Grand L3X30 Questions ???

Neophyte · Aug 17, 2003

Thank you for the answers to #3, #4 and #5.

Anyone out there with a L3X30 series and MMM that can answer the other questions?

1. It says the mid-PTO is semi-independent. What does this mean?
2. Can you have the mid-PTO engaged without having to engage the rear-PTO? That is, can you have mid alone, rear alone or both together? This is one of my big pet peeves about the JD machines.
6. From your experience, how quickly can you attach/detach the MMM on the L3X33 series?

I appreciate any help. Thank you.

Henro · Aug 17, 2003

Neophyte,

I don't have an L series, but I can tell you that having the directional pedal and brakes on the same side makes brake steering VERY difficult.

There are times when the front wheels will be off the ground when scraping dirt off the surface in front of the tractor. I needed to turn when doing this and the only way I could do it was by using the cruise control and braking independently. It worked but was a half-baked way to do it.

USUALLY brake steering is not an issue for me. If it were...well, as much as I like my tractor...I might buy something else that had the directional pedal and brakes on opposite sides.

Kelvin · Aug 17, 2003

Differential Braking & Cruise Control

I'm pretty sure that the Kubota Grand L's cruise control is like that on the B2910, where the speed control lever can be used in lieu of the foot pedal to control forward movement (you can start, stop, change speed, etc using the cruise control lever). The only two differences between tractor operation using the HST foot levers and the cruise control lever (that I can think of) are (1) the cruise control lever maintains its position when the operator removes their control over the mechanism, and (2) the cruise control lever can't control movement in reverse.

I know that my B2910's cruise control lever will disengage when the brakes are applied (brake pedals locked together). I have never tested this with a single brake pedal.

Conclusion:

(1) If the cruise control DOES NOT release with the application of a single brake pedal, then you should be able to perform your tasks.

(2) If the cruise control DOES release with the application of a single brake pedal, you should be still able to easily control the tractor's forward movements using the cruise control lever (which is on the left hand side for Grand L series, and on the right hand side for B2910). Under this mode of operation you'll be left with your right hand (Grand L series) to either operate the FEL joystick or use the steering wheel. This may or may not be a problem, but since you're having to use differential braking then the steering wheel probably wouldn't offer much usefulness anyways.

Hope this input doesn't confuse things too much...
Kelvin

Kelvin · Aug 17, 2003

( 1. It says the mid-PTO is semi-independent. What does this mean? )

From the Grand L Sales brochure:

Live-independent PTO: "The new Live-independent PTO clutch is hydraulically actuated, which allows both the rear and mid-PTOs to be independently engaged/disengaged while the tractor is in motion. To complete the package, a Neutral/Auto Shut-off system and protective flip-up shields are included for a full upgrade in total PTO safety and productivity."

Hopefully that explanation will answer any questions as to whether the tractor's design will allow you to accomplish the task you have in mind.

As to the meaning of "semi-independent", my guess is that the term implies that the two PTOs are DEPENDENT in the sense that they rely upon the same power source (drive shaft?), but are INDEPENDENT in the sense that they can be engaged/disengaged totally indepent of each other.

Kelvin

Kelvin · Aug 17, 2003

( I have never heard about the tire limitation with the MMM. To the best of my knowledge, the other brands and models all can accept a MMM with R1s, R3s or R4s. I will have to ask them about this specifically since I want the R4 tires. )

FWIW, I was at a dealer back in June asking about the mid-mower on the Grand L's, and they informed me that the Grand L 3430 mid-mower was compatible with the AG tires ONLY, despite the photo shown in the sales brochure showing a Grand L with turf tires and MMM. This didn't make sense, since it would seem that turf tires would be a highly desired tire choice for MMM use.

The salesman called some head Kubota representative (supposedly the guy actually shown driving the tractor in the sales brochure) to ask about the accuracy of the information in his ordering books. He was informed that that very week Kubota had just approved turf tires for use with the mid-mower.

As of the information I received that day, it appears that R-4s are not compatible with the mid-mower on the Grand Ls.

I have R-4s on my B2910 with 72" MMM.

Kelvin

_RaT_ · Aug 18, 2003

My neighbor bought a Deere 790. I asked how he decided on the model, brand etc just out of curiosity. The color was his reply, I like green. Thats fine and I like the color as well I was not sure if this was some of the criteria you were using. Some folks are very partial to metal or plastic, thus the many threads on metal vs plastic. I really just don't care. Heck if it had the engine and transmission I really wanted it could be pink and plastic with a blue seat. . I hope you didn't think I was being short or overly sensitive, my goal was hopefully just to steer you in the right direction If you really want to use differential braking to it's fullest, the Kubota HST is really not your answer. If your using it to make turns at the end of a row, its a snap. Once set, you can press either pedal all day long and once you hit both, it disengages. I cannot imagine a cruise control operating any easier or smoother then mine. Unfortunately, I just never need it. The pedal design helps to smooth out the bumps tremendously by allowing your foot to "float" and react according to the bumps instantly while not being forced into a jarring position of being forced to do what the bumps try to make it do. Harder to explain then do for sure. With a little practice its a great way to control the tractor.

The loader is very quick. The quickest I've used yet.

The visibility you mention may seem like an issue at first, but believe me, in no time you will wonder how you ever thought that. Getting the bucket level is easy. The sight rod actually works very well for this. Mines marked in to spots for flat with and without the tooth bar.

The mid PTO again is opeated independent of the rear. If you were wanting to use a MMM and run a fertilizer spreader, you could and conversely, if you wanted to shut the mower off and spread fertilizer you could.

You need the turf tires for the MMM, the ags or R4's are to big. The MMM is very well built and the price is way up there as proof.

Lets see, anything else? Well, just ask if you do.

Rat

poco · Aug 18, 2003

the mid PTO has its own lever that has to be engaged first ,then to make it operate you engage the rear PTO lever, I have the standard turf tires ,dealer said they have installed r4's with mmm's but you lose some height in up postion. The MMM looks simple to remove but it does weight 500lbs tells you to turn one of the mower rear wheels to the mount on side to help it to slide out from under tractor, haven't done mine yet I didn't want to miss a day that it didn't rain with the mower off, kinda wet in western Pa this year. One thing about the mower it is super quiet and does a nice job off cutting also I liked the belt setup on it better than the JD.There are lights on dash to let you know mid and rear pto's are engaged

Neophyte · Aug 18, 2003

Thanks for the help guys.

According to Poco, the rear-PTO needs to be running in order to have the mid-PTO running, which means it has the same limitation as the JD 4210/4310/4410. I guess this is what they mean by semi-independent mid-PTO ... the rear-PTO needs to be running.

This limitation has always annoyed me when looking at the JD machines. The situations are probably rare but they can exist where this would be an issue.

* Front Mount Snowblower with Rear Sander - whenever you run the snowblower, you would be spreading sand.
* MMM with Rear Spreader or Rotary Cutter - whenever you run the MMM your spreader or cutter would be running.

I guess the quick way around this would be to disconnect the rear PTO shaft. However, it still seems unneccesary to have the rear-PTO running when you only require the mid-PTO.

If the smaller machines have this independence, why wouldn't they have it on their large machines as well? Perhaps I'm giving this too much significance? With that said, most of the JD owners and dealers I have talked to, have always disliked this "feature".

_RaT_ · Aug 18, 2003

A quick way around it would be to operate a sand spreader off a hydraulic motor. The hook up would be a snap and the control would be great. It would require a differnt valve to operate it more effectively. I see no issue running the rear PTO shaft while using the mid pto other then the control you loose. Too run another set of clutches and a means to disconnect and also run the interconnect wiring for safety would certainly add more baggage and most likely cost and be something that very few folks will ever utilize. I did not purchase the mid pto with mine and doubtful I will ever purchase it down the road. The MMM would probably work quite well, but I use my loader to much and the 72" width would be a bit small. For your situation, I could see where you might utilize the fully independent mid PTO. I thought folks at JD were saying you cannot isolate the mid pto from the rear, in otherwords, when the rear is turning, the mid is turning and vice versa. You might check into that.

Kelvin · Aug 18, 2003

( According to Poco, the rear-PTO needs to be running in order to have the mid-PTO running, which means it has the same limitation as the JD 4210/4310/4410. )

Keeping in mind that I don't have a Grand L Kubota, and Poco does, it seems to me that Poco's description of the PTO operation conflicts with the Grand L sales brochure's description of the PTO operation:

( The new Live-independent PTO clutch is hydraulically actuated, which allows both the rear and mid-PTOs to be independently engaged/disengaged while the tractor is in motion. )

It may be that Poco is right, or the sales brochure is right, or it may that I have totally missed the boat somewhere and there is no conflict between Poco's assesment and the brochure statement.

I can tell you that on my B2910 I can engage either mid or rear PTO, or both, at will. The difference is that my B2910 PTO clutches are not hydraulically operated thus I have to use the clutch to engage/disengage whichever PTO I am using.

Bottom Line: You should probably check the Grand L PTO situation out yourself (live, and in color...).