"It's Easier to Bury a Tradition Than a Child"

[N80]

EXCUSE ME....YOU were the one who started commenting on skydiving...NOT ME

That was my mistake. I thought you sky dived. I guess it is scuba diving that you do and not sky diving. And 'tydp' brought that up, not me. But that's irrelevant. Scuba diving for sport has its own risks and who brings it up really doesn't matter. Again, the point is that many activities involve elective risk taking and making blanket statements about any of those activities is just not sound.

And you are the one who supported the idea that riders on a tractor were NOT DANGEROUS...

Well, no, I didn't. Please read again. To summarize my position, I've basically acknowledged that some folks do it and that I have carried a passenger rarely (a young man, not a child) and that in general I would not recommend the practice. At the same time I refuse to join any sort of campaign or support a slogan that attempts to make a blanket judgement on the topic.

 

[turbo36]

At the same time I refuse to join any sort of campaign or support a slogan that attempts to make a blanket judgement on the topic.

Why not? What is wrong with promoting safe behavior? Do you as a doctor give advice to your patients about good health practices or do you just patch up and send them out again at their own peril?

(edited for spelling)

 

[N80]

Either I'm not expressing myself well (very probable) or some of you aren't getting the fine distinction here (reasonably probable).

There is a difference between explaining the risks of a potentially dangerous behavior and proscribing the behavior completely. In other words, if someone asks me what I think about carrying a child on a tractor I would tell them that most tractors are not made to haul passengers and explain the hazards of the practice and generally recommend that they don't do it. I would not, on the other hand, quote a catchy slogan about burying a child and tell them that no one should ever, under any circumstances do it.

Do you see the distinction?

Let's use another example. There is a well known stat in the pediatirc community that children who live in homes where guns are stored are umpteen more times as likely to be killed or injured by a gun shot wound as children who live in homes without guns. So, should I tell every parent that I see to make sure they get every gun they own out of the home? Of course not. That would be an unreasonable blanket statement that would not take into account inummerable variables and lifestyles. Yet, if I did make that statement, and every parent followed it, fewer children would be killed by gunshot wounds. But that rational conclusion still cannot justify removing guns from every home in which children lived.

That's all I'm trying to say. Just common sense.

If someone asks if they should play Russian roulette with a loaded automatic or bath with a plugged in toaster, than I would issue a blanket warning suggesting that they never do such a thing. See the difference?

 

[SkyPup]

Hundreds more kids died in their cribs in their own bedroom than died on their family tractors.....


WASHINGTON (2/28/2008) - Parents are putting their babies at risk when they place pillows and other soft bedding in their cribs, the Consumer Product Safety Commission warned Thursday.
From 2002 to 2004, 241 children under age 5 died in incidents involving nursery products. About 40 percent of the deaths involved cribs, with soft bedding cited as the leading contributing factor. Many of the children suffocated when lying face down on pillows or other bedding, the agency said.

Crowded cribs linked to baby deaths - Yahoo! News

 

[turbo36]

Hundreds more kids died in their cribs in their own bedroom than died on their family tractors.....


WASHINGTON (2/28/2008) - Parents are putting their babies at risk when they place pillows and other soft bedding in their cribs, the Consumer Product Safety Commission warned Thursday.
From 2002 to 2004, 241 children under age 5 died in incidents involving nursery products. About 40 percent of the deaths involved cribs, with soft bedding cited as the leading contributing factor. Many of the children suffocated when lying face down on pillows or other bedding, the agency said.

Crowded cribs linked to baby deaths - Yahoo! News

So what's your point? Or is it "cite a random statistic day" and I didn't get a notice???

 

[gemini5362]

let me toss a new idea into this topic. What about the degree of risk. If my grandaughter comes over and wants to ride with grandpa in his cab tractor. I put her in the tractor on my lap and slowly ride around a nice level yard till she gets tired of it. I do not take her with me brushhogging on the pond banks. Nor would I take her out when I am doing something with trees ( i would say what but that is another thou shalt not do according to other posts) I feel I can safely take her on a ride on level ground with her in the cab with me and give her the satisfaction of getting to ride the tractor with grandpaw. Is that going to be considered an unsafe practice ?

 

[N80]

So what's your point? Or is it "cite a random statistic day" and I didn't get a notice???

I just looked at the calendar and it IS "Cite a Random Statistic Day"! But apparently only 2.5% of the population even knows that there is a CRS Day.

Gemini5362, that is sort of the point of contention we have here. Tractor manuals uniformly warn against carrying passengers. People, including children do get hurt because they were passengers on tractors. But some of us contend that there can be reason for and ways of doing it that make it no more, or even less risky than a lot of activities we take for granted as 'perfectly' safe.

And I got to thinking about what I have let my 17 year old son do on occasion, which is riding while standing on the lift arms and holding onto the ROPS. No implement attached, maybe a box blade, which is then what he stands on. To me, this seems relatively safe. Certainly safer than riding a bike or a skateboard. Certainly as safe as riding in the back of a pickup (off road), or in the old jeeps my B-I-L uses on his farm that have no roll bars. And in fact, riding on the lift arms seems no more dangerous than riding in a wagon being pulled by a tractor (which is virtually a rural American pastime in the fall of the year). You can fall off the lift arms, or out the back of a wagon, but there is nothing to roll over you if you do take a tumble.

Just another way, with its own limited risks, that carrying a passenger can be done without rising to the level of 'death wish'.

Certainly the age of the passenger has to be taken into account in any of these scenarios.

I think the problem comes down to operator common sense and awareness. Those deficient in either one would be best not to be on a tractor in the first place and are going to be prone to hurting themselves or someone else in any activity with inherent risk.

Unfortunately, they are unlikely to visit safety discussions or be impressed by safety slogans.

 

[Rara Avis]

let me toss a new idea into this topic. What about the degree of risk. If my grandaughter comes over and wants to ride with grandpa in his cab tractor. I put her in the tractor on my lap and slowly ride around a nice level yard till she gets tired of it. I do not take her with me brushhogging on the pond banks. Nor would I take her out when I am doing something with trees ( i would say what but that is another thou shalt not do according to other posts) I feel I can safely take her on a ride on level ground with her in the cab with me and give her the satisfaction of getting to ride the tractor with grandpaw. Is that going to be considered an unsafe practice ?

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/safety/114000-its-easier-bury-tradition-than-3.html#post1312702

 

[SkyPup]

So what's your point? Or is it "cite a random statistic day" and I didn't get a notice???

Point is life is dangerous and it always ends, now live with it....

 

[turbo36]

Point is life is dangerous and it always ends, now live with it....

Now that is just lame, normally you can at least put a little logic in your posts.