Help choosing a welder

[patrick_g]

If you do not know how to weld and do not have the time, or have a job that does not allow you to take welding classes buy a mig. It is more money but about as simple as it gets in learning how to weld. If you want a stick machine that will be harder to weld with ( I cannot use one worth a flip) but a lot cheaper. You can get a 225amp ( i believe i am quoting the right size) lincoln welder dc version at lowes for around 229.00. For the ac version It is around 459.00 . If you get the Mig make sure to get at least 175 amps that will do most of the light duty fabrication work someone with a small farm is going to do.

Myself and several people have gotten the harbor freight self darkening helmet for 49.00 in my opinion it works well and buying a non self darkening helmet is right up there on the par with beating yourself with barb wire.
4 inch grinder is a must as well as a 2 1/2 inch cut off tool( I hope i got the cutoff tool size right) You also want to look at harbor freight or something along those lines for clamps. there are c clamps, clamping pliers with various size and shape heads. for other things I get the plastic wood clamps that you grab a pistol type grip and squeeze a trigger to ratchet it. If you get them at harbor freight they are cheap. They dont last long but any kind of clamp like that wont last long and the ones at HF are cheap. Try to find a good place to get metal. I noticed someone saying something about scrap metal. All of the scrap metal dealers in this area have started a policy about not letting you into the scrap yard because of insurance reasons. Metal is not cheap so if you go to an auction where they have a bunch of scrap make sure you know the value and wade in bidding. The advice about getting good body protection is pretty valuable I have some nice burns from not putting on protection. I also have learned to wear some kind of hat even though you have a helmet on sparks can fly over the top of it and the awful smell you notice might be your hair getting burned. I do have a lot of fun welding and learning how to do things. I am on my third cut and reweld job trying to make a universal mount attachment on some forks I bought. I had to cut off the old mounts and make the universal one for my tractor to use. I am really learning why you tac weld something and then check to see if it works.

Thomas, did you get the prices confused a bit. Typically the AC/DC Lincoln tombstone (which I have and was made in the USA) is more expensive than the AC model.

To the original poster: Welcome aboard.

Talented and highly experienced welders can do good work with just about any equipment. For the rest of us, a little care in tool selection is a good thing. Nothing will sour you faster on learning a new tool and process than sub par equipment that demands more of you than you have to give in skill and experience.

Paying extra for a name brand AC/DC or getting lucky on Craig's list are both fine ideas. I have both the AC/DC and a small wire feed MIG with which I only use flux coated wire (never hooked up a gas bottle to it although it is set up for one.)

All welders rated for the same amps are NOT EQUAL, and will not weld the same, or as easily. A good "stiff" source is easier to learn on. Another poster said to make sure it weighs 100 lbs. I don't know the minimum acceptable weight but can assure you that comparable quality transformer type rigs (buzz box, tombstone, cracker box or whatever you want to call them to sound like you are one of the "IN" dudes) will weigh about the same because it takes a certain amount of copper to wind a transformer to handle the power and it takes a certain amount of steel to make the transformer core able to transfer the power. If a unit is a transformer type welder and weighs significantly less it CAN'T perform as well as the name brand heavy transformer units.

Do not be afraid to buy a used Lincoln, Hobart, or Miller AC/DC buzz box. They are nearly indestructible. If you buy new and are concerned with the price of AC/DC, consider that the unit will last you essentially forever and can be passed down through the generations. Buying a new AC/DC buzz box will save considerable $ versus buying an equivalent MIG (able to do the same single pass thickness)

Do yourself a favor and in this instance do not buy an el cheapo from HF, an auto parts store, or other purveyor of cheap imported tools. I buy lots of stuff from HF but avoid their welding machines for a good reason.

Gemini is right on with his tool list and again is right regarding the MIG (a good well made MIG, not a cheapo) as MIG is easier to learn, just $$$ for a good one. I stressed stick because you stressed budget.

Good luck, happy hunting for a welder, and again, welcome aboard.

Pat

 

[gemini5362]

Pat thank you for keeping me honest I actually meant to say AC/dc for the higher priced one. The lower priced should have read dc. Since you were nice enough to point out that I was wrong I went to another thread and dug up the exact figures I had found before. These are the correct prices at lowes as of the last couple of weeks. I am going to use a disclaimer here in that I have no control over the price of copper or fuel or thousands of other things that control the price of lowes products. The reader is urged to go to the Lowes web site and look in the catalog for the recent up to date prices for the unit in their area. In Fort Smith, Arkansas within the last couple of weeks Lowes has published this price in their catalogue.


You can buy a lincoln 225 amp ac welder at lowes for 269.00 a lincoln 225 amp ac/dc machine for 514.19 these prices are right off of the lowes online catalogue for my area.


This is a quote from another thread. The author of this quote is myself and I wish to acknowlege myself for the post. The prices are from Lowes online catalogue for the Fort Smith area and I wish to acknowledge that they were taken from the Lowes web site.



being serious for a moment. Thank you Pat for keeping my posts honest

 

[xlr82v2]

go with one of the big three in this order
miller
hobart
lincoln

good luck with your welding projects!

Let me re-arrange this a bit... I'll tell you why in a second...

Hobart
Lincoln
Miller

Here's why:

The as far as Stick machines, Hobart and the Lincoln are the exact same identical unit, except Hobart is white, and Miller is Blue. Blue is substantially more expensive, for the identical machine, only difference being blue paint. If you HAVE to have blue, then by all means...

If you're just going AC, then either the Hobart or the Lincoln will serve you well, and I'd buy the one that I could get for the lowest price. If you go AC/DC though, then that recommendation strongly goes to the Hobart first, since it will output 160 amps DC max, where the Lincoln will only output 125 amps DC max. A noticeable difference.

Also, I'd recommend going with a stick machine.

First, because that $250 stick machine will weld the same material that would require a $1500+ MIG machine to weld.

Second, although MIG might be "easier", stick is by no means impossible, and if you can weld Stick, then you'll be a MIG master in about 5 minutes. It does NOT work like that the other way around.

Third, MIG requires that the metal you're welding be CLEAN CLEAN CLEAN. It does not like dirty metal at all. Stick, on the other hand, can burn through dirt and rust on your metal and still give you a good sound weld.

 

[patrick_g]

Pat thank you for keeping me honest I actually meant to say AC/dc for the higher priced one. The lower priced should have read dc. Since you were nice enough to point out that I was wrong I went to another thread and dug up the exact figures I had found before. These are the correct prices at lowes as of the last couple of weeks. I am going to use a disclaimer here in that I have no control over the price of copper or fuel or thousands of other things that control the price of lowes products. The reader is urged to go to the Lowes web site and look in the catalog for the recent up to date prices for the unit in their area. In Fort Smith, Arkansas within the last couple of weeks Lowes has published this price in their catalogue.


You can buy a lincoln 225 amp ac welder at lowes for 269.00 a lincoln 225 amp ac/dc machine for 514.19 these prices are right off of the lowes online catalogue for my area.


This is a quote from another thread. The author of this quote is myself and I wish to acknowlege myself for the post. The prices are from Lowes online catalogue for the Fort Smith area and I wish to acknowledge that they were taken from the Lowes web site.



being serious for a moment. Thank you Pat for keeping my posts honest

Thomas, I wasn't questioning the dollar figures so much as the sense of the implied inequality symbols. I just sort of got hung on an AC being the more expensive. I get it.

Don't hesitate to return the favor, I have been known to think one thing and type another. Most recently I think I may have confused something in the will it fly debacle.

Here comes winter, AGAIN, around here, hope you dodge the bullet.

Pat

 

[polo1665]

Hey, thanks for all the great advice. I would have never thought I'd get so many responses. TBN is sure a great help!!!
I've decided to "stick" with the stick welder, but to go with an AC/DC version rather than strictly AC. The welder I had in mind is the Hobart 235VAC/160VDC welder. TSC offers this welder for $440 on their website. (any idea why they cost so much more from a welding supply store?) I'll need to buy a self darkening hood and a chop saw. I pretty much have the rest of the tools I need. I will need to visit the welding supply store to get myself oxygen and acetelyne tanks.
Once again, thanks for all the great input. Stay tuned for more questions. I'm sure to come up with a ton of them

Mark

 

[patrick_g]

The welder I had in mind is the Hobart 235VAC/160VDC welder. TSC offers this welder for $440 on their website. (any idea why they cost so much more from a welding supply store?)
Mark

I assume you meant 160 AMPS...

The answer to the cost question is, "Because they can."

Pat

 

[polo1665]

Sorry, combination of inexperience and trying to type too quickly.

 

[gemini5362]

Hey, thanks for all the great advice. I would have never thought I'd get so many responses. TBN is sure a great help!!!
I've decided to "stick" with the stick welder, but to go with an AC/DC version rather than strictly AC. The welder I had in mind is the Hobart 235VAC/160VDC welder. TSC offers this welder for $440 on their website. (any idea why they cost so much more from a welding supply store?) I'll need to buy a self darkening hood and a chop saw. I pretty much have the rest of the tools I need. I will need to visit the welding supply store to get myself oxygen and acetelyne tanks.
Once again, thanks for all the great input. Stay tuned for more questions. I'm sure to come up with a ton of them

Mark

You really might want to check out the auto darkening helmet that we have talked about from harbor freight. It works good and I have not seen one any where else for a cheaper price. I have talked to people who have bought cheap chop saws and they used them for a while then bought better ones. That way is good to go if you decide you want to save money. If you decide to buy a better grade of chop saw check out the ridgid tool company chop saw. They are sold at home depot and have a lifetime warranty on the saw.
All of my electrical tools as I have to replace them are becoming ridgid. I am also going to ridgid nailers and other pneumatic tools.

 

[knute_m]

Third, MIG requires that the metal you're welding be CLEAN CLEAN CLEAN. It does not like dirty metal at all. Stick, on the other hand, can burn through dirt and rust on your metal and still give you a good sound weld.

Technically, this is correct. But, I think that a lot of us use flux core wire in our MIG welders. I've found it to be every bit as forgiving of dirt, paint, rust, etc., as stick welding.

For me, I've gone exclusively to a 120 VAC model Lincoln MIG/Flux-core (Model 140). I got rid of my old Lincoln "tombstone" quite a while ago, and have never missed it.

 

[bota7800]

I think a mitre saw would have way too much trouble with the sparks emitted with the cut. You can get a metal cutoff saw for around a 100 dollars. You can get a a really good one for around 175.00 and you will have the tool that is made for the job. I just bought a Harbor freight bandsaw for 179.00 while it was on sale. Everyone I work with has the same model and they have lasted for years. My mitre saw was a lot of money I would hate to see someone ruin one when a lot cheaper method is available.

No disrespect at all.

I don't disagree. That is why I (1) put occasional in all caps and (2) ended by saying chop saws are cheap. I used to use my miter saw often to cut AL door thresholds-no problem. It is not optimal for steel but sometimes you use what you have. The production use was a mistake I was trying to illustrate. I should have gotten a chop saw for that job.

Now that I am doing metal more frequently I am going to invest in a chop saw.

Oh- and good to know about that HF bandsaw. I have had lousy luck with HF tools but I might try that one.