I'm Done With Branson

[EddieWalker]

Dave, do you know what happened to the owners manuals that used to be available online? I have a 2003 Century 2535 that I bought from a dealer that gave up on Branson when three other dealers opened up in a ten mile radius. Big Red is where I get my parts online, but it's very hard finding them, and so far, impossible to find an electrical schematic.

 

[LouNY]

Hello Dave from Daves Tractor;
I have seen quite a few posts on here from you, I'm glad that you are staying on top of things.
I have been fairly well pleased with my Branson dealer also J.C. Tractors and Restoration in Hoosick, NY.
As far as Branson responding to customers, they sure as **** do not!!!
I had some questions that my dealer couldn't answer and he seemed to get no response from Branson also.
As far as the parts availability Branson removed the parts look up from the customer access of there web site,
I can go to the New Holland/ Ford or the IH or CNH or John Deere web sites and find all the parts break downs and exploded drawings
which not only gets me the parts numbers but will also link to the dealers parts and will even price them out for me or anyone.
The exploded drawings are a great help when working on equipment. Manuals, are Branson manuals available for purchase? It doesn't seem like it.
I spent quite a bit of money on my Branson as I purchased a new 8050 it was around $45,000,
a New Holland was going to be over 50,000 equipped similarly.
I contacted Branson directly after going to my dealer the first winter I had the tractor as it was almost unusable,
The dealer had installed a lower radiator hose heater which didnt' work very well, my tractor would not start when it was cold,
the starter was not strong enough, it would crankover about 2 revolutions and stop cranking, boosters would make no difference.
I came to the conclusion that it was hydraulic locking itself, either engine oil, or the main hydraulic pumps, or the internal transmission pump;
I switched to Rotella T6 synthetic motor oil and Cen-Pe-Co hytran, unfortunately I changed them both at the same service time
so i'm not sure which one did the most good, I suspect the transmission fluid change was what cured the no start condition.
But, Branson USA was absolutely worthless when I was sitting there unable to start a tractor to clear snow with in the winter.

 

[DavesTractor]

Dave, do you know what happened to the owners manuals that used to be available online? I have a 2003 Century 2535 that I bought from a dealer that gave up on Branson when three other dealers opened up in a ten mile radius. Big Red is where I get my parts online, but it's very hard finding them, and so far, impossible to find an electrical schematic.

Eddie, I don't know why they do not have owner's manuals online, in fact I'd sure like it if all equipment did. Big Red is often the #1 Branson dealer in the USA. From my dealings with the owner and visiting with them at meetings and such, they seem top notch. I might be able to find you an electrical schematic. I think we kept shop manuals on most all common models going back to the early days. I'll look when I get a little time.

 

[DavesTractor]

Hello Dave from Daves Tractor;
I have seen quite a few posts on here from you, I'm glad that you are staying on top of things.
I have been fairly well pleased with my Branson dealer also J.C. Tractors and Restoration in Hoosick, NY.
As far as Branson responding to customers, they sure as **** do not!!!
I had some questions that my dealer couldn't answer and he seemed to get no response from Branson also.
As far as the parts availability Branson removed the parts look up from the customer access of there web site,
I can go to the New Holland/ Ford or the IH or CNH or John Deere web sites and find all the parts break downs and exploded drawings
which not only gets me the parts numbers but will also link to the dealers parts and will even price them out for me or anyone.
The exploded drawings are a great help when working on equipment. Manuals, are Branson manuals available for purchase? It doesn't seem like it.
I spent quite a bit of money on my Branson as I purchased a new 8050 it was around $45,000,
a New Holland was going to be over 50,000 equipped similarly.
I contacted Branson directly after going to my dealer the first winter I had the tractor as it was almost unusable,
The dealer had installed a lower radiator hose heater which didnt' work very well, my tractor would not start when it was cold,
the starter was not strong enough, it would crankover about 2 revolutions and stop cranking, boosters would make no difference.
I came to the conclusion that it was hydraulic locking itself, either engine oil, or the main hydraulic pumps, or the internal transmission pump;
I switched to Rotella T6 synthetic motor oil and Cen-Pe-Co hytran, unfortunately I changed them both at the same service time
so i'm not sure which one did the most good, I suspect the transmission fluid change was what cured the no start condition.
But, Branson USA was absolutely worthless when I was sitting there unable to start a tractor to clear snow with in the winter.

I won't defend the lack of communication from Branson to their customers. I know they have been growing and are short staffed, but that can only be a valid excuse for a very short time. Because you add staff when a problem like that exists for any period of time, and meanwhile you work overtime.

I'd have to check with our parts department and see if there is a parts lookup available online. There was, and then the website had a change and it was taken down. I assumed it would be put back up. I'll ask someone in our parts department. Edit: I just talked to parts, and as far as they know Branson is not planning to put the parts look-up back on line anytime soon. I do not know the reasoning. I really like part look-up as it saves us time as well. I'm not sure of the downside, maybe a dealer will chime in that understands the reasoning.

As far as heaters, we sell pretty much every Branson with a factory block heater that goes right into the block. They are about $1000, a no brainer even if you live in an area that seldom gets cold. On the 8050, we have never sold one. They did not get that tractor (8050) California approved, so for the last few years it has been 55 HP maximum for us on Bransons. We sell other brands, so no big deal.

In cold weather, which I probably should not even speak about living where I do, you have diminished battery power just when you need the most power. And like you are saying, when you crank a cold engine you are also trying to push cold hydraulic fluid through the pumps. Then of course you need nice hot glow plugs which rob what little battery power you have. But this isn't a new problem, it was that way 10 years ago and 20 years ago, etc. No excuse for a tractor to not be able to start well in reasonably cold weather. I have family in Alaska with equipment, and they have a lot of things that they do to their rigs to make them usable in the winter. They would not expect a tractor to start well without a coolant heater, oil heater, battery blanket and so on. And when it is super cold, a heated shop is the best answer. But I am out of my realm of knowledge, our average high temp in the summer in Red Bluff is 99 degrees. Extreme cold to me means I need a sweatshirt.

We have found Branson to be getting better and better in the last 3 years about parts and about communication. But every once in a while we still have a "your kidding?" moment. Like maybe a new model will arrive and we have no manual. So we sell the tractor with a manual for the previous "close" model for a while. Really? But for the most part they are so much better. And of course you can't tell if they don't answer your calls, but they are the nicest folks. They truly are. They treat their dealers very well as evidenced by the dealer surveys each year.

 

[EddieWalker]

Eddie, I don't know why they do not have owner's manuals online, in fact I'd sure like it if all equipment did. Big Red is often the #1 Branson dealer in the USA. From my dealings with the owner and visiting with them at meetings and such, they seem top notch. I might be able to find you an electrical schematic. I think we kept shop manuals on most all common models going back to the early days. I'll look when I get a little time.

Thank you. I'm trying to figure it out from a manual sent to me for a Branson 3015/3515/4015 which is probably nothing close to my Century 2535. I believe the Branson 3510 is either the same thing as my 2535, or maybe even the same thing, but I can't find a manual for one of those either.

My problem is that I'm totally dead at the key. I have 13 volts at the battery and the starter, but nowhere else. Nothing at the key, nothing along the way that I've tested so far. It was running all morning without issue. I turned it off to refill my sprayer tank, and when I tried to start it, nothing.

 

[LouNY]

Thanks for the reply, maybe I should have mentioned that I have been starting tractors in the cold for awhile,
From hand cranking an Allis Chalmers WD, Farmall 400, 560 ( all gasers) in the early 60's, Our first diesel was in 68 a 8000 Ford,
then it was numerous mostly red,574, 1066, 1086, IH hydro, IH Magnums, a little green 4020, 4440, then of course the good green an Oliver 1550.
I traded the old 1550 towards the Branson, that old Waukasha diesel with a manifold heater(same style as the Branson 8050)
would start right down to single digits without being plugged in.
The 8050 without the expensive lubricants would not start in the teens with brand new battery, booster cables to running pickups, even with starting boost from chargers,
The starter just does not have the power, when it would crank it would be a couple of revolutions and then a dead stop, wait a half an hour and it would be the same,
it just needs more starter then the little 2.2 KW they put on it.
also I do like my tractor, it a nice sized unit, it does an excellent job on my driveway plowing snow, loading sand in a sander and grading and ditching, the economy speed PTO works
very good for the generators, tedding hay, brush hogging( light to moderate)
ThanksLou

 

[DavesTractor]

Thanks for the reply, maybe I should have mentioned that I have been starting tractors in the cold for awhile,
From hand cranking an Allis Chalmers WD, Farmall 400, 560 ( all gasers) in the early 60's, Our first diesel was in 68 a 8000 Ford,
then it was numerous mostly red,574, 1066, 1086, IH hydro, IH Magnums, a little green 4020, 4440, then of course the good green an Oliver 1550.
I traded the old 1550 towards the Branson, that old Waukasha diesel with a manifold heater(same style as the Branson 8050)
would start right down to single digits without being plugged in.
The 8050 without the expensive lubricants would not start in the teens with brand new battery, booster cables to running pickups, even with starting boost from chargers,
The starter just does not have the power, when it would crank it would be a couple of revolutions and then a dead stop, wait a half an hour and it would be the same,
it just needs more starter then the little 2.2 KW they put on it.
also I do like my tractor, it a nice sized unit, it does an excellent job on my driveway plowing snow, loading sand in a sander and grading and ditching, the economy speed PTO works
very good for the generators, tedding hay, brush hogging( light to moderate)
ThanksLou

Yes I'd say you have a little experience! Sounds like you totally have this figured out regarding the shortcoming in starting cold. That is interesting. I bet a guy could get a more powerful starter that would fit it. Then make sure the battery cables were adequate, etc.

 

[DavesTractor]

Thank you. I'm trying to figure it out from a manual sent to me for a Branson 3015/3515/4015 which is probably nothing close to my Century 2535. I believe the Branson 3510 is either the same thing as my 2535, or maybe even the same thing, but I can't find a manual for one of those either.

My problem is that I'm totally dead at the key. I have 13 volts at the battery and the starter, but nowhere else. Nothing at the key, nothing along the way that I've tested so far. It was running all morning without issue. I turned it off to refill my sprayer tank, and when I tried to start it, nothing.

The 15 series are very unlike your tractor. They may have similar wiring, perhaps, but the old 3510/3520 would be dead bang on. I will check tomorrow. If we do not have a wiring schematic, I'll ask my service manager for some advice. Most tractors have power at the key all the time and the safeties are in line after it. If a safety has failed or is doing it's job, you should get lights on the dash but no crank. If you have no lights on the dash or elsewhere I would suspect a fusible link that is well hidden. Some tractors have a fuse by the starter that powers everything, or a fusible link. I'll help you sort this out, but my guys are gone for the day.

I'll be back in touch. Dave

 

[LARRY0071]

Dave, I really like your customers service oriented response. It show's that you still have a good customer service attitude about things. I commend you in your attitude. And you are right, it is mainly the other Branson dealers out there. Yet Branson needs to stand up and make a few changes in requiring the dealers out there to do a little better. As you already know, and I might add are smart enough, parts availability can be the making or breaking of a company. I would hate to see Branson going by the way side in the future because of this parts issue. Thay make a fine tractor and at a more reasonable price than most. Mine is a 2005 3510. I have worked the bejesus out of it throughout the first 10 years and I have had only 2 real problems. A fuel pump issue which I replace with a aftermarket one with a metal plunger in it instead of the one from Branson which has a plastic plunger. Nut in all fairness it lasted 5 or six years. The other was a couple of electrical problems with some connectors. They caused starting problems and was difficult to find and fix, especially with the wiring so very tight. Branson and all tractors alike have some little design flaws which are a little aggravating and unique to their brand (just like cars), however It is overall a really good tractor. It is dependable abd very strong. Thank you for your post it was excellent.

 

[LARRY0071]

I had this same problem once on my 3510. Dave is absolutely correct there is a fusible link there. Also check your wiring connecting block for any signs if a short or loose wire/ There is also a starter relay underneath the dash. My problem was a combination of a bad connection in the wiring block which shorted and killed both the fusible link and fried the starter relay. Hope this helps.....