Grapple Failure

[puckgrinder85]

You cant blame the tube for failing when your bending 3/8 steel perpendicular like that. Seems it would take a lot of force. The tube failing looks like a secondary failure after the fact. A little is good more is better right?

 

[94BULLITT]

You cant blame the tube for failing when your bending 3/8 steel perpendicular like that. Seems it would take a lot of force. The tube failing looks like a secondary failure after the fact. A little is good more is better right?

I think the tube was the weak link and bent first allowing the cylinder mount to bend.

 

[puckgrinder85]

I guess I'm not seeing it. How would the 3/8 steel bend after the tube broke half of the weld holding it to the tube. Seems you'd have lost most of your strength and it would keep tearing. Either way the point is there, this thing doesn't have just one bad weld, its bent to ****.

 

[94BULLITT]

I guess I'm not seeing it. How would the 3/8 steel bend after the tube broke half of the weld holding it to the tube. Seems you'd have lost most of your strength and it would keep tearing. Either way the point is there, this thing doesn't have just one bad weld, its bent to ****.

I looked at the pictures again. The cylinder mount probably did bend first and then the tube bent. That cylinder mount looks poorly designed in comparison to the ones on my grapple.

 

[bhh]

Hi all, i really appreciate all the input. I'll begin by saying this grapple was purchased new and put in service on a kubota l3800 last winter. The tractor itself has 42 hours and is in immaculate condition. The FEL has split that time between palette forks, a bucket, and this grapple and 25 is generous. If picking up a few Logs (pine) that max out my loader plus grapple capacity is abuse, i am guilty buy otherwise, i can assure everyone things ARE as they seam. I'll admit the grapple looks like crap l think the picture of the tractor speaks to the "abuse" it has endured.

I know its a joke but i cant afford to just ship this thing off to someone else and have no choice but to attempt a repair. Its pretty clear at this point that I'm going to end up with an $1800 grapple at some point but I cant do it now and have to make this serviceable through the balance of my immediate needs which is why i so appreciate all the suggestions in how to attempt a repair. That is really my only option at this point.

 

[bhh]

The 1/8" tubing on the Wildkat Econo model was documented here on TBN a few years back. I have a heavier Wildkat and it is very robust. When ordering, I asked about the 1/8" tubing Econo model and they said people claim they don't need a heavy grapple and that they are just "going to move shrubs with it". I am not weighing in one way or the other, it is just what they said.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/244801-broke-my-grapple-am-i.html

Personally, I would have built it with 1/4" tubing even if people say they are going to move shrubs. Pushing ( as in the link above) or pulling with the grapple lid is hard on the grapple if you think of the geometry, I try not to do it.

Wow, i wish i had seen that thread 13 months ago. This $1k would have gone a long way towards a real piece of equipment.

 

[TomSeller]

Wow, i wish i had seen that thread 13 months ago. This $1k would have gone a long way towards a real piece of equipment.

I am fairly certain it is just that 1/8" tube. I would do the repairs suggested by others and you should be good to go.

 

[blueriver]

Cut off the cylinder mount .. Clean the tube with grinder .. Lay a piece of 2x3x1/4 angle on the tube from grapple pivot to grapple pivot weld it on .. Clean up the cylinder mount and weld it to the angle

 

[RDrancher]

Some of you may have read my 4n1 bucket thread and the problems I had. One of the guys over at LS noted the similarities between Wildkat's 4n1 buckets and grapples, and those advertised on High Rock Skid Steer's pages. Makes me wonder who manufactures the products for Wildkat...

 

[jmc]

I remember a previous thread about a manufacturer using 1/8 wall and my faded memory was that the representative said they mistakenly used the wrong tubing. It might have been the thread IslandTractor did the cost calculation on. If they admitted it then, and it was this manufacturer, they're just hoping you fix it yourself. I don't buy the part about just moving shrubs. Good design anticipates reasonable use and the manufacturer should stand behind it beyond warranty.

 

[jmc]

I remember a previous thread about a manufacturer using 1/8 wall and my faded memory was that the representative said they mistakenly used the wrong tubing. It might have been the thread IslandTractor did the cost calculation on. If they admitted it then, and it was this manufacturer, they're just hoping you fix it yourself. I don't buy the part about just moving shrubs. Good design anticipates reasonable use and the manufacturer should stand behind it beyond warranty.

Here's that thread I was trying to recall:

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/244801-broke-my-grapple-am-i-6.html

Especially post #57, 73, 74

 

[CalG]

Here's that thread I was trying to recall:

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/244801-broke-my-grapple-am-i-6.html

Especially post #57, 73, 74

Note post #14 in the referenced thread.

Seems like the design to fail theme is not unique to one manufacturer.

 

[bhh]

The more of these other posts i read, the angrier i get. This is a well documented problem with this particular manufacturer and grapple. A problem they admit to knowing about and claim to have fixed. My grapple was purchased after those claims and still exhibits these problems. Furthermore, this equipment, due to the weight and forces at work here, is inherently dangerous and not correcting known problems is not only negligent but represents a real safety hazard. This makes me angry.

 

[jmc]

The more of these other posts i read, the angrier i get. This is a well documented problem with this particular manufacturer and grapple. A problem they admit to knowing about and claim to have fixed. My grapple was purchased after those claims and still exhibits these problems. Furthermore, this equipment, due to the weight and forces at work here, is inherently dangerous and not correcting known problems is not only negligent but represents a real safety hazard. This makes me angry.

Give them more time to respond and follow up if they don't. Keep a log of your contact with them.

 

[puckgrinder85]

Hi all, i really appreciate all the input. I'll begin by saying this grapple was purchased new and put in service on a kubota l3800 last winter. The tractor itself has 42 hours and is in immaculate condition. The FEL has split that time between palette forks, a bucket, and this grapple and 25 is generous. If picking up a few Logs (pine) that max out my loader plus grapple capacity is abuse, i am guilty buy otherwise, i can assure everyone things ARE as they seam. I'll admit the grapple looks like crap l think the picture of the tractor speaks to the "abuse" it has endured.

I know its a joke but i cant afford to just ship this thing off to someone else and have no choice but to attempt a repair. Its pretty clear at this point that I'm going to end up with an $1800 grapple at some point but I cant do it now and have to make this serviceable through the balance of my immediate needs which is why i so appreciate all the suggestions in how to attempt a repair. That is really my only option at this point.

Its really not a joke, but you're still ahead of the game to be honest. In the price you could ship the thing back to the manf. you could drop it off at a welding shop, show them whats wrong and ask them to fix it the right way and you'll have a solid grapple. Remember its just steel and its not really that bad of a job to repair this. It's an hour fix.

 

[Red Horse]

Its really not a joke, but you're still ahead of the game to be honest. In the price you could ship the thing back to the manf. you could drop it off at a welding shop, show them whats wrong and ask them to fix it the right way and you'll have a solid grapple. Remember its just steel and its not really that bad of a job to repair this. It's an hour fix.

Well said. Further, as someone said, cold rolled is now $1.65. At Wildkats published price of $1000, and stated weight of 420 lbs., that says there is almost 700 bucks of raw material-forget about the chinese cylinder probably going for 50 bucks. So they cut all the plates, welded it together and paid for their fixed overhead for about $300 bucks? I still say, a good bargain. As I noted I foolishly abused mine and it broke- my fault. But show me anything else on the market for the same money. You won't find one IMO. My repair-about 70 cents worth of gas and 035 wire and some scraps. Most time consumed?- taking cylinder off, putting big clevis in cylinder attachment hole, and rigging up chainfall to pull it back into position. Will I spend another couple of hours on it for a permanent fix?- Yes-.."when I have the time". In the meantime it moved a lot of windfalls out of the woods this passed winter.

By the way, if I bought a 4 buck pair of wire knippers in Harbor Freight and the first time I used it on something other than copper wire and the cutting edge broke, would I complain? No -that's why I just spent 20 bucks for Channellocks that I'll have until one of my kids walks off with them.

 

[TomSeller]

The difference in Wildkat's cost from 1/8" to 1/4" square tube would be about $40 if I calculate correctly. While these repairs may be fairly easy, with as much sales as they will lose over this issue, not spending $40 is a bad business decision.

 

[Coyote machine]

Want to see what a real log/stone grapple looks like for around $1600?
Here's what I have. I've used it to do things none of the rake type or bucket 4-n-none grapples could do. Not knocking other styles, but it you want something truly heavy duty that is designed to actually do the work- this is it, and it's only 354#s to boot.
It doesn't try to be everything at once, and not succeed at being good at none of it's appointed tasks- rather it aims to do one thing well and succeeds masterfully at doing it's intended job: lifting logs/boulders, etc. without bending tines or breaking flimsy under-engineered metal fabrication by fly by night manufacturers who have plenty of excuses and no real talent for making a quality product.
http://www.treemansupply.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=GR-20

 

[CalG]

Wow! $4.50 a pound. Igland must be paying their engineers!

Now, I wonder what the market would be for these narrow grapples? I really like it! Those full width "Monsters" Are just too much for anything I need to do.

I bet "kit Kat" could do a nice one at that width. And STILL make a buck!

 

[sd455dan]

The difference in Wildkat's cost from 1/8" to 1/4" square tube would be about $40 if I calculate correctly. While these repairs may be fairly easy, with as much sales as they will lose over this issue, not spending $40 is a bad business decision.

VERY WELL SAID...