Grid-tied solar

[fordmantpw]

Always these breaking news stories about new ground breaking battery or solar cell tech. The promises all disappear when the government research grant or the private investor money runs out.
Last time I looked there have been no new elements added to the periodic table. So don't be expecting new rechargeable battery tech.

That's the mindset that prevents invention. Just imagine if the folks that pioneered the battery advancements of the last 10 years would have believed that. We'd all be packing around smart phones with 5 lb batteries that we had to charge every 27 minutes.

 

[buickanddeere]

That's the mindset that prevents invention. Just imagine if the folks that pioneered the battery advancements of the last 10 years would have believed that. We'd all be packing around smart phones with 5 lb batteries that we had to charge every 27 minutes.

Not so, lithium has been known for over a century to be a higher watt hour per pound and per unit volume than lead acid, carbon zinc or alkaline. It was't until the high volume demand for phones and laptops that brought the manufacturing costs down. I suggest you find out what you are talking about before mouthing classic feel good platitudes about innovation, inventions, trying harder etc. you can try as much as you want to pour four gallons of gasoline into a one gallon tank. No amount of trying and warm fuzzy feelings will make the last three gallons fit.

 

[dave1949]

How many electrons are in a discharged battery compared to a charged battery for any cathode/anode/electrolyte combination?

From what little I know, not much admittedly, the path to better batteries does not rely on new elements, but on how well existing elements can be used. No?

A battery that would greatly benefit home solar generation primarily needs to be less expensive per kw compared to current lead-acid or lithium-ion batteries, and able to discharge and charge at a reasonable rate for many cycles. That can be achieved with cheaper materials, or cheaper production methods. No new elements are required.

Even simply increasing the number of lifetime cycles capability translates to a cheaper battery because it has a longer life.

 

[buickanddeere]

Batteries have already been optimized via materials and construction for the max number of cycles before failure. Even lithium respond with longer life by not deep cycling the cells.
If your system requires 1000 kw hr of capacity and you expect more than 2-5 years of service life. A storage bank of 4000Kw hr of flooded cell lead acid or 3000 Kw hr of lithium cells. The cost adds up.
Batteries like anything else wear out.

 

[buickanddeere]

Batteries have already been optimized via materials and construction for the max number of cycles before failure. Even lithium respond with longer life by not deep cycling the cells.
If your system requires 1000 kw hr of capacity and you expect more than 2-5 years of service life. A storage bank of 4000Kw hr of flooded cell lead acid or 3000 Kw hr of lithium cells. The cost adds up.
Batteries like anything else wear out.

 

[tjcarguy]

There was a guy who invented a baterry that lasted forever and the oil companies offed him. ---Trevor

 

[fordmantpw]

There was a guy who invented a baterry that lasted forever and the oil companies offed him. ---Trevor

They've got that battery sitting in a vault right next to the 200 MPG carburetor.

 

[dave1949]

They've got that battery sitting in a vault right next to the 200 MPG carburetor.

:laughing:

 

[BobRip]

Guys batteries will get better, but they don't follow Moore's law. I know there are
Limits to Chemisry, but we surely do not know everything there is to know. I spent 10 years working with Sanyo. I spent some of that time talking to their battery division. They targeted about a 10% improvement every year. They were financially constrained so extra money would help. I don't think capacity will improve radically, but there are still opportunities to improve cycle life and recharge time. I think graphene will help with this. Also history is full of examples of discoveries that were major improvements that could not be pedicted. There is more money going into this every year. A lot of it will be wasted. Some of it will help.
Battery development is more complicated than you think and it takes effort, money and time.

'

 

[BobRip]

Guys batteries will get better, but they don't follow Moore's law. I know there are
Limits to Chemisry, but we surely do not know everything there is to know. I spent 10 years working with Sanyo. I spent some of that time talking to their battery division. They targeted about a 10% improvement every year. They were financially constrained so extra money would help. I don't think capacity will improve radically, but there are still opportunities to improve cycle life and recharge time. I think graphene will help with this. Also history is full of examples of discoveries that were major improvements that could not be pedicted. There is more money going into this every year. A lot of it will be wasted. Some of it will help.
Battery development is more complicated than you think and it takes effort, money and time.

'