MChalkley
Elite Member
- Joined
- Mar 27, 2000
- Messages
- 3,198
- Location
- Eastern Virginia
- Tractor
- EarthForce EF-5 mini-TLB (2001)
Well, here's the latest in the saga of my decision to replace my Kubota. I never thought it would turn out to be such an involved process (though I'm sure some of you would say you expected it...), but, as usual, I'll report the long and the short of it to the gang here at TractorByNet.
First, the short of it: I've sold the Kubota and all of the implements that were for sale, but I'm not buying a Power Trac. That's about all I can say in a paragraph promising "the short of it" - everything else has to be labelled "the long of it", so now for "the rest of the story", as Paul Harvey would say:
A friend who has proven to be invaluable in his advice (whose acquaintance I met by way of TractorByNet) e-mailed me shortly after my original message concerning the Power Trac. He's an engineer by training and by trade, and I won't identify him, since he chose not to post his thoughts publicly, but the jist of what he said (relevant to my decision) was this (paraphrased in my words, not his): If you're thinking about an articulated vehicle, think carefully about the whole decision. Don't get hung up on the 3-point hitch, because that type of machine isn't designed for one. If you get a Power Trac, use it for a few months without even thinking about the 3-point hitch and see if you don't decide you don't even want one. He also brought out some thoughts on the differences in handling between articulated machines and non-articulated ones. The most pertinent one to my train of thought was the issue of close-quarters maneuverability. Specifically, I do a lot of work right up against buildings. In further test driving of the Power Trac, I found that it's just about impossible to get away from a wall (or fence, etc.) once you get too close, unless you use the loader and/or backhoe to physically pick yourself up and wriggle away.
After pondering all the implications of what my friend said in his original message, and in the correspondence that followed, for quite a long time, I decided to take his advice and carry it a step further: If it was likely that I wouldn't want a 3-point hitch on the Power Trac, this opened up all kinds of additional possibilities. I hate skid steers, so that's out. But, since since what's left is basically a Tractor/Loader/Backhoe of some form or another, further research was in order. As it turned out, the realization I ended up with amazed even me.
Some of you with better memories than mine may remember that I once posted a message asking if anyone knew anything about a machine called an EarthForce (back on 12/12/00, in fact). The message generated less response, by orders of magnitude, than any other message I've ever posted. (According to the stats, the thread has only been read 276 times to date.) At any rate, I have one making its way to me from Czechoslovakia as I write this. For the curious, it's the EarthForce EF-5: http://www.earthforce.com/ef5.html. Why did I make such a radical decision after being so excited about the Power Trac? Glad you asked...
I'm still no less impressed with the Power Trac than I was, just less convinced of its suitability to my needs. My needs, as I've said many times before, are probably atypical, so my decisions on equipment may be of value only in the sense of trivia to many of you. I won't bore you with a blow by blow description of the hours upon hours of research (and agonizing) I've done since my original decision to get the Power Trac 2465, or the trips to MD and SC to look at the EarthForce machines, but the summary of it all is basically this: If I totally abandon the idea of a 3-point hitch, all kinds of things are possible.
For one thing, there's tons of skid steer implements that mount on the front. The EarthForce machines use a standard "Bobcat-style" quick attach. (In fact, as of a few weeks ago, Ingersoll-Rand, the company that owns Bobcat, also owns Superstav, the company that builds the EarthForce. A number of Bobcat's implements are already being made in the Superstav plant in CZ, I hear.) Having a backhoe on the back all the time isn't such a bad idea, either. Plus, with the Bobcat-style mini-excavator quick attach that's an option for the EarthForce backhoe, and the available hydraulic outlets on the boom, I can attach an auger (and other things) to the backhoe. I use an auger a lot to plant trees and shrubs, so I can just back up to an area, spin around and dig a bunch of holes at once, instead of having to look over my shoulder for hours at a time and tediously position the tractor for each hole.
Another issue is the aforementioned maneuverability. The EarthForce features 4-wheel-steering in addition to full-time 4-wheel-drive, so it's quite a bit more maneuverable than my Kubota in a practical sense on a contruction site and doesn't tear up the ground at all doing it. An available option, crab steering, fixes the close quarters issue when I'm working against buildings. All four wheels turn the same direction, so you can move diagonally toward or away from the wall without the implements on the front or rear swinging into the wall.
The EarthForce line (except the largest, the EF-6) all feature hydrostatic transmissions, of course. The EF-5 also has a two-speed control which essentially uses an override solenoid to force the variable-displacement motor to maximum displacement, which produces maximum torque at minimum motor speed. (The EarthForce uses variable-displacement pumps and motors, while all CUT HST's I know of use varible-displacement pumps only.)
You can get the specs from the web link I posted, but I'll list the basics. It weighs 9300+ lbs; loader lift is 4850 lbs, breakout is 9370 lbs; backhoe bucket force is 7495 lbs, and dipper force is 4133 lbs. It's powered by a 56hp Kubota turbo engine, uses Carraro limited-slip axles, and Rexroth hydraulics. I ordered mine with 4-in-1 bucket, of course (which they call a 6-in-1 for some reason noone could explain to me), hydraulically actuated loader quick attach, backhoe quick attach, sideshift backhoe, auxilliary hydraulics, etc. One other feature I really like is that the 4-in-1 bucket uses a real construction-equipment-style separate spool with its linkage inter-connected with the standard loader lift and roll joystick. You can actually roll/dump, lift/lower, and open/close the bucket simultaneously!
The vast majority of the stuff I added to my Kubota, like lights, beepers, theft deterrence, etc., is already on the EarthForce, but they don't seem to realize how stupid it is to not have a tach, so that's on the enhancement list, as are some other things. It also needs Michelin XM27 tires - fortunately there's a size to fit. So, I'll still have plenty to do to customize it... /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif
Sorry this is such a short message, given the gravity and radical nature of the decision, but ask any questions you like... /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif Lots more details to come, of course. For one thing, I really haven't had time to talk about most of the design issues I really like about the EarthForce. For another, I'll have to report on all the implements changes...
MarkC
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Muhammad on 11/03/01 02:28 PM (server time).</FONT></P>
First, the short of it: I've sold the Kubota and all of the implements that were for sale, but I'm not buying a Power Trac. That's about all I can say in a paragraph promising "the short of it" - everything else has to be labelled "the long of it", so now for "the rest of the story", as Paul Harvey would say:
A friend who has proven to be invaluable in his advice (whose acquaintance I met by way of TractorByNet) e-mailed me shortly after my original message concerning the Power Trac. He's an engineer by training and by trade, and I won't identify him, since he chose not to post his thoughts publicly, but the jist of what he said (relevant to my decision) was this (paraphrased in my words, not his): If you're thinking about an articulated vehicle, think carefully about the whole decision. Don't get hung up on the 3-point hitch, because that type of machine isn't designed for one. If you get a Power Trac, use it for a few months without even thinking about the 3-point hitch and see if you don't decide you don't even want one. He also brought out some thoughts on the differences in handling between articulated machines and non-articulated ones. The most pertinent one to my train of thought was the issue of close-quarters maneuverability. Specifically, I do a lot of work right up against buildings. In further test driving of the Power Trac, I found that it's just about impossible to get away from a wall (or fence, etc.) once you get too close, unless you use the loader and/or backhoe to physically pick yourself up and wriggle away.
After pondering all the implications of what my friend said in his original message, and in the correspondence that followed, for quite a long time, I decided to take his advice and carry it a step further: If it was likely that I wouldn't want a 3-point hitch on the Power Trac, this opened up all kinds of additional possibilities. I hate skid steers, so that's out. But, since since what's left is basically a Tractor/Loader/Backhoe of some form or another, further research was in order. As it turned out, the realization I ended up with amazed even me.
Some of you with better memories than mine may remember that I once posted a message asking if anyone knew anything about a machine called an EarthForce (back on 12/12/00, in fact). The message generated less response, by orders of magnitude, than any other message I've ever posted. (According to the stats, the thread has only been read 276 times to date.) At any rate, I have one making its way to me from Czechoslovakia as I write this. For the curious, it's the EarthForce EF-5: http://www.earthforce.com/ef5.html. Why did I make such a radical decision after being so excited about the Power Trac? Glad you asked...
I'm still no less impressed with the Power Trac than I was, just less convinced of its suitability to my needs. My needs, as I've said many times before, are probably atypical, so my decisions on equipment may be of value only in the sense of trivia to many of you. I won't bore you with a blow by blow description of the hours upon hours of research (and agonizing) I've done since my original decision to get the Power Trac 2465, or the trips to MD and SC to look at the EarthForce machines, but the summary of it all is basically this: If I totally abandon the idea of a 3-point hitch, all kinds of things are possible.
For one thing, there's tons of skid steer implements that mount on the front. The EarthForce machines use a standard "Bobcat-style" quick attach. (In fact, as of a few weeks ago, Ingersoll-Rand, the company that owns Bobcat, also owns Superstav, the company that builds the EarthForce. A number of Bobcat's implements are already being made in the Superstav plant in CZ, I hear.) Having a backhoe on the back all the time isn't such a bad idea, either. Plus, with the Bobcat-style mini-excavator quick attach that's an option for the EarthForce backhoe, and the available hydraulic outlets on the boom, I can attach an auger (and other things) to the backhoe. I use an auger a lot to plant trees and shrubs, so I can just back up to an area, spin around and dig a bunch of holes at once, instead of having to look over my shoulder for hours at a time and tediously position the tractor for each hole.
Another issue is the aforementioned maneuverability. The EarthForce features 4-wheel-steering in addition to full-time 4-wheel-drive, so it's quite a bit more maneuverable than my Kubota in a practical sense on a contruction site and doesn't tear up the ground at all doing it. An available option, crab steering, fixes the close quarters issue when I'm working against buildings. All four wheels turn the same direction, so you can move diagonally toward or away from the wall without the implements on the front or rear swinging into the wall.
The EarthForce line (except the largest, the EF-6) all feature hydrostatic transmissions, of course. The EF-5 also has a two-speed control which essentially uses an override solenoid to force the variable-displacement motor to maximum displacement, which produces maximum torque at minimum motor speed. (The EarthForce uses variable-displacement pumps and motors, while all CUT HST's I know of use varible-displacement pumps only.)
You can get the specs from the web link I posted, but I'll list the basics. It weighs 9300+ lbs; loader lift is 4850 lbs, breakout is 9370 lbs; backhoe bucket force is 7495 lbs, and dipper force is 4133 lbs. It's powered by a 56hp Kubota turbo engine, uses Carraro limited-slip axles, and Rexroth hydraulics. I ordered mine with 4-in-1 bucket, of course (which they call a 6-in-1 for some reason noone could explain to me), hydraulically actuated loader quick attach, backhoe quick attach, sideshift backhoe, auxilliary hydraulics, etc. One other feature I really like is that the 4-in-1 bucket uses a real construction-equipment-style separate spool with its linkage inter-connected with the standard loader lift and roll joystick. You can actually roll/dump, lift/lower, and open/close the bucket simultaneously!
The vast majority of the stuff I added to my Kubota, like lights, beepers, theft deterrence, etc., is already on the EarthForce, but they don't seem to realize how stupid it is to not have a tach, so that's on the enhancement list, as are some other things. It also needs Michelin XM27 tires - fortunately there's a size to fit. So, I'll still have plenty to do to customize it... /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif
Sorry this is such a short message, given the gravity and radical nature of the decision, but ask any questions you like... /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif Lots more details to come, of course. For one thing, I really haven't had time to talk about most of the design issues I really like about the EarthForce. For another, I'll have to report on all the implements changes...
MarkC
