Help choosing old small tractor

[SteveM]

I like cheap tractors, but you are asking a lot for 2 grand. I would go with the Satoh, and I bet I am the only person on this forum that has owned a Satoh and a 9n.... /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Reasons
1) The satoh has 2 ranges, allowing for slow speeds/tiller use. Without a step down, a Ford N is a fast machine. 1st gear on a 9n is 3rd out of 6 on the Satoh.
2) You mention brakes. I laugh, because most Ford Ns that are beat up have horrible brakes, because they have weak brakes to start with, and it is a timely job to fix them. My N had decent brakes, which meant I have to stand up on the pedals to stop on a hill /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif
3) Loader on a 9N is like a loader on a horse. OK not quite that bad, but almost. hard to steer, tricky to rig decent hydraulics, high ground speed will have you ramming into piles of dirt. If you get an N, use a rear scoop. been there done that, works OK.
4) Parts are available for the Satoh, check the mitsu forum - you will have to order them, and they will cost more than ford parts. But you have a much newer, higher technology tractor to benefit from.

Downsides to the Satoh
1) local parts availabilty
2) resale, since most people dont know what a Satoh is
3) Less hp/torque - the Satoh engine is rated for similar hp, but has half the displacement - you will feel the lack of torque when plowing or brush hogging
4) weight - the Satoh is a touch smaller, lighter than a N.
5) ugly. I think the Ns are beatiful, Satohs awkward looking at best /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

My two cents - BTW, sold the Ford - still have a satoh (different model) but looking to possibly buy another 650G....

 

[KJO]

Concerning the cheap tractor....you get what you pay for (like most other things). I am the same way...always trying to get alot for a little. If you can repair equipment, you have one up on most people.
As far as getting a loader tractor...finding one that will actually be practical..takes some bucks. I live in ND and loader tractors here fetch a premium price and if has got good paint on it, the price can double.
Maybe you could ask yourself..."how long am I going to be living at this place"? Personally, I see the purchase of a tractor as an investment rather than an expense. If you get the right one the first time, you won't need to buy one 10 years from now. Where I live, loader tractors (and even some others) appreciate in value as long as they are maintained properly. So your expenditure, if it is well thought out, may cost you nothing in the long run. When you are done with the tractor, you may be able to sell it and get all your money back.
I like the ones I can get parts for...years from now.

 

[Soundguy]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( 2) You mention brakes. I laugh, because most Ford Ns that are beat up have horrible brakes, because they have weak brakes to start with, and it is a timely job to fix them. My N had decent brakes, which meant I have to stand up on the pedals to stop on a hill
)</font>

N's have sufficient brakes... you just have to maintain them like anything else. I have a2n, 8n, naa, 660, etc.. I can lock tires by hitting a brake pedal.. while setting down.

I would suspect you have leaky axle seals and greased up brakes.. or your linings are shot.. or they are out of adjustment. of the linings are gon or they are out of adjustment you loose lots of brake power, as the N's and later use self energizing brakes... if the shoes can barely hit the drum.. that's no good.

Later 8n and naa and up fixed the leaky seal problem by installing 2 sets of seals inthe axle... 9n/2n can have sureseals installed.. etc.

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( 3) Loader on a 9N is like a loader on a horse. OK not quite that bad, but almost. hard to steer, tricky to rig decent hydraulics, high ground speed will have you ramming into piles of dirt. If you get an N, use a rear scoop. been there done that, works OK.
)</font>

No arguments that a loader on a non ps 2wd light tractor with a non hd kingpin is a tricky ordeal. You can mitigate part of the issue by having good rear ballast. I made a 3pt weight for about 15$ that weighs 600-700#, and makes my 660 w/ 1-arm laoder almost feel like power steering, where before it was a real bear..

As for hyds.. no more of an issue that hooking up any other loader to a tractor with no power beyond block.

couple choices.. chain lift arms down, tap test port and use hytrol for power up, gravity down, and trip dump.. or use same setup and a seperate loader spool control to get some da action.. 3rd.. get a stinger pump and full spool setup, or lastly.. get an aux engine pump.. a fellow named zane sherman makes thes and calls them 'live thangs' it's pretty much just a power steering pump mounted with a special bracket near the genny.. make sthe oem 3pt lift live, and add capabiltiy for a loader or remotes that are also live.

Soundguy

 

[KiotiJohn]

Unless you're willing to spend money to get all you need for some power steering, I'd say you're not going to be happy with any of the 2 wheel drive models and loading. Not only is it hard on the front ends of those you mentioned, it's hard to maneuver, and in soft soil, you're going to push those front tires in, unless, as Soundguy stated, you get just the right ballast on the rear to lighten, but not pick up the front end.
Satoh made some good tractors, but as has been stated, parts can be expensive, and many times hard to come by. A southern distributor recommended that I might want to consider a Yanmar over the Satoh beause more parts were available for Yanmar, but they too are expensive compared to the abundant N parts.
I had an old N years ago, and worked on it about as much as it worked for me. Several of my friends have had Ns of various models, and have said the same thing.
If you have the time and ability, they can be a reliable alternative.
Whatever you do, it's going to be difficult at the price you need to pay.
John

 

[lcorrell]

After thinking about it for a month, and looking and pricing other tractors, I purchased the Satoh S650G. It became obvious that I wasn't going to find a better deal. Since it was a dealer, I had to pay sales tax - so total purchase price for the tractor with FEL and nothing else was $2385. It came with a broken throttle and choke cable, so I fixed those first thing. I then used it for about an hour leveling out the driveway. I'm pretty happy with it - but it really needs something on the back end to counter weight the loader! If I try to push the FEL into even loose gravel it just spins the tires before it scoops up much. Too bad I'm out of money now! Since this is my first tractor, I'm going to post over in the owning/operating forum to learn the do's and don'ts of working a tractor. Thanks for the input on the purchase!

 

[KiotiJohn]

Icorrel, since you're out of money, you might want to just load those rear tires with fluid to get the extra traction you need.

You can find the proper fill valve locally probably. It needs to be the proper kind that bleeds air as you install the fluid.

I've included a website for a supplier, and also instructions on how to do it.

If you live in a very cold area, I would recommend using RV antifreeze or windshield washer fluid as they don't freeze and don't corrode as much as calcium chloride, one of the original-type fills.

If you can't spend the money on those right now, put plain water in for the summer, and get the other when you can.

Make sure you put the valve stem at 12:00 so that the tire only fills to 75%.

John

 

[lcorrell]

Thanks for the tip on the filled tires. They are supposed to be already filled though. I think with the corresive stuff because the rims are very rusty and nasty looking! Must have had some leaks in the past.

 

[KiotiJohn]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Thanks for the tip on the filled tires. They are supposed to be already filled though. I think with the corresive stuff because the rims are very rusty and nasty looking! Must have had some leaks in the past.)</font>
I guess the tractor didn't come with any other rear implements? You can make something to put on the back, but unless you're a welder you'll have to pay someone to make a 3pt frame, then you can make something out of concrete or metal to hang on the 3pt.

If you can find a reasonably priced boxblade, that may be all the extra weight you'd need. I know money is tight right now, but as soon as you can you need to get some weight on the rear.

Most add-on weights these days are very expensive.

Do a search in "all forums" greater than one year, or all posts, using the word ballast. You'll find all manner of ways to add weight.
John

 

[HammerFour]

You can make a 3ph ballast real easily with just some concrete, a container, and a few scraps of metal to hook to the 3ph...

 

[Soundguy]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( but it really needs something on the back end to counter weight the loader )</font>

This is my rear ballast for my ford 660.. cost me less than 15 bucks... weighs 600+#

Soundguy