how do you spread lime?

[redlevel]

How long do you have to keep grazing animals off after lime applications??????

Just so long as you don't run over them with the truck. Really, I knew someone who lost a calf to a lime truck. We often spread lime while cows are in the pasture.

 

[cityfarma]

Seriously
It's never come up before. Our soils here are are very akaline and I've never heard of someone having to spread lime. (although I hear you guys/gals talk about it back east).
So, went up to bid this lady in the mountains (about 8500 feet) and she says "nothing grows"
I say "let's do a soil test"
Ok
So, we do and the results came back.
105lbs of nitrogen per acre (which is an unbelievable number in itself) and "to raise PH to 6.5 add 4 to 5 tons of lime per acre".

I don't even know where to get it.
How do you apply it?
Teach me easterners.

Your comment " Our soils here are are very akaline " says that the pH is high and you want to add lime???? Do you actually mean the soil is acidic

Cityfarma

 

[Mike120]

Just to clarify
down here in the plains (5000/6000 feet) most of the soil is very alkaline.
But this customer is in the mountains.
All granite dust and such (it's barely soil) it makes sense that it's very acidic. (also crazy short in nitrogen, they want to add 105lbs/acre, that's HUGE)

How long do you have to keep grazing animals off after lime applications??????

I'll lime a couple of my hay fields in the fall. My fertilizer dealer applies it in 20 ton loads. I keep the animals off it and let it set over the winter and it's fine in the spring. Normally I never put down more that 2 tons/acre in an application. If you do more, you need to disc it in.

If it's all granite dust up there, you probably need organic content more than you need lime.....put down a few tons of manure per acre.

 

[AndyMA]

I've used granules which you can spead with a rotary fertilizer spreader easily and then tilled it in. The tilling seems to break some of it up and get it going faster. Also if the soil is very packed speading gypsum will break it up.

Andy

 

[cp1969]

I've never tried it but they say ag lime will not spread out of a broadcast spreader--it will just bridge over.

I had a similar problem. I had a soil test done (they're free through the county extension office here) and it came back 6.0 and they recommended adding lime. I never did get it done and had the soil tested the next year...came back 6.5; no lime needed. So I'm not sure how much faith to put in these soil tests.

If ag lime and people to spread it are scarce in your area, that must mean there is very little demand for it. If there is very little demand, that means not very many people are liming their ground. Why? If they don't need it, why does this plot of ground?

fwiw, you get ag lime at the local rock quarry. It is nothing more than the finest portion of the limestone that is crushed for gravel and is litterally cheaper than dirt. There is a term called equivalent liming factor or something like that that is associated with liming products. The soil test should have used that term and you have to adjust the amount of ag lime you put on according to its equivalent factor. But it is so cheap, it doesn't really matter. A lot of co-op's have ground-driven spreaders you can rent.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

What did you use to take the sample and how did you take the sample for your soil test?

I see people use shovels to take soil samples all the time. The problem with that is that you don't get a standard sized sample. You need to use a probe and take samples from all over the field to get an average of the entire field. Pulling one sample or using a shovel will not be very accurate for an entire field.

 

[LoneCowboy]

What did you use to take the sample and how did you take the sample for your soil test?

I see people use shovels to take soil samples all the time. The problem with that is that you don't get a standard sized sample. You need to use a probe and take samples from all over the field to get an average of the entire field. Pulling one sample or using a shovel will not be very accurate for an entire field.

Stainless steel soil sampler, 15 samples over 2.5 acres, dried and sent to the lab
like always
You keep forgetting, this is my business, this is what I do.
But this one is odd because it's IN THE MOUNTAINS (for the 14th time, I don't think some of you people (not you RinNY) don't read.
So, for the 15th time.
As a general rule, soils here in the flatlands of colorado are very alkaline. This property is IN THE MOUNTAINS and turns out to be very acidic (which makes sense), and the recommendation from COLORADO STATE UNIVERSITY (our Ag college with their testing lab) is to add 105lbs of Nitrogen per acre and 4 to 5 TONS of lime to bring the PH up to 6.5.

So, from the other useful comments on here, it appears that the co-op would have lime if anyone does, I'll call and ask today. Does anyone know for sure what the rule is on keeping grazing animals off after application of lime.

 

[Ford850]

Lc,
Since is sounds like you are dealing with fine crushed stone for soil, the rates suggested sound reasonable. I would agree with the comment that it would be better to add some organic matter too. Maybe the co-op can make a suggestion about that. Otherwise is sounds like most of the lime and fertilizer will wash out of the "soil" and you'd need to re-apply often.

 

[bkheur]

That's great Redlevel!

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Lc,
Since is sounds like you are dealing with fine crushed stone for soil, the rates suggested sound reasonable. I would agree with the comment that it would be better to add some organic matter too. Maybe the co-op can make a suggestion about that. Otherwise is sounds like most of the lime and fertilizer will wash out of the "soil" and you'd need to re-apply often.

Lime does it's work VERY slowly. In cases where high application rates are needed, it is usually best to do so in several applications. As an example, if a piece of ground requires 1 ton per acre, it may take 1200 lbs each time, applied 2 times to get the desired effect. Some of the lime will simply wash away or leach through the soil without changing the soil PH as much as it should. In MOST soils, it may take as much as several years to significantly alter soil PH. Applying far more lime at one time than the soil can absorb, and a higher volume will "go away" without achieving it's desired goal.

As far as the question of grazing on recently limed ground......Horses or cattle? I've limed pastures and put cows back on it the same day. I've been told horses need a little more time, but don't know that as gospel.

I live in the "Bluegrass State", Kentucky. It's the birthplace of Bluegrass Music, (Bill Monroe, the father of Bluegrass Music is from Ky) but the name came from a couple regions of the state where the grass appears to have a blue-ish tint at times. That's the result of naturally occuring concentrations of lime in the soil.

And we still have to lime our ground.

 

[schmism]

i think this was already mentioned but ill do a quick recap.

there is pelitzed lime which is easly put in a broad cast spredder, but relitivly expensive.

then there is "ag lime" which (my understaning) is nothing more than limestone dust, soft powdery dust. doesnt broadcast all that well. you get the cloud as seen in the pics.

either way i would expect some service to be able to do it for much cheeper than you could as indicated.

 

[Z-Michigan]

Brian - some related thoughts. When I hear about super acid, low nutrient soils I think highly leached forest soils. Is this what your customer has? What's the slope like? I'm wondering if this soil may simply be hopeless. Out of curiousity, what was the actual ph measurement? 4.5? What about trying a forage crop that grows well in highly acid soil?

Also, is there any chance that there is acid mine runoff falling into/through your customer's soil? That may be unlikely, but if there were it seems like any amount of lime would be wasted effort.

 

[LoneCowboy]

Ok
I called this one when I first went there, that it would probably not result in any work. (sometimes you just know)
But, we got the soil test done (so that pays for part of it)
She runs Alpaca's on it. (I guess the mountains don't bother them)
It's not excessively steep, but it's crowded with pine trees and cross fenced about a million times. You could never get a big buggy/truck in there. (even the small tractor is going to be a problem in spots)

Ok
So called the co-op
They have lime in pellet form. You can get it bulk, but of course you have to spread it (see above, not possible), or you can buy it in bags.
1 pallet is 50 bags is 2000lbs is 400 bucks
So, even to do half the rate (2 tons per acre) is 5 pallets is $2000 my cost in lime. Plus spreading, hauling two trailers up there (one with tractor, one with 10,000 lbs of lime)
Plus of course fertilizer.
We're talking big bucks
No way she goes for this.
oh well, learned a lot about lime.

It's overgrazed anyway.

 

[cp1969]

Pelletized lime is only practical for very small plots. Of course she would not be interested at those prices; who would? $400 per ton vs. $4 per ton for ag lime leaves a lot of room to figure out how to spread the ag lime.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

Stainless steel soil sampler, 15 samples over 2.5 acres, dried and sent to the lab
like always
You keep forgetting, this is my business, this is what I do.
But this one is odd because it's IN THE MOUNTAINS (for the 14th time, I don't think some of you people (not you RinNY) don't read.
So, for the 15th time.
As a general rule, soils here in the flatlands of colorado are very alkaline. This property is IN THE MOUNTAINS and turns out to be very acidic (which makes sense), and the recommendation from COLORADO STATE UNIVERSITY (our Ag college with their testing lab) is to add 105lbs of Nitrogen per acre and 4 to 5 TONS of lime to bring the PH up to 6.5.

So, from the other useful comments on here, it appears that the co-op would have lime if anyone does, I'll call and ask today. Does anyone know for sure what the rule is on keeping grazing animals off after application of lime.

Brian, my post you quoted was in reply to the guy who didn't put much faith in the soil samples. If you don't take proper samples you will not get proper results as you know.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

Pelletized lime is only practical for very small plots. Of course she would not be interested at those prices; who would? $400 per ton vs. $4 per ton for ag lime leaves a lot of room to figure out how to spread the ag lime.

pelletized lime is also used in vineyards around here. You drop the lime on the rows and not in the centers. This way the lime is where you need it. Of course we also have a narrow lime trailer we use if we want to spread the entire vineyard.

 

[Deerlope]

I just had 13 ton spread on 4 acres. I sure am glad that the wind was blowing away from the highway. Some drivers even slowed thinking something was on fire.

 

[LoneCowboy]

Pelletized lime is only practical for very small plots. Of course she would not be interested at those prices; who would? $400 per ton vs. $4 per ton for ag lime leaves a lot of room to figure out how to spread the ag lime.

I got the impression (from talking with the co-op guy), i could get the pelletized lime in either bags or bulk. no other way.
Lime isn't big at all around here, like I said, it's mostly alkaline around here.

Wouldn't matter anyway, you can't get a big truck up there, it's all woods and little tiny cross fenced areas.

 

[N80]

She's got herself a real pile of acid up there. The soil here is known to be acidic and has high lime requirements and I've never heard of lime requirements that high. I may be one of the one the ones that doesn't read very well but did the Ag Dept give you an actual pH reading?

It looks like this lady has limited options. Someone mentioned that Ag lime was $150 a ton, at 4 tons thats $600. So it might be worth paying to have someone bring it in even if its a long way off. But, as mentioned, I always heard it doesn't spread well in a funnel type spreader....just thinking out loud here....but it would seem that this lady is screwed. She is either going to have something that will grow in acid...or feed those llamas or whatever something besides grass.

Sounds like she needs to get out of the livestock business and open a quarry.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

Depending on the type of ground, what has been on it, what is going on it and how it has been maintained it is not uncommon for this area to require 4-6 ton per acre on some ground. But there are a lot of different types of ground here and the requirements can vary a lot.