Inconsiderate drivers and tractor operators, bad mix...

[MossRoad]

That's beside the point...actually it's moot...
Depending on the market it could just rot...in other scenarios it could adversely effect the market and hurt the smaller hay farmers that actually need the income to survive...

There are many large land owners that ONLY produce hay to save on property taxes...they don't need the income and many just lease the land to actual farmers that do all the work...it's a big scam...they like to call themselves "farmers" but in reality they are just cheating the system via technicalities and loopholes...

Then that would apply to all that cash rent farmland to anyone, wouldn't it?

 

[Hay Dude]

I didn't bother reading the majority of the thread...but did anyone mention the number of folks that call themselves "farmers" who other than maybe a kitchen garden only grow grass and cut it for hay ONLY to keep their agriculture tax classification...they want to own large tracts but cut hay to keep from having to pay the premium in taxes for owning said tracts...?

Reprehensible. A loophole that should be closed.
I live on 3 acres, but farm about 500 for wealthy land owners and conservancies who know nothing about farming. I dont know what, if anything, they do with their tax loopholes. I just make hay on their property, run some cattle on another tract, and sell hay for the same price I sold it for in the 90s.

One thing I do know about owning large tracts of land in PA, you get an ACT 515 or 319 property tax rebate if your >10 acres of land is farmed as a field of hay, or cut with a mower as a field of grass. It’s the development rights you lose for the tax deferment. As far as I know, farming of the land not required.

 

[K5lwq]

I can think of a lot of other loopholes that would be much easier than hay. Maybe a bee hive or two? Plant a couple of trees for timber one day? Wonder why they would choose hay?

 

[5030]

I didn't bother reading the majority of the thread...but did anyone mention the number of folks that call themselves "farmers" who other than maybe a kitchen garden only grow grass and cut it for hay ONLY to keep their agriculture tax classification...they want to own large tracts but cut hay to keep from having to pay the premium in taxes for owning said tracts...?

Maybe you should (read all the posts). There are a number of us commenting that are NOT hobby farmers, I'm one. I have a sizable investment in equipment and yes, I'm incorporated, well, it's an LLC at any rate and yes I grow hay and harvest it and every bale is sold. In fact mine is usually sold before I even cut it. It's NOT a hobby. It's an income and yes, my ground is in PA116 which, here in Michigan is the reduced tax rate for AG ground and yes, I have to report all my data to the UDSA as well.

Why would I pay a residential rate on land with no houses on it? Makes no sense to me but then, it's a business, not a hobby.

You obviously know nothing about growing commercial forage for profit. Better keep mowing your lawn and be happy with that.

As usual, way off topic.

 

[Hay Dude]

I can think of a lot of other loopholes that would be much easier than hay. Maybe a bee hive or two? Plant a couple of trees for timber one day? Wonder why they would choose hay?

Yep, hay don’t pay......
You have to love it to do it. I also have cows, build garages, barns & homes and have a property maintenance business.

 

[Fuddy1952]

There are two sides to the ag/hay use also.
Years ago land in an area may be valued at, say, $1,000/acre. All is well until people move in from N.Y., California and pay $50,000/acre. Now the guy who had a small 40 acre place his tax assessment goes from $40K to $2Mil!!! His taxes go up proportionately.
Is he cheating the system by raising a few cows or hay? No way could he afford taxes on that high rate through no fault of his own.
Should he move?

 

[Hay Dude]

I seen people with large parcels of farm land get ready to sell out for millions only to have some jealous jerk off throw 10 bog turtles on a little of their wetland and then the parcel has to have a $100,000 wildlife study and get held up for a year.
Not much I haven’t seen. Dirty politics, jealousy, permits withheld, you name it. I’ve provided professional testimony in court cases several times.
Anyway, off topic.

 

[5030]

Reprehensible. A loophole that should be closed.
I live on 3 acres, but farm about 500 for wealthy land owners and conservancies who know nothing about farming. I dont know what, if anything, they do with their tax loopholes. I just make hay on their property, run some cattle on another tract, and sell hay for the same price I sold it for in the 90s.

One thing I do know about owning large tracts of land in PA, you get an ACT 515 or 319 property tax rebate if your >10 acres of land is farmed as a field of hay, or cut with a mower as a field of grass. It’s the development rights you lose for the tax deferment. As far as I know, farming of the land not required.

Maybe I should sub divide the farm and sell it to developers and take the ground out of production and pocket the money. The American way.

Don't believe I could have steers on 3 acres though. Might have an issue with my neighbors after the developers I sold the ground to build those 300 grand 'country estates' that city people want to move into but son't want the manure stink or the sound of farm equipment or anything country like but they want the 'rural' atmosphere.

Had that issue with a neighbor on a tract I rent. They didn't like me spreading cow manure, said the stink irritated them. Guess who won..... Under Michigan RTF, I have to incorporate manure within 48 hours of spreading, so long as the weather is conducive. Last time I did that field, I watched the weather and spread it in advance of a weeks worth of rain. I'm sure they enjoyed every minute of it. I know I did.

Not withstanding, none of that has anything to do with poor driving habits and moving AG equipment on secondary roads. People are in way to big of a hurry today. Still haven't figured out what the rush is all about.

We all get to die at some point, why rush that because of stupidity.

 

[/pine]

Maybe you should (read all the posts). There are a number of us commenting that are NOT hobby farmers, I'm one. I have a sizable investment in equipment and yes, I'm incorporated, well, it's an LLC at any rate and yes I grow hay and harvest it and every bale is sold. In fact mine is usually sold before I even cut it. It's NOT a hobby. It's an income and yes, my ground is in PA116 which, here in Michigan is the reduced tax rate for AG ground and yes, I have to report all my data to the UDSA as well.

Why would I pay a residential rate on land with no houses on it? Makes no sense to me but then, it's a business, not a hobby.

You obviously know nothing about growing commercial forage for profit. Better keep mowing your lawn and be happy with that.

As usual, way off topic.

LoL...you contradict yourself (as usual)....first you say I should read all the posts because many comments are from not "hobby farmers"...when the actual topic is "inconsiderate drivers and tractor operators" [sic]...and then you try to tell me that my posts are off topic...too funny...!

LoL...Just like I said...the percentage of farmers that are jerks and knuckleheads is the same as any other profession...too funny...!

 

[4570Man]

Maybe I should sub divide the farm and sell it to developers and take the ground out of production and pocket the money. The American way.

Don't believe I could have steers on 3 acres though. Might have an issue with my neighbors after the developers I sold the ground to build those 300 grand 'country estates' that city people want to move into but son't want the manure stink or the sound of farm equipment or anything country like but they want the 'rural' atmosphere.

Had that issue with a neighbor on a tract I rent. They didn't like me spreading cow manure, said the stink irritated them. Guess who won..... Under Michigan RTF, I have to incorporate manure within 48 hours of spreading, so long as the weather is conducive. Last time I did that field, I watched the weather and spread it in advance of a weeks worth of rain. I'm sure they enjoyed every minute of it. I know I did.

Not withstanding, none of that has anything to do with poor driving habits and moving AG equipment on secondary roads. People are in way to big of a hurry today. Still haven't figured out what the rush is all about.

We all get to die at some point, why rush that because of stupidity.

I’d love to have a farm to subdivide off. Finding land to build on is a huge problem here.