I'm going to court this week

   / I'm going to court this week #41  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

and the winners are!!!!!!!

your lawyer will have your money, the plantiff's lawyer will have their money. there'll still be two pissed off neighbors.
the winners, THE LAWYERS.
 
   / I'm going to court this week #42  
Re: The latest news

Yes Gary......Whats happening now ?

I can't stand the suspense /w3tcompact/icons/crazy.gif
 
   / I'm going to court this week #43  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

Gee, you know I hate to sound too much like a Canadian, but based on this post and a few others I've read, it strikes me youse guys got too many lawyers!
 
   / I'm going to court this week #44  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

Brian, a law teacher I know told me this. For every lawyer out there, there is a client standing behind them saying "it's only for the principle".
 
   / I'm going to court this week #45  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

<font color=blue>.....it strikes me youse guys got too many lawyers!</font color=blue>

You are absolutely correct. Lawyers are in the process of doing to this country what no enemy has ever been able to do.
 
   / I'm going to court this week
  • Thread Starter
#46  
Re: The latest news

OK, here's the latest. I was deposed Tuesday AM and the other atty. seemed somewhat unprepared. At one point he literally looked through every page of a 9" high pile of paper looking for something he never did find. He then tried to cover by asking me to explain the document for the record and I simply told him the document speaks for itself and requires no further explanation or elaboration and that to attempt to do so would be unfair and only cloud the issue.

He asked about the deed to my land and if I recorded it (I did). When I said I believed I did he pursued it further. I then said, "Well, the way you're asking this makes me less confident than a minute ago. Do you know for sure?" He then said rather smugly that he had been unable to find it in his search of the records I replied, "Well, then, it would seem that either I'm wrong or your search wasn't as thorough as it should have been, then wouldn't it?"

All in all, the deposition went well enough and now it's just a matter of waiting once again. If they don't come up with about $10,000 to cover the redemption of the tax sale certificate I hold by the thirteenth most of this won't matter. I'm pretty sure they'll pony up the money unless they try to negotiate a settlement sooner than that.

Right now I'm going to have to wait for that and to see if our response to their request for the restraining order works or not. If the TRO is issued then it'll be more fun in court, I guess. I'll keep you posted. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
 
   / I'm going to court this week #47  
Re: The latest news

Gary,

Good luck. There is always someone out there looking to take something that is not theirs, and they most definitely know it. I look forward to the post saying they lost, you won and now they are outta there.
 
   / I'm going to court this week #48  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

My son the lawyer would agree with you on that one. Too many at least that do not try to solve the problem but become part of it.
 
   / I'm going to court this week
  • Thread Starter
#49  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

<font color=blue>"youse guys got too many lawyers!"</font color=blue>

You might want to look at my bio for a little chuckle about that. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
 
   / I'm going to court this week #50  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

Oh, don't get me wrong. The world needs lawyers. Its just that when things get to the point they are now, when the first thing you do after you fall down is call a lawyer, things are pretty grim. It is all part of the trend towards a culture of victimhood: a class action suit could be a great way of addressing a willful wrong done by a manufacturer, but more and more its about the 40 to 60% + expenses take for the lawyers.
In fact many shareholders suits are rarely end up settled on behalf of the 'plaintiffs', but rather for the exhoritant legal expense 'earned' by 'their' lawyers. Thats not justice, thats extortion.
Its starting to happen in the snowy north to.
 
   / I'm going to court this week #51  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

I would go to jail. I'm sorry but if someone THOUGHT they had the right to my stuff/building ...I would set painful booby traps or shoot somebody's [censored] ( if I caught them ) and I would catch them. If this is a tax lien you bought and THEY owe YOU then there would be at least 25% interest for the weenies...na na na na !!!
 
   / I'm going to court this week
  • Thread Starter
#52  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

I'm not sure you fully understand either the situation or the law here. Let me try to be more clear.

There are two pieces of property involved. One I own free and clear. It was bought off a larger parcel. Later, I acquired a mortgage against the balance of the larger parcel. Later still, I instituted foreclosure proceedings on that mortgage. Lastly, to protect my mortgage interest in that parcel I bought a tax sale certificate on that property.

The owner (more accurately, his agent) claimed I was trespassing on the parcel he owns. In fact, I was on my land and not his. I addressed that in the answer to their motion for a restraining order.

I think that will preclude any moves on their part to enter my barn, etc. At the very least it puts them on notice that there is a dispute as to ownership so I'm sure their attorney cautioned them about that.

As to your mention of booby traps, etc., they are patently illegal. I would never, ever do something like that regardless simply because of the danger to innocent visitors, children, animals, etc. Legally, the liability doing something like that would place on me is almost incalculable. My liability insurance carrier would deny coverage because it was an intentional act. I could lose everything I have plus risk prison. No thanks. I can always buy more stuff.

The tax lein certificate situation in Indiana is different from what you describe, too. As a tax sale certificate buyer I'm entitled to a 10% premium over the tax bill amount if the certificate is redeemed anytime withing six months of the sale. At six months and one day that increases to a 15% premium. Additionally, there is statutory interest at the rate of 10% APR on the amount paid for the tax sale certificate which is earned during whatever time the certificate is unredeemed. That same 10% APR also applies to any subsequent monies paid on property taxes and assessments on that property which are then added to the amount of the tax sale certificate. That interest accrues beginning the day they are paid and running through the day the certificate would be redeemed

In an "overbid" situation (when the certificate is bid up for an amount greater than the tas bill) the amount of the "overbid" also earns interest at the statutory rate of 10% APR.

An example would be a tax bill of $1,000 and a high bid on that certificate of $5,000. On that the premium amounts (the 10% or 15%) would only apply to the $1,000 while the 10% APR interest would apply to the entire $5,000.

The mortgage and the tax lein are totally separate and distinct issues. Neither, however, give me any rights whatsoever to enter the property which would be the subject of either or both of those situations.
 
   / I'm going to court this week #53  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

Ok so let me see if I can condense this scenerio. A looser DONT pay his tax bill, you buy the tax bill, you have NO rights to the property,you also hold a mortgage on the property, he defaults, you have no rights, he has rights. ok so why do we vote lawmakers into office who write laws for scumbags and decent people like us get stuck with less money for our tax paying families. maybe the lawmakers are lawyers. more money for litigation ? sounds about right.
 
   / I'm going to court this week
  • Thread Starter
#54  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

Actually, the parts of this situation you mention are as they should be. Just because I purchased the tax sale certificate doesn't mean I have any rights to the property itself. The certificate I hold is simply a lein against the real estate, not unlike a mortgage. Even if you owe money on your property the person holding the mortgage has no rights to your property. If that tax sale certificate goes unredeemed for for the statutory period then a sheriffs deed to the propety is give to the certificate holder. With that comes a whole bundle of rights to the property, including ownership. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Until that time, however, I have no rights to enter or use the property because I don't own it and that is as it should be.

As it happens, I also hold the first mortgage against the property. As you stated, the payments on the underlying obligations are in default. Because of that I have certain rights and I am exercising them. I have sued to foreclose. I have no rights to the property at this juncture just because I've done that. I have to win that foreclosure suit and the property has to be put up for sale to satisfy my mortgage. If and only if I am the successful bidder at that auction would I be issued a sheriff's deed giving me title.

Again, this is as it should be. While I wish it were quicker and less expensive, it's not. I just have to play the cards I'm dealt here. I hope this explains things better for you.
 
   / I'm going to court this week #55  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

yes Gary I do understand....I wouldnt want someone comming in to my home IF I had a bad month and was a little behind...i havent been behind since the early 90's. I DONT understand why YOU would have to Buy the property you hold mortgage on...iis the mortgage amount added automatically to your bid ?? the reason I ask is I am interested in RE investment...no more rental properties though. I went through the " you have no right to be here " when I had rental property...the renters know more about how to live for free than we do.. man if they would put THAT much effort into theier OWN business....
 
   / I'm going to court this week
  • Thread Starter
#56  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

<font color=blue>"I DONT understand why YOU would have to buy the property you hold mortgage on...is the mortgage amount added automatically to your bid?"</font color=blue>

OK, here's the scoop. Foreclosing on a mortgage merely allows you to force the sale of the property to satisfy your mortgage amount. At that sale, you can bid up to your mortgage amount without using any real money, just the amount you're already owed.

For example, let's say I hold a $50,000 mortgage on your property and you're in default so I foreclose. There is a sheriff's sale and I put in my bid of $50,000. If no one outbids me, I get the property for that bid, which is already "paid" by my outstanding mortgage amount. At that point, you owe me nothing more and I owe you nothing more. We're even.

Now let's say in the same scenario I only bid $30,000 and no one outbids me. I own the property and can still pursue you for the other $20,000.

The last option is if I or someone else bids, say... $70,000. Then the first $50,000 goes to me for my mortgage and the additional $20,000 goes to you (or any other secured creditor like a second mortgage holder). In this scenario, if I were the $70,000 bidder, I'd only have to come up with $20,000 in real money because I already get credit for the $50,000 mortgage.

I know this was long, but I wanted to cover all the options for you. I hope I've explained it adequately. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
 
   / I'm going to court this week #57  
Re: I\'m going to court this week

Excellent explanation. I too was confused with your predicament. Now - crystal clear. Thanks.
 

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