be aware a 22KW Generac (on propane) will use 2.2 gal/hr at half load, or about 25 gal/day. Your tank will last a number of days, depending on how full it is. Make sure that the installer uses a propane line big enough to feed it. You may need to upsize the regulator as well. At full load it will use 350,000 BTU/hr, and this should determine the regulator and pipe size.

Paul

83 cu ft propane per hour x 2500 =208,000 btu at half output and 328,000 at full. Most lp co supply 1/2" high pressure line to unit and use a separate low end regulator at generator. I agree they suck down the propane, thats why i never run mine 24/7. I do have clients that want 24/7 run time. But im to cheap.

for my natural gas custoners, i usually have to upsize their gas meters to supply gen unit.

 

[nikdfish]

When the propane guy came out for the site inspection, he indicated the line installed to the gen would push a 13 or 14 inch water column (generac calls for 12") & would have 15k BTU capacity beyond the generator max load requirement. The tank is owned equipment so we are paying for an upgrade to its' regulator as well as the one at the house.

Nick

 

[s219]

I went with a similar size (21kW) diesel mainly so we could run our geothermal system in a pinch. This after years of limping through power outages with no generator or just a small generator for essentials. If weather is mild we can go without the geothermal. If winter, we can heat with wood. It's the peak of hot/humid summer that I was worried about. If we lost power today for example, with heat index of 105F, I can't see tolerating the home very long without at least periodically kicking on the geothermal for cooling. So that became the benchmark by which I sized the generator. Well pump was the next most critical need but much lower power requirements.

One thing I did was install a soft-start kit on the geothermal unit so that it has a less severe startup load. It supposedly reduces the startup draw current by about 70%. This eliminates the need for load shedding. Everything else is much lower startup draw and the diesel doesn't even flinch when that stuff kicks on.

Hopefully you will have the same good luck as me -- after investing all that time and money installing the diesel generator, we have yet to have a major power outage. I set ours up for manual start with an interlock switch backfeeding into our main panel, so I need to manually go fire the generator up and flip the interlock before it energizes the house. None of our power outages have been long enough to even let me do that! I run it once a month for testing, and that's the only activity the generator has seen in 2.5 years.... It's almost like I bought insurance against power outages....

 

[buickanddeere]

Without medical imperative, a whole house auto-magic generator is only a money pit.

consider becoming familiar with the tranquillity of a temporary power outage.

A couple of Aladdin lamps and a wood stove go a long way towards necessary creature comforts.
At least I have come to appreciate the difference over the years.

Being able to keep food frozen , drainage sumps dry, water for livestock and flushing , heat trace cables to protect water lines and block heaters to start tractors are essential here. An Aldladen Lamp ain't gonna do that. Pretty nifty lamps they are however and make excellent light .

 

[Toyboy]

I had a 20kw Generac installed about 4 years ago now. Ours runs on NG so running out of fuel is not an issue. The statement of "when everything is up and running it sucks fuel" is just wrong. When it has been needed it's never taxed to max.
We have two fridges, a freezer, micro wave, AC, well pump and septic pump. There has never been a time when they all "gang up" on the gen-set and start at the same time.
Lights are a non issue today with the CFL's and LED's. Even with the incandescent lights, you turn them on and off as needed not turn them all on and leave them on...
When your out of power summer or winter, and no time line as to when it'll be restored, the sound of the unit humming away outside is very comforting to the wife. Cost is secondary to comfort then.
Happy wife = Happy life.

 

[smstonypoint]

I went with a similar size (21kW) diesel mainly so we could run our geothermal system in a pinch. .

How does the acquisition cost of a diesel-powered whole house unit compare to the cost of a propane unit of the same capacity?

Steve

 

[s219]

How does the acquisition cost of a diesel-powered whole house unit compare to the cost of a propane unit of the same capacity?

Steve

If both are liquid-cooled (the only way diesels come) then the cost is very similar. So if you look at one of the Generac liquid-cooled propane/NG units, it will be right in the ballpark of a diesel -- about $7500-8500 for a 21kW size unit.

It's only when you go to the air-cooled Generacs that the price drops quite a bit, down into the $3500-4500 range.

I believe the air-cooled Generacs have a much shorter service life, so you'd have to do the math on costs/lifetime/etc to figure out the best value.

 

[CCWKen]

Back before CPS did some distribution work and new power lines, we used to loose power every time it rained. If it started to sprinkle and it was dark outside, everyone scrambled for a flashlight knowing the power would be going out. If it was out for more than a half hour, we'd fire up the oil lamps and listen to a battery powered radio while sitting around and talking. Oh the good ole days.

I can't see shelling out nearly ten grand for short outages and I live in an all electric house with co-op water. Of course, we don't have to put up with snow or ice and it rarely freezes but the summers here extend well into the night. It's common to be 90+ with 80%+ humidity when the 10-O-Clock news comes on so A/C is more important. But I can remember only one occasion where the power was out for more than four hours. Some drunk killed himself up the road and took out a pole. If it does go out now, it just a flicker or it's back on in less than an hour. Investing $10k is just a missed opportunity for something more important. And I sure don't want payments. I can live without power for 3-5 hours a YEAR!

Perhaps that will change as I get older.

 

[nikdfish]

OK, now for some pics:
The first installers got here around 8A or so & started when the power co. came by & did the meter disconnect. One guy lined up things for attaching the switch box while the other started on the house main panel.

I had run extension cords earlier, and connected to the portable generator via a pass through at the sliding glass door in the kitchen (main concerns being refrigerators & freezer).

As the existing breaker box will effectively become a sub-panel, it had to be modified for a 4 wire feed (neutral & ground seperate) instead of the existing 3 wire feed. This meant that all existing neutral lines had to be moved to a new, isolated, bus bar.

With the old feeds cut off, a hole is cut in the house panel to bring in the new feed.

The switch box is mounted by the meter and a conduit connects the two.

The new feed originates at the switch, but comes in above the meter position.

At the generator pad location, a hole is cut into the crawl space just above the sill.

At the switch location, a hole is cut into the crawl space through the masonry foundation.

Wire is laid out then fed from generator pad to the switch through the crawl space & secured to floor joists.

The installation location opening is boxed.

continued on next post
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[nikdfish]

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continued:


Connections are made in the switch.

A cement pad was placed at the install location, then the generator.

The generator was secured to the pad

A load management module was fitted to the feed for the 5 ton heat pump.

Conduit was installed to fit between generator & pass through.

All done & waiting for the electrical inspector - propane will be the next phase.

 

[aircommuter]

I picked up this beauty for $8k with 800 hrs on it. It does everthing for me, shop and house, 2 transfer switches, one 3ph for the shop and another for the house. It is a 50 kw 12 lead reconnectable. So it only runs 1800 rpm, I also installed a remote panel in the basement so I can check on it without going to the shop. It was an easy install as I did it myself when I was building the house and shop.

 

[s219]

Great to see the install pics -- looks like very good work all the way around. It's amazing how much goes into it (for anyone contemplating generators when building a new house, some of the wiring/prepping can be done ahead of time to greatly simplify things later on).

Do you happen to know what size wire they used from the generator to the transfer switch? I assume the generator is basically providing 100A service?

 

[TripleR]

Back before CPS did some distribution work and new power lines, we used to loose power every time it rained. If it started to sprinkle and it was dark outside, everyone scrambled for a flashlight knowing the power would be going out. If it was out for more than a half hour, we'd fire up the oil lamps and listen to a battery powered radio while sitting around and talking. Oh the good ole days.

I can't see shelling out nearly ten grand for short outages and I live in an all electric house with co-op water. Of course, we don't have to put up with snow or ice and it rarely freezes but the summers here extend well into the night. It's common to be 90+ with 80%+ humidity when the 10-O-Clock news comes on so A/C is more important. But I can remember only one occasion where the power was out for more than four hours. Some drunk killed himself up the road and took out a pole. If it does go out now, it just a flicker or it's back on in less than an hour. Investing $10k is just a missed opportunity for something more important. And I sure don't want payments. I can live without power for 3-5 hours a YEAR!

Perhaps that will change as I get older.

Ah, I remember those days with fondness. The things I now have/do that I said I'd never need/do has gotten much shorter as I've aged.

 

[murphy1244]

Thanks for the pics. Your condenser for your heat pump could sure use a cleaning.